Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Petranaki arena, 23.6 feet apart. Who wins.

Still haven't read your blog btw. Going to go with Yoda in a decent fight. Reasons - because genuinely competing with Sidious is better than strained comparisons with Luke. The former of which serves as a direct index of power, the latter of which doesn't. Reborn Krayt doesn't prove himself worthy of Yoda in Legacy either.

edit : this is factoring in the terrain advantage

What's strained about it?

Originally posted by ILS
What's strained about it?

The last time we debated this, your cardinal reason for Luke and Krayt's parity was the difference in how they tolerated injury to their essence, which reflects as physical pain. This is not a reliable index of power. Their polar Force alignments prevent it from being a passable comparison.

Yoda, although Krayt will pose a challenge.

Originally posted by JMANGO
The last time we debated this, your cardinal reason for Luke and Krayt's parity was the difference in how they tolerated injury to their essence, which reflects as physical pain. This is not a reliable index of power. Their polar Force alignments prevent it from being a passable comparison.

The biggest problem is that there was an indeterminate amount of time (implied to be a really long amount) where Luke is struggling physically with Abeloth and Krayt isn't (he is suffering from draining Luke, but it's stated that this is equal to Luke's damage from it, so it cancels out). This would obviously affect Luke's ability to defend against Abeloth's attacks, so that they suffered equal damages doesn't really suggest parity.

Yoda, but Krayt gives him a challenge.

Yoda.

Yoda, nice fight.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
The biggest problem is that there was an indeterminate amount of time (implied to be a really long amount) where Luke is struggling physically with Abeloth and Krayt isn't (he is suffering from draining Luke, but it's stated that this is equal to Luke's damage from it, so it cancels out). This would obviously affect Luke's ability to defend against Abeloth's attacks, so that they suffered equal damages doesn't really suggest parity.

Sort of like the Revan/Vitiate DS Nexus argument.

Can someone non-retarded post pls.

Originally posted by ILS
Can someone non-retarded post pls.

Krayt stomps

I believe Yoda advantage in skill/dueling/knowledge, would pull him the win, as I don't think the gap in strength is large enough.

Originally posted by JMANGO
The last time we debated this, your cardinal reason for Luke and Krayt's parity was the difference in how they tolerated injury to their essence, which reflects as physical pain. This is not a reliable index of power. Their polar Force alignments prevent it from being a passable comparison. It's not just a reflection of pain tolerance... hence why you should get reading.

The only caveat to Krayt's performance overall is that he drained Luke, at first quite hard, then much more mildly, then briefly hard again, while also screaming in pain from draining Abeloth. Other than that, they suffered the same injuries, and Krayt did more than his fair share of damage to Abeloth by ripping her essence out from the inside and draining her.

As for Krayt suffering "just as much damage as Luke" - it can be both true that he suffered just as much damage and more. It's hardly a balanced equation to begin with seeing as Luke being drained and Krayt absorbing the Essence of a deity that makes the water steam and makes him scream in pain are two totally different types of damage. When Luke realises he is "not being betrayed" it's because Krayt receives no apparent benefit from draining Abeloth other than sustaining massive pain and injury, and draining Luke is a countermeasure.

We can also glean how impactful Krayt is on the fight from how others compared to Abeloth at the time. Ben Skywalker in Oneness and Vestara Khai drawing on the Font of Power barely budged an avatar of Abeloth with their most powerful attacks. Krayt and Luke killed her physical form in tandem, in a battle where they sustained mostly identical injuries.

If the importance of all of that manages to become lost on anyone, I'm not able to help them.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
The biggest problem is that there was an indeterminate amount of time (implied to be a really long amount) where Luke is struggling physically with Abeloth and Krayt isn't (he is suffering from draining Luke, but it's stated that this is equal to Luke's damage from it, so it cancels out). This would obviously affect Luke's ability to defend against Abeloth's attacks, so that they suffered equal damages doesn't really suggest parity. Clearly you aren't reading the same fight as everyone else, because in the moment you are describing, Luke has Abeloth in a choke hold from behind while Krayt has his arm buried in her chest in front of her. Hence:

"She began to roll her head around, gnashing and spitting, trying to sink her fangs into Luke's arm or the stranger's-anything she could reach."

" The stranger was tumbling with them, his hand still buried in Abeloth's chest, now wailing in agony as gleaming black Force energy steamed from his wounds."

For this indeterminate amount of time she was trying to attack both of them. Also, Krayt wasn't suffering from draining Luke (???) he was suffering from draining Abeloth. Luke was a counterbalance.

The thing I find most intriguing is that Abeloth's main attack is forcing her tentacles, which is basically just her Essence, into her opponents, much like how Krayt and Luke strike her. So Krayt deliberately draining her essence inside his body, and inside his wounds, means that he had to do the equivalent of absorbing her tentacles. This is also reflected in how a little bit of Abeloth remained stuck in Luke's chest-wound in Crucible.

So yeah, it actually seems like Krayt was the hero of the day. Luke had to deal with some mild draining while Krayt risked killing himself by absorbing Abeloth into his own being. Both were being attacked by her at the same time.

Two Krayts could have won that fight, two Lukes wouldn't have stood a chance, seeing how his attacks did little to no damage.

Originally posted by ILS
We can also glean how impactful Krayt is on the fight from how others compared to Abeloth at the time. Ben Skywalker in Oneness and Vestara Khai drawing on the Font of Power barely budged an avatar of Abeloth with their most powerful attacks. Krayt and Luke killed her physical form in tandem, in a battle where they sustained mostly identical injuries.

More impressive than that is the fact that Luke and Krayt are basically mortal approximations of the Son and Daughter. It was their job to deal with Abeloth every time she woke up, and Luke and Krayt successfully stood in for them, more or less.

Now Abeloth also had a couple of avatars in the real world, so Luke and Krayt's feat doesn't quite match the Ones', but they did fight the bulk of her Force essence and prevailed.

The fight was beyond lightsaber forms or Force techniques, it was a battle of pure will and intrinsic power - Force Essence. Luke and Krayt are the closest mortals ever got the the power of the Ones.

Palpatine and Yoda just don't measure up.

How poetic.

give yoda 5 banes, then krayt might have a chance

Yoda. I think he's too elusive and too powerful for Krayt to get him with DT and he remains a superior swordsman. Krayt has never faced an opponent on Yoda's level in a duel nor has experience against Yoda's unique characteristics. Krayt's other Force abilities shouldn't pose a threat to Yoda either imo.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Yoda. I think he's too elusive and too powerful for Krayt to get him with DT and he remains a superior swordsman. Krayt has never faced an opponent on Yoda's level in a duel nor has experience against Yoda's unique characteristics. Krayt's other Force abilities shouldn't pose a threat to Yoda either imo.
how does bane beat yoda then lol

The Orbalisks pose a significant advantage against Yoda since it severely limits his ability to land an effective hit on Bane. He pretty much needs to jump pretty high to hit Banes head which puts him at considerable risk and even going for his wrists would be a challenge. Bane would be even more able to go apeshit without worrying about defense.

wat about DOE without orbalisks tho lol

Yoda would utterly rape Bane lol. As would Krayt.

Originally posted by ILS
Yoda would utterly rape Bane lol. As would Krayt.
bane has experience against yodas unique characteristics

In that case he oneshots

Originally posted by The.D0minator
wat about DOE without orbalisks tho lol

I don't believe I've ever argued DoE Bane could beat Yoda.

''Bane has an awesome lightsaber feat at the start of DoE where he stands in a howling storm and blocks every raindrop that comes near him. When we analysed that scene it made Bane out to be a legendarily good duelist. Yoda is also amazing, as seen in his fight with Sidious, but I still think Bane wins.

As for the Force I still believe that Yoda has nothing to threaten Bane with and its only a matter of time until Bane overwhelms him.''
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f86/t565655.html

http://www.kanyetothe.com/forum/Smileys/default/cQs0wlc.png

2012, damn u got me

ngl kek

Originally posted by Nephthys
2012, damn u got me

Originally posted by Nephthys
I don't believe I've ever argued DoE Bane could beat Yoda.
http://www.kanyetothe.com/forum/Smileys/default/5wZdQMI.png

Krayt's performance against Abeloth does not mean that he's more powerful or similarly powerful to Luke. It just means he was doing more in that specific instance. If Luke had done what Krayt did in that fight, he would have survived without the problems Krayt faced. Luke is much more powerful than Krayt. Yoda is not quite as much more powerful, but he is still a little more powerful. Krayt doesn't compare to fighters like DE Sidious and Yoda. He's maybe on their tier, could maybe hold out, but he would lose, especially without the most powerful force user in history backing him up.

Originally posted by Zentrex
Krayt's performance against Abeloth does not mean that he's more powerful or similarly powerful to Luke. It just means he was doing more in that specific instance. If Luke had done what Krayt did in that fight, he would have survived without the problems Krayt faced. Luke is much more powerful than Krayt.
Name one thing Luke did in that fight that Krayt couldn't do.

Kick Abeloth's knee?

On the contrary, everthing Luke did in that fight, Krayt did better.

Krayt>Palpatine and Yoda confirmed.

Yoda. Good fight.

Yoda wins.

Look at all of these posts without arguments, just like CV.

Krayt's fight with Abeloth puts him on a higher level. Krayt was tanking attacks from the same Abeloth that was giving Luke trouble and Luke's feats >>>>> Yoda's. So by powerscaling, Krayt >>>>> Yoda.

Happy?

I dig it.