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apart from some of the idiocy, i've actually learned a couple interesting things about sentry of late. separating the BS from the fact is...not easy.

anyway, NO MORE SENTRY...?

Originally posted by leonidas

anyway, NO MORE SENTRY...?

It's actually interesting.

Scarlet Witch did affect the Sentry with her power. He was in a reality, where he was just a regular guy, who had a son. So a good life for him, one would assume... but he was still seeing a therapist, because he was still dealing with the Void.

So if you want to really, really, really make a case for the Sentry... you could say, that his mind was still fighting against the new reality created by HOM Scarlet Witch. His inner demons were still pushing through.
And that was before he himself had realized what he was actually capable of. So it MAY be a toss up, if HOM Scarlet Witch could affect current Sentry for good with her reality warp. And then there is always the insane speed difference and the danger of her ending like Morgan le Fay, who got her head ripped off by him, before she could react.

But I would personally say, that "no more Sentry" should do the trick most of the time.

Right now I'm interesting in the upcoming Thanos issue, where Thanos attacks Earth, while Sentry is one of the heroes, who fight back.
Seeing how pretty much all other Avengers died and actually got eaten by Hulk (in the most recent Thanos issue), I'm curious if Sentry will somehow get beaten as well on panel / treated like an unimportant extra, or if we will see more there. Since Donny Cates likes the Sentry and has him in the Doctor Strange book as well... and now has him on at least one panel in a Thanos comic... I'm really curious where this will go.

Which panel?

Yeah, where did he appear?

Originally posted by leonidas
apart from some of the idiocy, i've actually learned a couple interesting things about sentry of late. separating the BS from the fact is...not easy.

anyway, NO MORE SENTRY...?

On the other hand, did he not mindwipe her (I know it wasn't HoM, but iirc, her to resistance didn't go up) along with everyone else?

Originally posted by Sin I AM

Which panel?

Originally posted by Damborgson

Yeah, where did he appear?

https://imgur.com/a/Un1an

Originally posted by Enzeru
https://imgur.com/a/Un1an

I thought u meant he was in Thanos book

Originally posted by Sin I AM
I thought u meant he was in Thanos book

Oh. Yeah, he was in the preview for Thanos #16, which will come out on the 28th of February:

https://i.imgur.com/TJIZlYf.jpg

That series is a Thanos fans wet dream.

Originally posted by Damborgson
That series is a Thanos fans wet dream.

Thinking about jumping on the bandwagon bro? I know you want to.

Sentry rips her in half.

I'm going with Wanda. I've always felt it would take some powerful mystic to down Bob for good.

Originally posted by Enzeru
Oh. Yeah, he was in the preview for Thanos #16, which will come out on the 28th of February:

https://i.imgur.com/TJIZlYf.jpg


interesting....i wouldnt put much stock in it . the thanos wank is strong

Originally posted by Stoic
Thinking about jumping on the bandwagon bro? I know you want to.

Hey man I always loved Dione!

Current Sentry ? He wins.

It's not the Sentry whom was unaware of his powers during the House of M and therefore couldn't counter Wanda powers.

Tony Stark confirmed that Sentry can start an House of M event on a whim.

Yeah, casually.

Originally posted by RealityWarper

Current Sentry ? He wins. Yeah, casually.

I am now going to ask you a couple of questions and I want you to answer every single one:

1. Why is it that power statements only count for the Sentry, but no one else?
Hulk has been stated to be the strongest being on Earth, but I would assume that in your mind that statement is inconsistent writing and the Sentry is stronger.

2. Why is it that omnipotence statements only count for the Sentry, but no one else?
Sentry has been stated to be omnipotent, but so has Odin. We know for a fact, that Odin isn't omnipotent. If you're omnipotent, you don't need to sleep every other day in order to restore your force power. And someone omnipotent would sure as hell not be vulnerable in such a state.

3. Why do you put so much emphasis on one half of the statements about the Molecule Man, but completely ignore the other half?
You have often talked about the statements, where Molecule Mans power is said to be all about organic and inorganic molecules and that all of it depends on his mental state. In your opinion that's the difference between a powered and depowered Molecule Man. But we also had statements, where it was said, that his overall power level is more manageable, when his mental state wavers. That has been named as the reason why SHIELD was able to capture him and put him into the Raft prison.

4. Why do you ignore the established fact, that during Dark Avengers Molecule Man was clearly not right in his head?
Molecule Man tried to hide from everyone and created a bunch of illusions to have company and guidance. He was clearly not completely sane. And with Bendis establishing that in such a state he was overall less powerful... Shouldn't it be telling? Why do you ignore that?

5. Why do positive power retcons apply for the Sentry, but negative power retcons don't apply for the Molecule Man?
Bendis had clearly established, that Sentrys power was based on molecule manipulation. But Bendis had also established, that Molecule Man was weaker during a weak mental state. Not just that his mental state affected his ability to affect organic molecules... No, according to Bendis he got weaker overall.

6. Why do you obsessively praise an outliner feat for the Sentry, but ignore outliner feats for other characters?
Or do you think that Spider-Man is a above high heralds, because he was able to beat Firelord into a pulp? Do you think that Captain Americas peak human son is above high heralds, because he was able to hurt Thor with a regular kick? Do you think that Squirrel Girl is above Doctor Doom and Thanos, because she was able to "beat" them?

7. Why isn't Sentry backing up that multiversal power you're constantly talking about?
When we talk about the ultimate power in comics, we talk about characters like the Beyonder. The energy the Beyonder expends to raise his eyebrows destroys galaxies. If Sentry wields such power, then why does he need to energy-punch a moon in order to destroy it? Why not just yawn and destroy half a solar system in process?

8. Why do you think that the Sentry has mastered his power?
Sometimes you come up with the weirdest statements like that the Sentry would transmute someone into candy and eat them. What? Sentry usually flies, punches and shoots laser beams out of his eyes. He resurrected his wife without realizing how he did it. If he had mastered his abilities, why didn't he resurrect her again? Even without having her corpse near him? If he is such an insanely powerful molecule manipulator, why not just wishing her into existence out of nothing (air molecules)?

HOM Wanda, easy

Originally posted by Enzeru
I am now going to ask you a couple of questions and I want you to answer every single one:

1. Why is it that power statements only count for the Sentry, but no one else?
Hulk has been stated to be the strongest being on Earth, but I would assume that in your mind that statement is inconsistent writing and the Sentry is stronger.

2. Why is it that omnipotence statements only count for the Sentry, but no one else?
Sentry has been stated to be omnipotent, but so has Odin. We know for a fact, that Odin isn't omnipotent. If you're omnipotent, you don't need to sleep every other day in order to restore your force power. And someone omnipotent would sure as hell not be vulnerable in such a state.

3. Why do you put so much emphasis on one half of the statements about the Molecule Man, but completely ignore the other half?
You have often talked about the statements, where Molecule Mans power is said to be all about organic and inorganic molecules and that all of it depends on his mental state. In your opinion that's the difference between a powered and depowered Molecule Man. But we also had statements, where it was said, that his overall power level is more manageable, when his mental state wavers. That has been named as the reason why SHIELD was able to capture him and put him into the Raft prison.

4. Why do you ignore the established fact, that during Dark Avengers Molecule Man was clearly not right in his head?
Molecule Man tried to hide from everyone and created a bunch of illusions to have company and guidance. He was clearly not completely sane. And with Bendis establishing that in such a state he was overall less powerful... Shouldn't it be telling? Why do you ignore that?

5. Why do positive power retcons apply for the Sentry, but negative power retcons don't apply for the Molecule Man?
Bendis had clearly established, that Sentrys power was based on molecule manipulation. But Bendis had also established, that Molecule Man was weaker during a weak mental state. Not just that his mental state affected his ability to affect organic molecules... No, according to Bendis he got weaker overall.

6. Why do you obsessively praise an outliner feat for the Sentry, but ignore outliner feats for other characters?
Or do you think that Spider-Man is a above high heralds, because he was able to beat Firelord into a pulp? Do you think that Captain Americas peak human son is above high heralds, because he was able to hurt Thor with a regular kick? Do you think that Squirrel Girl is above Doctor Doom and Thanos, because she was able to "beat" them?

7. Why isn't Sentry backing up that multiversal power you're constantly talking about?
When we talk about the ultimate power in comics, we talk about characters like the Beyonder. The energy the Beyonder expends to raise his eyebrows destroys galaxies. If Sentry wields such power, then why does he need to energy-punch a moon in order to destroy it? Why not just yawn and destroy half a solar system in process?

8. Why do you think that the Sentry has mastered his power?
Sometimes you come up with the weirdest statements like that the Sentry would transmute someone into candy and eat them. What? Sentry usually flies, punches and shoots laser beams out of his eyes. He resurrected his wife without realizing how he did it. If he had mastered his abilities, why didn't he resurrect her again? Even without having her corpse near him? If he is such an insanely powerful molecule manipulator, why not just wishing her into existence out of nothing (air molecules)?

You are supposedly asking me questions and making-up your own answers...

You should question your own mental health.

That's probably not brilliant.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Loaded question
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A loaded question or complex question fallacy is a question that contains a controversial or unjustified assumption (e.g., a presumption of guilt).

Aside from being an informal fallacy depending on usage, such questions may be used as a rhetorical tool: the question attempts to limit direct replies to be those that serve the questioner's agenda. The traditional example is the question "Have you stopped beating your wife?" Whether the respondent answers yes or no, he will admit to having a wife and having beaten her at some time in the past. Thus, these facts are presupposed by the question, and in this case an entrapment, because it narrows the respondent to a single answer, and the fallacy of many questions has been committed. The fallacy relies upon context for its effect: the fact that a question presupposes something does not in itself make the question fallacious. Only when some of these presuppositions are not necessarily agreed to by the person who is asked the question does the argument containing them become fallacious. Hence the same question may be loaded in one context, but not in the other. For example, the previous question would not be loaded if it were asked during a trial in which the defendant had already admitted to beating his wife.

This fallacy should be distinguished from that of begging the question (not to be confused with raising the question), which offers a premise whose plausibility depends on the truth of the proposition asked about, and which is often an implicit restatement of the proposition.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


GO IN ABHI's TEAM AND CHALLENGE ME ON A BATTLEZONE.

I WILL TEACH YOU HOW TO DEBATE ! XD

Rofl.

The ability of Enzeru to make Strawmen and answer to them is literally astounding. XD

He is literally using stuff that I've never said and twisting my words.

That's one of the most ludicrous post I've ever seen in a battle forum...

RealityWarper, I asked you a couple of questions, but you didn't answer a single one. Instead you brought up a stupid fallacy, which you probably only know because of me. I once accused you of the loaded question fallacy. You would usually go to Tom Breevorts Tumblr account, ask him questions about the Sentry, yet fill these questions with a bunch of make-beliefs.

You have asked me questions about the Sentry for years. And I've always answered them gladly, even if it required a lot of speculation. Certain stuff was simply not established in the comics. You would then go and reinterpret half of the stuff I told you wrong. You would spread misinformation and straight up lies. It took me a long time to clarify stuff on the Sentry and show people that he is a great and appealing character. But you single-handedly did so much damage, that any time the Sentry is brought up, he gets ridiculed with multiversal level nonsense. In the perfect world you would automatically get banned from any board, as soon as you start writing Sentrys name. The message you would see, would say: "Oh, shut your mouth, you stupid little troll".

I will gladly battlezone you. I don't need anyone on my side for that. You however can take the 2 or 3 muppets you were able to convince that the Sentry is multiversal. How about that? You and anyone you choose to help you against me. A battle zone about the Sentry. I'll come up with some topics and so can you.

Originally posted by Enzeru
RealityWarper, I asked you a couple of questions, but you didn't answer a single one. Instead you brought up a stupid fallacy, which you probably only know because of me. I once accused you of the loaded question fallacy. You would usually go to Tom Breevorts Tumblr account, ask him questions about the Sentry, yet fill these questions with a bunch of make-beliefs.

You have asked me questions about the Sentry for years. And I've always answered them gladly, even if it required a lot of speculation. Certain stuff was simply not established in the comics. You would then go and reinterpret half of the stuff I told you wrong. You would spread misinformation and straight up lies. It took me a long time to clarify stuff on the Sentry and show people that he is a great and appealing character. But you single-handedly did so much damage, that any time the Sentry is brought up, he gets ridiculed with multiversal level nonsense. In the perfect world you would automatically get banned from any board, as soon as you start writing Sentrys name. The message you would see, would say: "Oh, shut your mouth, you stupid little troll".

I will gladly battlezone you. I don't need anyone on my side for that. You however can take the 2 or 3 muppets you were able to convince that the Sentry is multiversal. How about that? You and anyone you choose to help you against me. A battle zone about the Sentry. I'll come up with some topics and so can you.

What the **** are you talking about ?

You don't own the Sentry.

Your opinion about him is totally irrelevant.

You think that you own the character and act like a Guru.

That's your problem, not mine.

I don't have to answer to a bunch a stupid and flawed questions. Yes, that's loaded questions and that's all that is.

You want to try to prove me wrong.

Go on and Battlezone.

We will see the outcome.

You gone so far as insulting me in PM because your beliefs were challenged and your feelings hurt.


I totally don't care about this.

Sentry isn't yours. It's a Marvel character and you didn't write him.

In a perfect world, you could have your little sect and everyone obeying you but not here. XD

That's not how a battlezone works.


We will expose our point of views about the Sentry versus Molecule Man Fight and let's see who's more convincing.

HOM Wanda

Funny how writer interviews are taken as supporting proof

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Funny how writer interviews are taken as supporting proof

Funny how you don't understand that someone whom has written and/or created the character is a legitimate authority in the matter...

That's basic logic.

Originally posted by RealityWarper

Go on and Battlezone.

Go on and start a thread. Don't write me any PMs. Just write what you have to say on the Sentry. And I want you to cover the three following topics:

1. Why was the Molecule Man at his best during his fight against the Sentry in your opinion. Because that's what you've been saying for years now. That Sentry beat the Molecule Man at his most powerful up until then point.

2. Why is the Sentry now completely sane, after he got out of the sun. Because that's what you've also been saying. I corrected you, but you stuck to your opinion. You said, that the Sentry got rid of all of his mental issues, while he was in the sun. Back that up.

3. With The One Above All being the absolute and undeniable #1 in the Marvel universe and the upper echelon of Marvels power level scale featuring a bunch of other powerful characters...where on that scale does the Sentry place in your opinion?

If you don't do that, I'm going to look through all of the posts you've made over the years. I'll search for all of those statements of yours. And I'll debunk them into oblivion.
You've already ignored and avoided all of the questions I asked you yesterday. There is no more escape for you from this, you coward.

Originally posted by Enzeru
Go on and start a thread. Don't write me any PMs. Just write what you have to say on the Sentry. And I want you to cover the three following topics:

1. Why was the Molecule Man at his best during his fight against the Sentry in your opinion. Because that's what you've been saying for years now. That Sentry beat the Molecule Man at his most powerful up until then point.

2. Why is the Sentry now completely sane, after he got out of the sun. Because that's what you've also been saying. I corrected you, but you stuck to your opinion. You said, that the Sentry got rid of all of his mental issues, while he was in the sun. Back that up.

3. With The One Above All being the absolute and undeniable #1 in the Marvel universe and the upper echelon of Marvels power level scale featuring a bunch of other powerful characters...where on that scale does the Sentry place in your opinion?

If you don't do that, I'm going to look through all of the posts you've made over the years. I'll search for all of those statements of yours. And I'll debunk them into oblivion.
You've already ignored and avoided all of the questions I asked you yesterday. There is no more escape for you from this, you coward.

This isn't how that works.

The questions we will answer in the Battlezone are:

- How powerful are Sentry and Molecule Man ?
- What happened during their fight and why Sentry won ?

You are free to shape your answers the way you want in the Battlezone.

About your questions:

"1. Why was the Molecule Man at his best during his fight against the Sentry in your opinion. Because that's what you've been saying for years now. That Sentry beat the Molecule Man at his most powerful up until then point."


This will be answered in details in the battlezone.

"2. Why is the Sentry now completely sane, after he got out of the sun. Because that's what you've also been saying. I corrected you, but you stuck to your opinion. You said, that the Sentry got rid of all of his mental issues, while he was in the sun. Back that up."

You are specifically referencing the moment Sentry was possessed by the Death Seed.

I will repeat one more what I have said in this time because you clearly didn't read my posts.


The Death Seed gave to Bob another persona that replaced his original persona.

Bob's point of view of the World was the one of the Death Seed.

When Bob got out of the Sun, he wasn't agoraphobic anymore.

His "delusions" weren't delusions but simply the expression of the Death Seed, another persona so that wasn't his schizophrenia.

'3. With The One Above All being the absolute and undeniable #1 in the Marvel universe and the upper echelon of Marvels power level scale featuring a bunch of other powerful characters...where on that scale does the Sentry place in your opinion?"

The Above All Others is exactly what his name tells us.

He is above everyone in the Marvel Universe and the UNIQUE TRUE OMNIPOTENT in Marvel.

Sentry is nothing to him like the other characters in Marvel.

Now we are done on this thread.

I will create the Battlezone asap and we will end that argument once and for all.

I ignored your loaded questions for the simple reason that you are already trying to influence people true them. They weren't neutral which is why they are called "loaded questions".

You are still insulting me. That tells more about you than it tells about me but don't worry. I will not lower myself to that level.

Good luck for the Battlezone.

LOL, I am soooooo looking forward to this BZ!!

Originally posted by RealityWarper

This isn't how that works.

Already looking for excuses and chickening out. I gave you the topics. Now back up your claims on all of them, you coward.

Originally posted by Enzeru
Already looking for excuses and chickening out. I gave you the topics. Now back up your claims on all of them, you coward.

I've already explained everything.

I'm not giving excuses and not afraid by your posts.

Now all questions related to Sentry and Molecule Man will be answered in the Battlezone.

We will come to an agreement for the rules in that topic:

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=653362&from=thread&pagenumber=1#post16611373

Originally posted by RealityWarper

I'm not not afraid by your posts.

If you aren't, why don't we make a deal to spice things up? The loser leaves this board forever.

Originally posted by RealityWarper

We will come to an agreement for the rules in that topic:

Rather make a new thread. That one has already been infested with nonsense.

Originally posted by Enzeru
If you aren't, why don't we make a deal to spice things up? The loser leaves this board forever.

So people vote for or against a poster according to their like and dislikes instead of according to the arguments in the thread ?

That's not gonna happen.

Your petty attempts at manipulating me are crystal clear and I'm not falling for it.



I will not.

I will use the thread I specifically created for that event.

Originally posted by RealityWarper

Your petty attempts at manipulating me are crystal clear and I'm not falling for it.

I'm not trying to manipulate you. I'm trying to erase you from existence.

Originally posted by RealityWarper

I will use the thread I specifically created for that event.

But that thread is already full of shitposts.

Originally posted by Enzeru
I'm not trying to manipulate you. I'm trying to erase you from existence.

Try harder.





Do you mean that you can't discriminate the information in that thread ?

Too bad.

Originally posted by RealityWarper

Do you mean that you can't discriminate the information in that thread?

No. I mean, that once someone enters that thread, he or she needs to skim through a bunch of your idiotic non-posts until they finally arrive to my insightful ones. Create a new thread.

Originally posted by Enzeru
No. I mean, that once someone enters that thread, he or she needs to skim through a bunch of your idiotic non-posts until they finally arrive to my insightful ones. Create a new thread.

This thread isn't to debate.

This thread is to set-up the Battlezone rules that we will use.

I will create another thread for our Battlezone once the rules are decided.

Period.

Originally posted by RealityWarper

This thread isn't to debate.
This thread is to set-up the Battlezone rules that we will use.
I will create another thread for our Battlezone once the rules are decided.
Period.

I wasn't talking about this thread. God damn, you're something else.

Reality, just take the challenge cmon.

All that bluster and now Enzeru has you reeling ?

Originally posted by Damborgson
Reality, just take the challenge cmon.

All that bluster and now Enzeru has you reeling ?

I will not reduce that Battlezone to a popularity vote between two users.

If you want to discuss it PM me.

Now we stop derailing that thread.

Guys, we've already banned two people this week for dragging threads off-topic and generally ruining them. Two more wouldn't make a huge difference to me or the globals.

If you remove the 'u' from your name you still get a Pal.


Also, I'm going to create a Sentry vs Molecule Man thread or bump one, because I'd love to see where this goes.

Originally posted by RealityWarper
You are supposedly asking me questions and making-up your own answers...

You should question your own mental health.

That's probably not brilliant.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Loaded question
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A loaded question or complex question fallacy is a question that contains a controversial or unjustified assumption (e.g., a presumption of guilt).

Aside from being an informal fallacy depending on usage, such questions may be used as a rhetorical tool: the question attempts to limit direct replies to be those that serve the questioner's agenda. The traditional example is the question "Have you stopped beating your wife?" Whether the respondent answers yes or no, he will admit to having a wife and having beaten her at some time in the past. Thus, these facts are presupposed by the question, and in this case an entrapment, because it narrows the respondent to a single answer, and the fallacy of many questions has been committed. The fallacy relies upon context for its effect: the fact that a question presupposes something does not in itself make the question fallacious. Only when some of these presuppositions are not necessarily agreed to by the person who is asked the question does the argument containing them become fallacious. Hence the same question may be loaded in one context, but not in the other. For example, the previous question would not be loaded if it were asked during a trial in which the defendant had already admitted to beating his wife.

This fallacy should be distinguished from that of begging the question (not to be confused with raising the question), which offers a premise whose plausibility depends on the truth of the proposition asked about, and which is often an implicit restatement of the proposition.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


GO IN ABHI's TEAM AND CHALLENGE ME ON A BATTLEZONE.

I WILL TEACH YOU HOW TO DEBATE ! XD

running like an utter and complete coward as usual, eh?