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We will have two fights.

1) Grandmaster vs. Post-Flashpoint Zeus (DC).
2) Grandmaster vs. Zeus (DC) that is an amalgamation of Pre and Post Flashpoint feats.

What are DC Zeus' best feats and fights? I know he is/was a member of the Quintessence. That's a group of people that includes : Phantom Stranger, Ganthet, Shazam, and High Father. Going by implied power.............. DC Zeus.

But as many forum members know, I'm not a fan of that metric. Going by on panel feats and fights, it's got to be Classic Grandmaster. But remember I said CLASSIC Grandmaster. Current probably gets his @$# kicked.

So you don't want to use the Rulk two-shot showing, zop?

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
So you don't want to use the Rulk two-shot showing, zop?
That was Loebforce Rulk (he ones hot a Watcher and went up against Dormammu). So I actually don't hold that against him.

Originally posted by zopzop
That was Loebforce Rulk (he ones hot a Watcher and went up against Dormammu). So I actually don't hold that against him.

He did nothing against Dormammu, just threatened him and flew through him when leaving his dimension. And he had Surfer's power then.

And it was still a purely physical beatdown , Loeb just had no respect for the durability of Elders.

And other writers don't care either. Elders were never known for being true powerhouses. I see pussies everywhere from the Champion to Runner...

--

The so-called "Grandmaster Prime" had the best feat ever against the Hulk, lol. He got hurt, but he got the job done, at least.

Don't hate on the new guy!

Originally posted by zopzop
What are DC Zeus' best feats and fights? I know he is/was a member of the Quintessence. That's a group of people that includes : Phantom Stranger, Ganthet, Shazam, and High Father. Going by implied power.............. DC Zeus.

But as many forum members know, I'm not a fan of that metric. Going by on panel feats and fights, it's got to be Classic Grandmaster. But remember I said CLASSIC Grandmaster. Current probably gets his @$# kicked.

DC Zeus' power has fluctuated and he's become more powerful ever since his merger with his roman counterpart in Genesis era, but shortly after he was mentioned to be weakened in Wonder woman's series due to a decrease in the amount of worshipers (this is pre-Flashpoint).

With that said, here are a list of his feats:

- Defeated a powerful god who has cosmic power over the heaven and allegedly created worlds and stars.
- defeated the titans and Cronus
- Along with Hades, defeated an amped Ares.
- a shared feat with other gods where they defeated a universal level entity (shattered god)
- can access hypertime
- Zeus, Jove and Odin -- quite impressively -- split up the source
- a who's who bio also alluded to Zeus' power by saying that destiny (of the endless) was the only one who is above Zeus (though probably hyperbole).
- Linked the earthly realm with olympus.

With that said, Grandmaster still wins. And GM is undoubtedly above highfather, Shazam and ganthet. Only one who has a chance is phantom stranger, but i won't delve into that too much since it's off topic.

Originally posted by operator616
DC Zeus' power has fluctuated and he's become more powerful ever since his merger with his roman counterpart in Genesis era, but shortly after he was mentioned to be weakened in Wonder woman's series due to a decrease in the amount of worshipers (this is pre-Flashpoint).

With that said, here are a list of his feats:

- Defeated a powerful god who has cosmic power over the heaven and allegedly created worlds and stars.
- defeated the titans and Cronus
- Along with Hades, defeated an amped Ares.
- a shared feat with other gods where they defeated a universal level entity (shattered god)
- can access hypertime
- Zeus, Jove and Odin -- quite impressively -- split up the source
- a who's who bio also alluded to Zeus' power by saying that destiny (of the endless) was the only one who is above Zeus (though probably hyperbole).
- Linked the earthly realm with olympus.

With that said, Grandmaster still wins. And GM is undoubtedly above highfather, Shazam and ganthet. Only one who has a chance is phantom stranger, but i won't delve into that too much since it's off topic.

You think he's above DCnU Highfather, who fought Darkseid?

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
He did nothing against Dormammu, just threatened him and flew through him when leaving his dimension. And he had Surfer's power then.

And it was still a purely physical beatdown , Loeb just had no respect for the durability of Elders.

And other writers don't care either. Elders were never known for being true powerhouses. I see pussies everywhere from the Champion to Runner...

--

The so-called "Grandmaster Prime" had the best feat ever against the Hulk, lol. He got hurt, but he got the job done, at least.

Don't hate on the new guy!

I agree that elders in general are weaksauce; there are thousands of them after all. Surfer and quasar and thunderstrike have also beaten elders, but they vary in power. You have absolutely shitty ones like the obliterator, to powerful ones like the Stranger, Ego and Grandmaster to borderline abstracts like the inbetweener.

Originally posted by Zack M
You think he's above DCnU Highfather, who fought Darkseid?

I was referring to the pre-FP HF who was part of the quintessence.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW


The so-called "Grandmaster Prime" had the best feat ever against the Hulk, lol. He got hurt, but he got the job done, at least.


"Grandmaster Prime"? So is that when the GM thought about becoming a Rap Star back in the day?

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/l26x8oo1KIg/hqdefault.jpg

Originally posted by Flyattractor
"Grandmaster Prime"? So is that when the GM thought about becoming a Rap Star back in the day?

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/l26x8oo1KIg/hqdefault.jpg

The Challenger is Grandmaster Prime.

What are you even doing here?

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
The Challenger is Grandmaster Prime.

What are you even doing here?

Having FUN! Why are YOU Here!?

Originally posted by Flyattractor
Having FUN! Why are YOU Here!?




Shaking my head at your inability to browse through this forum.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Shaking my head at your inability to browse through this forum.

So you are NOT Having Fun then.


Sucks to be you mate.


NOT ME THO!!!!!!!!

Originally posted by Flyattractor
So you are NOT Having Fun then.


Sucks to be you mate.


NOT ME THO!!!!!!!!




https://m.popkey.co/63ebe2/bb59_f-maxage-0_s-200x150.gif

Originally posted by operator616
DC Zeus' power has fluctuated and he's become more powerful ever since his merger with his roman counterpart in Genesis era, but shortly after he was mentioned to be weakened in Wonder woman's series due to a decrease in the amount of worshipers (this is pre-Flashpoint).

With that said, here are a list of his feats:

- Defeated a powerful god who has cosmic power over the heaven and allegedly created worlds and stars.
- defeated the titans and Cronus
- Along with Hades, defeated an amped Ares.
- a shared feat with other gods where they defeated a universal level entity (shattered god)
- can access hypertime
- Zeus, Jove and Odin -- quite impressively -- split up the source
- a who's who bio also alluded to Zeus' power by saying that destiny (of the endless) was the only one who is above Zeus (though probably hyperbole).
- Linked the earthly realm with olympus.

With that said, Grandmaster still wins. And GM is undoubtedly above highfather, Shazam and ganthet. Only one who has a chance is phantom stranger, but i won't delve into that too much since it's off topic.
How is Grandmaster above Ganthet, Shazam and Highfather?

How big is olympus?

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
How big is olympus?

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
https://m.popkey.co/63ebe2/bb59_f-maxage-0_s-200x150.gif

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW


http://i.imgur.com/XH0CoHU.gif

Originally posted by abhilegend
How is Grandmaster above Ganthet, Shazam and Highfather?

Because they don't have an answer to GM's reality warping powers. Phantom Stranger on the other hand has actually resisted reality warping at least 2 times that i recall of (and at other times he didn't, so it's debatable).

It wasn't nerfed. Even the anti life equation was stated to be literally nothing when compared to the power of the source in that arc.

Originally posted by operator616
Because they don't have an answer to GM's reality warping powers. Phantom Stranger on the other hand has actually resisted reality warping at least 2 times that i recall of (and at other times he didn't, so it's debatable).
Grandmaster is now a reality warper? Highfather and Ganthet have warped reality too then. In fact a random machine created by a guardian has warped reality on planetary scale.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Grandmaster is now a reality warper? Highfather and Ganthet have warped reality too then. In fact a random machine created by a guardian has warped reality on planetary scale.

When have they warped reality? And i mean as individuals so no shared feats or tech feats.

Originally posted by operator616
When have they warped reality? And i mean as individuals so no shared feats or tech feats.
Highfather warped reality on every planet destroyed by Shi'vva to change it the way it was and cured a whole city turned into animals and wiped their memories.

Ganthet did the same when a female guardian devastated the whole planet. Also child guardians could make entire species extinct by simple thought.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Highfather warped reality on every planet destroyed by Shi'vva to change it the way it was and cured a whole city turned into animals and wiped their memories.


Ill look into it.

Originally posted by abhilegend

Ganthet did the same when a female guardian devastated the whole planet. Also child guardians could make entire species extinct by simple thought.

Is this the child guardian in Kyle's series or were you referring to something else? Because i don't recall any reality warping going on in there.

Originally posted by operator616
Ill look into it.

No need to.

Highfather returns an entire town back to normal after the people were turned into animals and the town was destroyed.

https://s6.postimg.cc/maoweynht/Mister_Miracle.v2_002.Imbie.20.jpg
https://s6.postimg.cc/e3wwndxf5/Mister_Miracle.v2_002.Imbie.21.jpg
https://s6.postimg.cc/j1ah8hze9/Mister_Miracle.v2_002.Imbie.22.jpg



Highfather restores all the worlds after they were destroyed by Si'vaa even after he was absorbed by The Source.

https://s6.postimg.cc/m1vx2s035/New_Gods11-18.jpg
https://s6.postimg.cc/3nldysnsh/New_Gods11-20.jpg
https://s6.postimg.cc/fyeciv9td/New_Gods11-21.jpg



The same. Ganthet restored the whole planet with a wave of his hand.

https://s6.postimg.cc/5393sjywh/GL161_16.jpg

What do you think happened there?

Current Zeus is still a skyfather and scales to Odin who have better feats than Dc Zeus

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
Current Zeus is still a skyfather and scales to Odin who have better feats than Dc Zeus

Odin has lesser showings than Zeus too.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Odin has lesser showings than Zeus too. Well yeah modern Odin sucks, I was talking Classic and everybody have low ends

Originally posted by abhilegend
No need to.

Highfather returns an entire town back to normal after the people were turned into animals and the town was destroyed.

https://s6.postimg.cc/maoweynht/Mister_Miracle.v2_002.Imbie.20.jpg
https://s6.postimg.cc/e3wwndxf5/Mister_Miracle.v2_002.Imbie.21.jpg
https://s6.postimg.cc/j1ah8hze9/Mister_Miracle.v2_002.Imbie.22.jpg



Highfather restores all the worlds after they were destroyed by Si'vaa even after he was absorbed by The Source.

https://s6.postimg.cc/m1vx2s035/New_Gods11-18.jpg
https://s6.postimg.cc/3nldysnsh/New_Gods11-20.jpg
https://s6.postimg.cc/fyeciv9td/New_Gods11-21.jpg



Where was it mentioned that highfather restored all the worlds? All i read is that he restored the new genesis city. And restoration is not the same as reality warping which is manipulating space/time.

Originally posted by abhilegend


The same. Ganthet restored the whole planet with a wave of his hand.

https://s6.postimg.cc/5393sjywh/GL161_16.jpg

What do you think happened there?

Again, no reality warping to be seen. And he merely restored the military force not the whole planet.

Originally posted by operator616
Where was it mentioned that highfather restored all the worlds? All i read is that he restored the new genesis city. And restoration is not the same as reality warping which is manipulating space/time.

Metron mentioned that everything is better than previously.

What would be manipulation of space time? Because I'm not seeing any feats from Grandmaster that mentions reality warping?

The whole planet was devastated and Ganthet restored it.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Metron mentioned that everything is better than previously.


He says so while looking at the new genesis city and we've shown on panel HF restoring the city and not any other planet.

Originally posted by abhilegend

What would be manipulation of space time? Because I'm not seeing any feats from Grandmaster that mentions reality warping?

The whole planet was devastated and Ganthet restored it.

Yes you did see it in the GM vs Darkseid thread. What you're posting is matter manipulation not space/time. Surfer has several molecular/matter manipulation feats and hal has manipulated matter and atomic structure of things on multiple occasions, and similar to your restoration feats, he restored evolution across an entire planet. So are Hal and surfer reality warpers too? No they're matter manipulators (and minor ones at that too). The fabric of space/time is another thing entirely.

I don't see how came to that conclusion.

Originally posted by operator616
He says so while looking at the new genesis city and we've shown on panel HF restoring the city and not any other planet.

That's not what Metron said.

Would you like to share these reality warping feats for Grandmaster?

Surfer or Hal have not restored entire planets after they are devastated.

Also Grandmaster creating Squadron Sinister was retconned as him tapping into a wellspring of power.

https://s14.postimg.cc/ln01ru2zh/image.jpg https://s14.postimg.cc/ewjkiev99/image.jpg

So much for reality warping.

Highfather has cut apart space/time as well to show another cosmos where he could've banished Orion.

http://readcomiconline.to/Comic/The-New-Gods-1995/Issue-8?id=88511

Originally posted by abhilegend
Also Grandmaster creating Squadron Sinister was retconned as him tapping into a wellspring of power.

https://s14.postimg.cc/ln01ru2zh/image.jpg https://s14.postimg.cc/ewjkiev99/image.jpg

So much for reality warping.

What's his other low showings besides the Hulk one in recent marvel?

He lost to Baron Zemo with moonstone and Maestro.

Originally posted by abhilegend
He lost to Baron Zemo with moonstone and Maestro.


Can I see?

Although, moonstone isn't exactly weak o.O

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
Can I see?

Although, moonstone isn't exactly weak o.O

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
Contest of Champions #6 Pt 1/2

http://s6d7.turboimg.net/t/26323281_03.jpg http://s6d7.turboimg.net/t/26323282_04.jpg http://s6d7.turboimg.net/t/26323283_05.jpg http://s6d7.turboimg.net/t/26323285_06.jpg http://s6d7.turboimg.net/t/26323286_07.jpg http://s6d7.turboimg.net/t/26323288_08.jpg http://s6d7.turboimg.net/t/26323290_09.jpg http://s6d7.turboimg.net/t/26323292_10.jpg http://s6d7.turboimg.net/t/26323294_11.jpg http://s6d7.turboimg.net/t/26323296_12.jpg

Moonstone is hardly skyfather level.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Moonstone is hardly skyfather level.

Because Maestro had the Iso-Sphere?

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
Because Maestro had the Iso-Sphere?

Actually Grandmaster had Iso sphere. Grandmaster also backed down from Monica Rambeau as well in his own home.

Originally posted by abhilegend
That's not what Metron said.


So no conclusive proof for your claims then? Even you must admit that your interpretation is ambiguous at best.

And either way why are you equating restoration with space/time manipulation? Your feats count as matter manipulation, all they did is put the system back to its previous state (which i guess counts as entropic manipulation as well). And resurrecting people isn't space/time manipulation either. It's jump-starting neutrons again or soul manipulation depending if the writer takes a reductionist or non-reductionist approach to this matter.

You are confused as to what exactly entails space/time or reality warping. Im assuming you're not familiar with special/general relativity? Einstein taught us that space and time are malleable things just like matter is; space/time is continuous and not quantized like matter is but nonetheless it can be warped (hence there are things called length contraction and time dilation). What you're posting is merely matter/atomic manipulation, non of these instances entails manipulating space-time or reality.

Originally posted by abhilegend

Would you like to share these reality warping feats for Grandmaster?


Original GM was an absolute beast. He could literally wipe beings from existence, as if they never even existed. And he could have done it to the whole planet too:

https://imgur.com/bJtln3b
https://imgur.com/ouo7ILE

He has almost complete control over space/time and able to alter history as he deems it to be:

https://imgur.com/5tilBux

He granted Kang the power to casually beat the avengers and cap mentioned that his power is greater than even the cosmic cube:

https://imgur.com/Yupd4Gf

When Makkari went into hyperspeed mode and beat the runner, he got stuck in that mode and everyone appeared to him as statues, except other speedsters or beings who can actually manipulate space/time like the Grandmaster:

https://imgur.com/pJorq8o

He can create things out of nothing:

https://imgur.com/lwt6Pxz

A reality re-writer indeed:

https://imgur.com/u1blQqu

When you look at GM and compare him with highfather and ganthet, it's quite clear that they have different power sets.

Originally posted by abhilegend

Surfer or Hal have not restored entire planets after they are devastated.

Hal has literally re-structured the JLA members atom by atom when they were vaporized with a molecular de-adhesion gun. It's the exact same as your feats only on a smaller scale. And either way, Kyle has re-created an entire world in GL annual #6. And silver surfer has restored a planet in silver surfer v3 #104 and in v5 #14.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Also Grandmaster creating Squadron Sinister was retconned as him tapping into a wellspring of power.

https://s14.postimg.cc/ln01ru2zh/image.jpg https://s14.postimg.cc/ewjkiev99/image.jpg

So much for reality warping.

Why does it matter what's his power source? Do we say Dr Strange can't call upon principalities in a forum fight? Because if not he'd be technically powerless. Or better yet, do you see me saying that HF can't use his staff which taps into the power of the source? Because without it he's weak as sh*t.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Highfather has cut apart space/time as well to show another cosmos where he could've banished Orion.

http://readcomiconline.to/Comic/The-New-Gods-1995/Issue-8?id=88511

cutting time/space in comics usually means opening portals, you should know that by now. And while that technically is space/time maipulation, it's a minor thing to do and doesn't make you a reality warper. Thor does it on the regular.

Originally posted by operator616
So no conclusive proof for your claims then? Even you must admit that your interpretation is ambiguous at best.

Right, these are ambiguous but not for grandmaster.

Uh-huh. Only what you say is reality manipulation. Nothing else counts.

Thanks for the science lecture for the thing I already know.

Yes, from his original appearance where every villain shines. This ability never shows up again.

Retconned away.

Silver age hyperbole at its best.

Not reality warping. Someone like Zoom can do better than that.

That's like GL lite.

Right, being mentioned in a sentence with actual reality warper makes you a reality warper when Grandmaster has never done something like that.

No, they are all plot devices who can do pretty much anything story requires. Ganthet has literally ripped space time apart with his bare hands.

Kyle was in such a realm where imagine could create substance.

Surfer didn't restore any planet in either SS 104 or v5 14. What are you talking about?

Because both Strange and Highfather use that power in pretty much every appearance and if they aren't, it's explicitly mentioned.

Grandmaster doesn't. This is just nonsense you're talking now.

Right, when Grandmaster does it, it's reality manipulation but when highfather does it, it isn't.

Originally posted by abhilegend
You haven't read much I guess then.

Oh I forgot, everyone in marvel is skyfather level now. Well unless you can show it, and Zemo with moonstone is op af

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
Well unless you can show it, and Zemo with moonstone is op af
Right.

http://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Contest-of-Champions-2015/Issue-7?id=38864

Right, Zemo was such a powerhouse. Skyfather material, right?

I thought Zeus would have more feats to make this competitive if we included pre-flashpoint...disappointed.

Originally posted by Baziemarc123
What's his other low showings besides the Hulk one in recent marvel?

Wouldnt consider being hurt by a pissed Hulk a low showing.

Originally posted by abhilegend
He is high herald level, nothing more. Exactly Zemo with moonstone is high herald level