Thanos IG vs Jiren

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Blindside12
Who wins?

Inedian
Probably Jiren. It was obvious that infinite void was shaking because of Jiren suppressed power. Jiren takes this.

TethAdamTheRock
Jiren can destroy many universes but the IG can destroy a Multiverse so it wins

carver9
IG Thanos wins.

Galan007
IG wins with a gesture.

NewGuy01
Thanos.

Damborgson
C'mon man...

SSJGGogeta
Depends. Assuming the gauntlet works in this fight(because it doesn't work outside its native universe), Jiren should still be capable of no-selling Thanos in terms of speed.

If Jiren can snag it off of Thanos before Thanos can react, he wins.

That's too big of a variable though, and that would be assuming Jiren even knew to do so in the first place.

Giving this to Thanos. His raw power with the IG makes him second to only God himself, iirc.

Damborgson
Thanos knows past, present and future with the time gem. There is no depends lol.

SSJGGogeta
Originally posted by Damborgson
Thanos knows past, present and future with the time gem. There is no depends lol.

If he's in character, he turns off his sensory abilities, and Jiren snatches it off with no problem, before destroying the universe with a gesture.

Hell, universe busting alone should render the gauntlet useless, going off of the IG's sheer mechanics.

NewGuy01
Lol, not really. The fact that he turned off those abilities in a specific instance doesn't mean "in character" he would do so against any opponent.

Estacado
Thanos easy.

One Big Mob
Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
If he's in character, he turns off his sensory abilities, and Jiren snatches it off with no problem, before destroying the universe with a gesture.

Hell, universe busting alone should render the gauntlet useless, going off of the IG's sheer mechanics. How is that in character? That'd be like assuming Jiren just starts meditating.

Also Thanos let Mephisto snatch the gauntlet off when he was at full power. It did not turn out well.

bbrem123
Makes you wonder what level of power Jiren can resist.

Like if each one of the gems were used on him individually could he resist? If not were is his limit?

carver9
It was said Jiren have no limits.

One Big Mob
How unlike the IG

cdtm
Panther and the IG actually pushed God Doom. At the least, he made him dig, unlike say, Pre Retcon Beyonder who casually and absentmindedly affected ALL abstracts.

Inedian
Originally posted by carver9
It was said Jiren have no limits.

Which we know it isn't true. But we know that IG also has limits. Jiren takes Thanos IG out.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
^lmao

Inedian
Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
^lmao

Yup... Thanos IG is toast against Jiren.

Damborgson
How? Honest question , how?

Inedian
Originally posted by Damborgson
How? Honest question , how?

With out-of-this dimension speed.

Galan007
Originally posted by Inedian
With out-of-this dimension speed. I chuckled. thumb up

Inedian
Originally posted by Galan007
I chuckled. thumb up

wink smile

Honestly, IG with no effort.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
I knew you were joking. smile

Inedian
big grin

bbrem123
So. Would MUI be able to evade the IG?

One Big Mob
Originally posted by bbrem123
So. Would MUI be able to evade the IG? Maybe the punches.

Massive all encompassing blasts and just blowing him up outright are a different story.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ

Damborgson
Originally posted by Inedian
wink smile

Honestly, IG with no effort.
thumb up

Gogeta had me on edge laughing out loud

NewGuy01
banjo disagrees

Sj_Sharp
How about Jiren with IG against Thanos. raver

TheBadguy
Originally posted by bbrem123
So. Would MUI be able to evade the IG?

LOL props for thinking of that. That would be very interesting to see

In fact logically I think IT and MUI should amp each other

carver9
If Jiren powered through everything that is thrown at him, I wouldn't even be surprised tbh.

One Big Mob
Originally posted by carver9
If Jiren powered through everything that is thrown at him, I wouldn't even be surprised tbh. I wouldn't be surprised if he was erased in a snap.
Who's lack of shock carries more weight?

Galan007
Originally posted by carver9
IG Thanos wins. Originally posted by carver9
If Jiren powered through everything that is thrown at him, I wouldn't even be surprised tbh. carver just carver'd the shit out of himself.

cdtm
Originally posted by One Big Mob
Maybe the punches.

Massive all encompassing blasts and just blowing him up outright are a different story.

Thanos did seem to react to Norrin Radd's all or nothing charge. (And it pains me to admit that, because I know it's going to bite me the next time he takes on Superman. stick out tongue )

If he can do that, I'd need pretty solid evidence Goku (Or Jiren, or the fastest he's dodged) is above Surfer's speed level.

Galan007
^ And that was when Thanos had turned *off* ALL sensory input from the gems. thumb up

One Big Mob
Originally posted by cdtm
Thanos did seem to react to Norrin Radd's all or nothing charge. (And it pains me to admit that, because I know it's going to bite me the next time he takes on Superman. stick out tongue )

If he can do that, I'd need pretty solid evidence Goku (Or Jiren, or the fastest he's dodged) is above Surfer's speed level. His sensory input was retarded. Much like when Carver enters a Jiren thread. Great, maybe the best poster on the site normally, but the second he enters a Jiren thread...
Arnie Grape

SSJGGogeta
Idk, while the depth of power held by the IG is much greater than Jiren's, Jiren is also at a scope comparable to the IG.

Both shook infinite dimensions with a mere showing of power, and the IG clearly has limits, as it's been shown before.

My point is that simply saying "IG is limitless" isn't an argument, when it has been overpowered by Emperor God Doom, Mistress Death, the HOTU, etc.

Given these are all beings you could place above Jiren, my point is simply that the IG is not as limitless as some are wanking it to be.

Galan007
I'd say *depth* of power is far more useful than *scope* of power here.

Jiren, for example, cannot gesturely turn the IG into a pickle. The IG can, however, do that to Jiren. Depth.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ

SSJGGogeta
As you're aware, however, the majority of hax can be overpowered by someone with a higher scope of power, in DBS.

That's kind of the only reason why Jiren is still in this tournament at all. If time manipulation, etc. worked on him, Hit could have easily just kept him frozen in time while someone picked his ass up and threw him off the side.

DBS follows a particularly annoying trend of making all special powers, abilities, etc, useless in the face of something overwhelmingly more powerful.

The scope of the IG is only universal, something which Jiren should be overwhelmingly above in terms of raw power.

cdtm
Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
Idk, while the depth of power held by the IG is much greater than Jiren's, Jiren is also at a scope comparable to the IG.

Both shook infinite dimensions with a mere showing of power, and the IG clearly has limits, as it's been shown before.

My point is that simply saying "IG is limitless" isn't an argument, when it has been overpowered by Emperor God Doom, Mistress Death, the HOTU, etc.

Given these are all beings you could place above Jiren, my point is simply that the IG is not as limitless as some are wanking it to be.



Death overpowered the IG? I only remember her putting up a shield against indirect power aimed at other abstracts..


The other two examples actually support the case for IG being up there. If you can hold off Doom for any length of time at all, you're outside the power curve.

Just like Molecule Man losing to Pre Retcon Beyonder still makes him the second most powerful being at the time, period.

NemeBro
When all else is equal, having more options is the game changer.

And Thanos with the IG within the scope of his power has literally limitless options. Jiren is, ultimately, just a brick with energy projection. A very powerful brick with energy projection sure, but that's all he is.

SSJGGogeta
Originally posted by NemeBro
When all else is equal, having more options is the game changer.

And Thanos with the IG within the scope of his power has literally limitless options. Jiren is, ultimately, just a brick with energy projection. A very powerful brick with energy projection sure, but that's all he is.

I completely agree, but in DBS, hax just simply don't work on someone far stronger.

I'm not saying Jiren wins, I'm just saying that based on my knowledge of both characters, it seems completely plausible that Jiren could tank the universal energies of the gauntlet, without being severely affected, if at all.

At least that's how it should happen going by DBS logic. Of course Marvel logic is completely different, which is what makes this even worth discussing in the first place.

Obviously, if the IG's full abilities worked on Jiren, this would be a non-fight. My argument is simply that there is a possibility that they wouldn't work.

Also, good to see you again, Nemebro. Feels like I haven't heard that name in years.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DTK-sXoX0AAxH1z.jpg

cdtm
Originally posted by NemeBro
When all else is equal, having more options is the game changer.

And Thanos with the IG within the scope of his power has literally limitless options. Jiren is, ultimately, just a brick with energy projection. A very powerful brick with energy projection sure, but that's all he is.

Thank you! thumb up

And while it's also true that energy has done some pretty impressive things, like piercing dimensions, shattering the room of spirit and time, and resisting a time effect (Which I still maintain isn't a full on time freeze, but that's another argument), that all pales in comparison to the things a gauntlet can do.

cdtm
Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
I completely agree, but in DBS, hax just simply don't work on someone far stronger.

I'm not saying Jiren wins, I'm just saying that based on my knowledge of both characters, it seems completely plausible that Jiren could tank the universal energies of the gauntlet, without being severely affected, if at all.

At least that's how it should happen going by DBS logic. Of course Marvel logic is completely different, which is what makes this even worth discussing in the first place.

Obviously, if the IG's full abilities worked on Jiren, this would be a non-fight. My argument is simply that there is a possibility that they wouldn't work.

Sure, but accepting he can resist ANY hax is a no limits fallicy.

For example, a soul rip. No reason to believe Jiren can counter that one. (After all, even in Dragon Ball a soul without a body is just helpless spirit energy.)

One Big Mob
Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
I completely agree, but in DBS, hax just simply don't work on someone far stronger.

I'm not saying Jiren wins, I'm just saying that based on my knowledge of both characters, it seems completely plausible that Jiren could tank the universal energies of the gauntlet, without being severely affected, if at all.

At least that's how it should happen going by DBS logic. Of course Marvel logic is completely different, which is what makes this even worth discussing in the first place.

Obviously, if the IG's full abilities worked on Jiren, this would be a non-fight. My argument is simply that there is a possibility that they wouldn't work.

Also, good to see you again, Nemebro. Feels like I haven't heard that name in years.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DTK-sXoX0AAxH1z.jpg "Hax don't done work on something in dat dere far stronger range, it don't it don't"

How unlike Marvel. Also as shown in the God Doom fight, or in any fight ever, things add up. Merely "tanking" the IG doesn't mean it's ineffective at any stage. You're defending a being in a series where many of the first attacks don't work.

The IG is apparently only universal in scope. In that scope it is all powerful. It's why Nebula beat Death, Galactus, Celestials, Order/Chaos, etc at the same time easily. Simply saying hax beats power is perfectly applicable to IG as well. If both work on the same basis and one seems vastly more powerful, then how can Jiren's power beat the IG's hax? I mean God Doom was overpowering IG's hax and IG's power was still able to fight well against him.
It doesn't work like that.

Galan007
Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
As you're aware, however, the majority of hax can be overpowered by someone with a higher scope of power, in DBS The IG has nothing to do with DBS, though, so that is a moot comparison.

One Big Mob
Originally posted by Galan007
The IG has nothing to do with DBS, though, so that is a moot comparison. Yeah, trying to apply one universes logic to override the other is weird. Though it's largely the same basis anyway.
Power beats other power. Power (largely) beats random shit. But one power was enough to put it against the most powerful being in Marvel history (counting retcons).

carver9
sad ... i sair Jiren lose this.

Galan007
Originally posted by One Big Mob
Yeah, trying to apply one universes logic to override the other is weird. Though it's largely the same basis anyway.
Power beats other power. Power (largely) beats random shit. But one power was enough to put it against the most powerful being in Marvel history (counting retcons). thumb up

Not even LT...acting in his full capacity as representative of TOAA's power/authority...knew if he was powerful enough to defeat the classic IG by force -- Starlin wasn't bluffing when he said that it made its user 'God'. It outclasses Jiren in raw power output.

That said, raw power output is kind of moot as well -- it's not like the IG and Jiren are going to end up in a beam-struggle, ffs(unless Thanos REALLY decides to play around.) One gesture from the IG, and Jiren is transmuted into a pickle...or dumped in the past...or erased from existence...or turned into a child. Etc.

*Depth* of power.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
thumb up

SSJGGogeta
Originally posted by Galan007
The IG has nothing to do with DBS, though, so that is a moot comparison.

Right, except for the fact that we're currently discussing a character from DBS vs. the IG.

My point is that Jiren has overpowered time hax and multiple other kinds of abilities which would normally spell instant death for the person they're being used on, with no effort whatsoever, while suppressed.

My argument is not that Jiren could survive/defeat the IG if it was able to affect him. My argument is that it wouldn't be able to affect him, simply because he can overpower it if it came down to a clash of just raw power.

Doom was able to, even to the point of being unaffected by the IG when serious. The IG wielding Black Panther was barely able to distract Doom, because Doom was simply more powerful. In the end, the fight was reduced to fisticuffs between the two.

Also, the implication that the IG is somehow above the LT is ridiculous, when the LT is the one who singlehandedly stopped the IG.

TOAA > Beyonders ~ Emperor God Doom > HOTU > LT > IG

The IG is not limitless, and it has been beaten with raw power above its own, before. Going by what you're saying, the same should have happened to Emperor God Doom. It clearly did not.

Since the IG is universal, it should be well below Jiren in terms of raw power.

Going by DBS logic, Jiren wouldn't even feel the effects of the IG. That's my entire point here.

cdtm
That should be posted on Urbandictionary under "No Limits Fallacy".

One Big Mob
Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
Right, except for the fact that we're currently discussing a character from DBS vs. the IG.

My point is that Jiren has overpowered time hax and multiple other kinds of abilities which would normally spell instant death for the person they're being used on, with no effort whatsoever, while suppressed.

My argument is not that Jiren could survive/defeat the IG if it was able to affect him. My argument is that it wouldn't be able to affect him, simply because he can overpower it if it came down to a clash of just raw power.

Doom was able to, even to the point of being unaffected by the IG when serious. The IG wielding Black Panther was barely able to distract Doom, because Doom was simply more powerful. In the end, the fight was reduced to fisticuffs between the two.

Also, the implication that the IG is somehow above the LT is ridiculous, when the LT is the one who singlehandedly stopped the IG.

TOAA > Beyonders ~ Emperor God Doom > HOTU > LT > IG

The IG is not limitless, and it has been beaten with raw power above its own, before. Going by what you're saying, the same should have happened to Emperor God Doom. It clearly did not.

Since the IG is universal, it should be well below Jiren in terms of raw power.

Going by DBS logic, Jiren wouldn't even feel the effects of the IG. That's my entire point here. Let me as a Brandon get this straight.

You're using Doom who had the biggest on paper powerup in the history of comics, to try and use him beating the IG as some sort of low feat and thus the IG being "universal" has immense merit?
Doom was powered up by at least hundreds of beings each far above Beyonder. The fact that IG even did as well as it did is not exactly something you should use to prove Jiren can overpower it.

You yourself, SSJGGogeta if that is your real name admitted that the UN can erase Zeno. A being far above Jiren. And a weapon far below the IG. A weapon with scope above the IG as well.

It simply does not add up. To put this in terms you will understand:

Yo it be like using er Gold Furiza losing to Jirenasty 2 tri and proove Furiza cant debeat Iron Tony Start Men

Galan007
Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
Right, except for the fact that we're currently discussing a character from DBS vs. the IG.

My point is that Jiren has overpowered time hax and multiple other kinds of abilities which would normally spell instant death for the person they're being used on, with no effort whatsoever, while suppressed.

My argument is not that Jiren could survive/defeat the IG if it was able to affect him. My argument is that it wouldn't be able to affect him, simply because he can overpower it if it came down to a clash of just raw power.

Doom was able to, even to the point of being unaffected by the IG when serious. The IG wielding Black Panther was barely able to distract Doom, because Doom was simply more powerful. In the end, the fight was reduced to fisticuffs between the two.

Also, the implication that the IG is somehow above the LT is ridiculous, when the LT is the one who singlehandedly stopped the IG.

TOAA > Beyonders ~ Emperor God Doom > HOTU > LT > IG

The IG is not limitless, and it has been beaten with raw power above its own, before. Going by what you're saying, the same should have happened to Emperor God Doom. It clearly did not.

Since the IG is universal, it should be well below Jiren in terms of raw power.

Going by DBS logic, Jiren wouldn't even feel the effects of the IG. That's my entire point here. Wow... So you're essentially saying that because God Emperor Doom was able to defeat an IG-wielder, Jiren would be able to as well..? Lol, okie dokie. smile

...Clearly this 'debate' will go absolutely nowhere, so lets just quite while we're ahead, eh? wink

TheBadguy
Originally posted by One Big Mob
His sensory input was retarded. Much like when Carver enters a Jiren thread. Great, maybe the best poster on the site normally, but the second he enters a Jiren thread...
Arnie Grape

I choked on my water with a hint of lime lmfao

TheBadguy
I can see jiren over powering the power stone but the Ig is more than the power stone

The fact that he was impacted at all by hits time skip means he will be ****ed against the other stones

Hed need infinite+ stats in all the other areas and he doesn't

Dark-Kenshin
Any being who truly surpassed time wouldn't be confined to something as crude as a "time limit." That comment was pure hyperbole. That said, Beerus seems to be immune to Arale's reality warping haxx, so there's that.

One Big Mob
Originally posted by TheBadguy
I choked on my water with a hint of lime lmfao Nice, I was hoping someone would catch that. Quite proud of it tbh

cdtm
Originally posted by Dark-Kenshin
Any being who truly surpassed time wouldn't be confined to something as crude as a "time limit." That comment was pure hyperbole. That said, Beerus seems to be immune to Arale's reality warping haxx, so there's that.

It's not like Jiren was unaffected. Goku "surpassed" it, too, but it still slowed him up.

Hits effects are pretty weak against big guns like the Worlogog, Time Trapper, or Extant, which the Time Gem compares to.

carver9
No getting around this. Jiren was placed in time stop and not even using a fraction of his power, he exceeded it.

Galan007
Originally posted by Galan007
It should be noted that Jiren only overpowered *Hit's* control over time(Goku has done the same, btw.) That certainly doesn't give Jiren blanket immunity to any/all temporal attacks across the board, though... Enough with the no-limits fallacies, ffs.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ

SSJGGogeta
Originally posted by Galan007
Wow... So you're essentially saying that because God Emperor Doom was able to defeat an IG-wielder, Jiren would be able to as well..? Lol, okie dokie. smile

...Clearly this 'debate' will go absolutely nowhere, so lets just quite while we're ahead, eh? wink

I'm using that example simply to prove that the Infinity gauntlet is not all-powerful, or even as close to it as you're asserting.

Classic IG would definitely shit on Jiren, but since it has been established to be only universal, it is shown to have a very finite amount of power.

I've explained to you multiple times- I'm not saying Jiren can overpower any time manipulation, just because he overpowered Hit's. I'm saying that Hit is someone who is readily able to operate on a universal+ level, and Jiren overpowered his time manipulation with no effort, while suppressed.

It is one of the more obscure abilities of the DBS verse to nullify or simply ignore hax, by being stronger than the one implementing it.

I already admitted that Jiren would obviously be transmuted into a pickle or some shit, if this doesn't apply. My POINT is that we saw how that worked for Buuhan, against Vegetto. The DBS characters are able to simply overpower or ignore hax, and my ONLY argument here is that Jiren MIGHT be able to do the same to the gauntlet.

Hell, I don't think I ever even expressly dubbed Jiren the victor here. ALL I'm saying is that Jiren might be able to tank/ignore the abilities of the gauntlet, by having power of a similar, if not superior, scope. We've already agreed that the depth is completely overwhelming in favor of the IG, I'm simply saying that Jiren operates on a similar, if not superior, scope- and could thusly potentially be capable of nullifying/ignoring the abilities of the gauntlet. That's all I'm saying.

Also, I only brought up the Doom example to support my initial assertion- I'm in no way saying Jiren = Doom, or whatever. EG Doom would do to Jiren, what he did to Thanos. I realize that, and accept it as truth, lol. EG Doom, however, is also FAR superior to any IG wielder. IIRC, he's even above the Living Tribunal.

One Big Mob
Galan doesn't accept your apology and he'll allow you one retry to correct your wrongs.

SSJGGogeta
Originally posted by One Big Mob
Galan doesn't accept your apology and he'll allow you one retry to correct your wrongs.

Do I know you?

One Big Mob
Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
Do I know you? You don't need to know me. I'm in the Galan business, and he is not pleased with what you're writing. That is what you need to know.

Edit: He just sent me a countdown

SSJGGogeta
Originally posted by One Big Mob
You don't need to know me. I'm in the Galan business, and he is not pleased with what you're writing. That is what you need to know.

Edit: He just sent me a countdown

If Galan wants to reply to me, he's more than welcome to.

I don't deal with errand boys.

One Big Mob
Originally posted by SSJGGogeta
If Galan wants to reply to me, he's more than welcome to.

I don't deal with errand boys. He said he's about 75% done with your retort. He showed me what he said was 25%... I wouldn't want to be in your shoes tbh.

You can pick on me all you want, but just know your actions are the cause of the doom you're bringing on yourself. He didn't add 007 to his name because he thought it sounded super cool when he made his account. He lives it.

SSJGGogeta
Originally posted by One Big Mob
He said he's about 75% done with your retort. He showed me what he said was 25%... I wouldn't want to be in your shoes tbh.

You can pick on me all you want, but just know your actions are the cause of the doom you're bringing on yourself. He didn't add 007 to his name because he thought it sounded super cool when he made his account. He lives it.

Why don't you propose already?

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