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Count Dooku vs. Kit Fisto, Saesee Tinn and Agen Kolar

Team Diff fight.

Siding with the Team.

Team in canon, Dooku in legends

Dooku, all rounds.

Team.

I would favour Tyranus tbh

Team was literally designed to defeat him.

Dooku is tier 8, Mace is tier 8

Fisto is tier 7 and lasted the longest against Sidious
Agen and Tiin are likely low 7's maybe even bordering 6.

Kenobi in AotC was a 7 and Dooku merked him.

Dooku can take this

Still scraping accolades from bottom of the barrel sources i see.

Also:

RotS script states that Sidious was about to succumb to Yoda in their saber duel.

Both Sidious and Dooku lasted about the same time against Yoda in sabers before they resorted to different means.

But Sidious>>>>>B-team

So:


Yoda>Sidious>=Dooku>>>B-team

Originally posted by Kurk
Both Sidious and Dooku lasted about the same time against Yoda in sabers before they resorted to different means.

The troll logic aside, I feel obligated to point out Sidious and Yoda duel for two times as long as Dooku and Yoda (approx. one minute vs thirty seconds).

Nah I'm getting appx 30 secs for both of them. I start counting once the Chancellor's stage starts to rise as this is when they actually start fighting furiously. Dooku and Yoda hit at full force; whereas Yoda and Sheev go into it slowly if you will.

Originally posted by Kurk
Nah I'm getting appx 30 secs for both of them. I start counting once the Chancellor's stage starts to rise as this is when they actually start fighting furiously. Dooku and Yoda hit at full force; whereas Yoda and Sheev go into it slowly if you will.
Half of the Sidious/Yoda duel if off-screen. They start dueling, cuts to Anakin and Kenobi, then cuts back for the thirty seconds.

@DSO

No doubt Yoda is Dooku's superior, but he also superior to Palpatine.

YODA unleashes a ferocious assault on PALPATINE, causing him to almost go over the edge. The Dark Lord drops his lightsaber but recovers with a BLAST OF ENERGY from his hands that surrounds YODA.


But even before this Sheev was trying to escape from Yoda:

PALPATINE seeks refuge in the vast Senate Chamber. He gets into the Chancellor's Podium and it starts to rise up into the Arena. YODA makes a giant leap into the control pod. The sword fighting is intense in the confined space.


Dooku ran away from Yoda, so did Sheev. The difference is that Sheev was able to resort to his force abilities when he realized he was the inferior duelist while Dooku couldn't.


@ANT

How do we know how much was off-screen?

Originally posted by Kurk
@ANT

How do we know how much was off-screen?

It's reasonable to assume they fought during the off-screen time and didn't stare at each other.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
It's reasonable to assume they fought during the off-screen time and didn't stare at each other.
http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/facebook/000/210/119/9b3.png




The question was about gauging the length of time fought off-screen, not if they did.

Originally posted by Kurk
The question was about gauging the length of time fought off-screen, not if they did.

What?

Obviously it would be the time between the scene cut of Sidious snarling and the next scene cut of Yoda and Sidious jumping on the pod.

You don't think that Sidious's snarling was an indicator of Yoda "almost pushing him off the edge" like the transcript says?

He certainly doesn't seem to be enjoying himself there

And I would greatly appreciate if you respond to the PM I sent. I will not be offended. I only wish to understand.

Does that have anything to do with what I was saying?

Anyway, I really can't tell if you're jobbing or not with this Dooku nonsense.

What's nonsensical? Yoda>Sidious>=Dooku>>>B-team.

Sidious is closer to Dooku as a duelist than he is to Yoda (omitting Gilliard).

Originally posted by Kurk
What's nonsensical? Yoda>Sidious>=Dooku>>>B-team.

Sidious is closer to Dooku as a duelist than he is to Yoda (omitting Gilliard).

I assume the list posted only applies to dueling as it is clearly evident based on TCW, that Sidous far outstrips Dooku in the Force. Sidious is also a superior duelist, but that is another can of worms.

Originally posted by Kurk
Sidious is closer to Dooku as a duelist than he is to Yoda (omitting Gilliard).

Omitting *Lucas, you mean?

Anyway, it's stated many times over dueling Sidious was far more challenging than dueling Dooku.

Here's two I found off-the-cuff:

https://i.imgur.com/u4DFpha.png https://i.imgur.com/w2VqZWH.png

It's also stated Yoda vs Dooku was a "warm-up" for Yoda relative to vs Sidious, etc.

It's really not even up for debate.

We can also look into the substance of their fights, and well, kek . . .

Originally posted by DarthSkywalker0
I assume the list posted only applies to dueling as it is clearly evident based on TCW, that Sidous far outstrips Dooku in the Force. Sidious is also a superior duelist, but that is another can of worms. Oh yeah; I'm only looking at their saber prowess.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Omitting *Lucas, you mean?

Anyway, it's stated many times over dueling Sidious was far more challenging than dueling Dooku.

Here's two I found off-the-cuff:

https://i.imgur.com/u4DFpha.png https://i.imgur.com/w2VqZWH.png

It's also stated Yoda vs Dooku was a "warm-up" for Yoda relative to vs Sidious, etc.

It's really not even up for debate.

We can also look into the substance of their fights, and well, kek . . .
Citation needed.

Does that make sense? Yoda needing to retreat when it was clearly Sheev who was as seen in the movie transcript?

I'd imagine that fighting Sidious, someone who relies on raw emotions and aggressive fighting far more than a calm, collected, and graceful Dooku, would be a different experience for Yoda

>

Of what?

>

Uh, it says right there why it's a different experience - Yoda was almost overwhelmed. Don't play dumb with me.

---


Simply compare their fights:

The primary sources either depict Yoda outright annihlating Dooku or Yoda immediately putting Dooku on the defensive. Even in the latter case, it's a heavily one-sided battle. Dooku's offensive is utterly incapable of doing anything, for Yoda handles it without even budging an inch, then later moves so fast Dooku has difficulty even landing an attack. That's your best source scenario too, since others have Dooku outright gasping in awe over Yoda's swordsmanship.

Meanwhile, Sidious and Yoda exchange blows as equals for twice the time of Yoda and Dooku's entire fight. Sidious is not just able to handle Yoda's offensive until the final moments, but dish one out in return that threatened to overwhelm and kill Yoda. The fact Sidious was disarmed doesn't change his contention and can easily be attributed to Yoda's inherent advantage of fighting in a closed space where he's even able to stand eye-to-eye with Sidious.

Cite your sources

Harrison posted them on the last page.

@DarthSkywanker0



Not definitive nor in date. How the shit can one expect an accurate comparison of the characters from an out of universe source when most of their action has yet to be written. Nothing to say other than cool 2002 accolade bro. I have an updated one:



Now this is the kicker, wether Mace or Dooku were actually equals or not is unknown. The "perhaps" in the quote, especially considering the above statement from the Power of the Jedi, that Mace might be on par with Dooku on equal ground. Yet, the alternate is not that Mace could be more powerful, but instead that he might be less powerful.



He's might be more "skilled", from what ever limited narrative the ROTS novel is written in. Which can indeed make sense when isolate skill from force augmentation. The latter being more important in a fight.



Bring them forth.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Omitting *Lucas, you mean?

Anyway, it's stated many times over dueling Sidious was far more challenging than dueling Dooku.

Here's two I found off-the-cuff:

https://i.imgur.com/u4DFpha.png https://i.imgur.com/w2VqZWH.png

It's also stated Yoda vs Dooku was a "warm-up" for Yoda relative to vs Sidious, etc.

It's really not even up for debate.

We can also look into the substance of their fights, and well, kek . . .

Sidious was more challenging because he often employed Force powers in their duel.
I am starting to doubt of your 'debate' skills.

That's no where stated nor implied in those quotes (nor any source) as the reason of Yoda's difficulty.

Originally posted by Freedon Nadd
Sidious was more challenging because he often employed Force powers in their duel.
I am starting to doubt of your 'debate' skills.

Freedumb Nadd

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
That's no where stated nor implied in those quotes (nor any source) as the reason of Yoda's difficulty. So tell me where those images came from, and then explain why Yoda would be fearful for his life when Sidious was on the losing end the entire time as per the transcript.

Then explain to me how Sidious's "hated and fury" has anything to do with his prowess as a lightsaber duelist.

Is everyone just forgetting that Dooku was beaten by an injured Yoda on a darkside nexus? He is not his equal.

Originally posted by DarthSkywalker0
Freedumb Nadd

What is it, Cockpitsucker?

Originally posted by Nephthys
Is everyone just forgetting that Dooku was beaten by an injured Yoda on a darkside nexus? He is not his equal.

Geonosis? Or you mean the duel on Vjun?

Vjun.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
That's no where stated nor implied in those quotes (nor any source) as the reason of Yoda's difficulty.

Those two sources are stupid. In the left it says Yoda's mood equaled Palp's mood. And in the right it says Palp's mood>Yoda's mood.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Vjun.

Did Dooku really want to kill Yoda, though? I swear he never had any intention in killing Jedi(personally) That's why he didn't slash Yoda back on Geonosis when Yoda was busy helping Anakin and Obi-Wan.

up

"Yoda>Sidious>=Dooku>>>B-team"

Perhaps in a pure "skill", Dooku could be nearly equal to Yoda and Sidious, possibly Sidious' true equal or marginally superior.
But it's only a technical skill. Ant's statement as accurate, even with all of his skill, that matters in single combat, even against stronger enemy, Dooku was far froim being equal to Yoda nad Sidious in raw-power, speed and stamina. Dooku, Mace are below Yoda or Sidious. Either of them has never shown a capability to overhelm three Jedi Council members level at once, like Sidious did in ROTS and Yoda did in Shadow Hunter against Tiin, Koon and... was it Billaba, as I remember?

One tier difference might enable you to compete with stronger rival. That's why Dooku and Mace were able to compete with Yoda or Sidious, and that's why Fisto, Tiin or Bulq were able to compete with Dooku or Mace, but couldn't with Palpatine and Yoda.