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https://i.imgur.com/VNAyPR4.jpg

vs

https://i.imgur.com/NVrUXDh.jpg

A few years ago I would've said Maxima.

Maxima destroys her. You can even make this Excalibur era Rachel with the PF and she'd still lose.

Maxima ftw.

Shut up, idiot.

Well, Rachel was inexperienced during that era. Nearly Everyone beat her and she was my favorite character at the time. What has she done recently?

Originally posted by krisblaze
Shut up, idiot.



anyway, depends which version obviously. current has some pretty good feats i think though. only read a few of her recent appearances but she's pretty uber. phoenix shard was powerful enough to match glads in h2h. she'd need to be at least that level to win this though and i'm not 100% sure she's there. her tp is uber though. it'not impossible she could out-skill max who i don't think near the tp skill feats rachel has.

i dunno. not easy for max, regardless.

Telepathic wise, it might be a wash. Maxims did dominate Brainwave in the astral plane. And he's a very uber telepath, from what I remember.

Maxima.

Originally posted by Zack M
Telepathic wise, it might be a wash. Maxims did dominate Brainwave in the astral plane. And he's a very uber telepath, from what I remember.

WTF if your referring to Extreme Justice everything you said is ass about face.

1. Maxima is stated to be supreme in the astral plane not BW.
2. She outright stated he was more powerful than her despite only facing "1 aspect" of his persona (a piece of his late fatjers persona in his crazy state)
3. He was fighting the rest of extreme justice team (cap Atom, Firestorm, Amazimgman, Plastique, Booster Gold, Blue Beetle and the wonder twins) at the same time in the real world with his 3d mental projections.
4. She had a plot win by psychoanalysing him and making him beat himself.

Hardly a showing on her behalf in TP power.

Originally posted by beatboks
WTF if your referring to Extreme Justice everything you said is ass about face.

1. Maxima is stated to be supreme in the astral plane not BW.
2. She outright stated he was more powerful than her despite only facing "1 aspect" of his persona (a piece of his late fatjers persona in his crazy state)
3. He was fighting the rest of extreme justice team (cap Atom, Firestorm, Amazimgman, Plastique, Booster Gold, Blue Beetle and the wonder twins) at the same time in the real world with his 3d mental projections.
4. She had a plot win by psychoanalysing him and making him beat himself.

Hardly a showing on her behalf in TP power.

You're right. She did incapacitate him, though. I was just going by these feats. Who do you have?

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=547416&pagenumber=1

Not equipped to make an informed decision as Ive seen very little of Rachel. I dont like to speculate on battles where I'm unfamiliar with one combatant. Entered tje thread hoping to learn more about her since I know Maxima pretty well. So a comparison would be illuminating

Split

Originally posted by leonidas


anyway, depends which version obviously. current has some pretty good feats i think though. only read a few of her recent appearances but she's pretty uber. phoenix shard was powerful enough to match glads in h2h. she'd need to be at least that level to win this though and i'm not 100% sure she's there. her tp is uber though. it'not impossible she could out-skill max who i don't think near the tp skill feats rachel has.

i dunno. not easy for max, regardless.
She's actually performing better in many regards without the Blue Phoenix Echo. Blocking full blown Mjolnir strikes, and generally getting the better of Thor before their fight is interrupted. (Fight is from multiple perspectives from different tie-ins.)
https://postimg.cc/image/457805nrr/
https://postimg.cc/image/wuu3wszhj/
https://postimg.cc/image/9qtn47913/
https://postimg.cc/image/n7qln2r2f/

The Shi'ar Death Commando, Black Cloak, was beating the hell out of an all-out Gladiator. Rachel, in one shot, exploded his head...
https://postimg.cc/image/wjcnjjqlz/
https://postimg.cc/image/wjcnjjybr/
https://postimg.cc/image/cbz7r98k7/

Interestingly, she avoided that street leveler jobber aura during AvX. She was about the only person allowed to punk Captain America. Smashed him with his own shield.
https://postimg.cc/image/gha4dnbmf/

Dominated Black Panther and Iron Fist too.
https://postimg.cc/image/wuu3wbmhj/

Telepathy wise-

Overwhelmed Xavier Jr.
https://postimg.cc/image/3w9n9pvef/
https://postimg.cc/image/8i5ri2onb/

For reference, Xavier mind-controlled his own timeline's Xorn, who was really the adult version of Teen Jean. Xorn Jean took out Emma, the Cuckoo's and Teen Jean. Teen Jean lasted because Xorn Jean held back, as revealed later.
https://postimg.cc/image/3xon0gllz/
https://postimg.cc/image/nsaomlnyv/
https://postimg.cc/image/4zytj1707/
https://postimg.cc/image/7u1ywh1gn/

He later mind-controlled a line-up of X-Men that included The Cuckoo's, Magik(who has some TP defense), Emma and most importantly, Teen Jean who was using her psychic drain abilities at the time. For reference, Teen Jean can drain The Phoenix and amp to overpower Galactus.
https://postimg.cc/image/jhqytyhpz/
https://postimg.cc/image/ydpi1k0uf/
https://postimg.cc/image/rn90s4lef/

Even with less psychic energy present, Teen Jean can easily amp and stalemate Gladiator, who is trying to kill her.
https://postimg.cc/image/9x7c742on/
https://postimg.cc/image/60u0b4x4n/
https://postimg.cc/image/w9550ioxz/
https://postimg.cc/image/ne4apzkpz/

The fact that Xavier Jr, in spite of Teen Jean's draining, was still capable of doing that, albeit losing in the end, is pretty neato. Rachel still slapped him all on her own though.

Hype-wise, the Avengers had a mission briefing concerning the issue of Rachel(and Emma, although that is later dismissed) during AvX. They seem pretty wary of fighting her, even with Thor.
https://postimg.cc/image/kmq2wo0af/
https://postimg.cc/image/5e05iwtrb/
https://postimg.cc/image/ch80yirh3/

The Avengers then conducted an entire mission with Xavier just to take Rachel off the board during AvX. She was considered that much of threat otherwise, and she still gave Xavier hell before going down. Considering how casually Xavier shutdown everyone else, this is a really good showing.
https://postimg.cc/image/7vbwq23c7/
https://postimg.cc/image/ctzf4leuv/
https://postimg.cc/image/o6c0mdv9j/
https://postimg.cc/image/ovusyr3iv/

Originally posted by StyleTime

He later mind-controlled a line-up of X-Men that included The Cuckoo's, Magik(who has some TP defense), Emma and most importantly, Teen Jean who was using her psychic drain abilities at the time.

https://postimg.cc/image/4r18t5jxz/
https://postimg.cc/image/f13nsep93/
https://postimg.cc/image/4e9umzotj/

Forgot to include that. They break free eventually due to Teen Jean's energy drain, but the fact that it worked at all is impressive.

As for the match, interesting fight. Maxima, as with all these MaximaVsPsychic threads, has high level physical stats to fall back on.

that was a lot of work.

i of course read avx and have seen most of those feats but for whatever reason forgot them. i thought the echo was still around when she faced thor. too many incarnations for her i guess, but thanks for digging all that up.

still not sure it would be enough to beat max for a majority--max has held CONTINENTS together with TK--but she'd def take some and like i said, i think she is def more skilled in tp. of course, rachel has opened a black hole, so there is that to consider...

close match overall.

Question, because I know very little about Rachel-

Which of her abilities would you guys say are actually better than Maxima's?

Rachel was created to be a hound. If she searches for something she can usually find it.
Whatever it takes to defeat her enemies she'll find and use.

This thing is still going on?

In TK : Maxima. Rachel has ONE decent TK feat compared to numerous ones for Max.

In physical stats : LOL. Maxima. No contest.

In TP : Maxima. Even if you believe Rachael is the better telepath (lol), Maxima is more than capable of holding her off while she crushes the life out of her with her bare hands.

How does Maxima lose this?

Originally posted by Galan007
Question, because I know very little about Rachel-

Which of her abilities would you guys say are actually better than Maxima's?

i'd say for certain she is the more skilled tp. if it came to an astral battle for instance--something i think rachel could def force--i'd would 100% take rachel. feat for feat, rachel>max in tp, imo, or its a wash. for sure rachel>max in terms of SKILLED feats. not even close tbh. max has powerful psi-blasting feats, and some good resistance feats, but very few...intricate feats and rachel's mind is too protected imo for her to be ko'd by a mind blast.

again, tk is close. black hole vs continent on the high ends? rachel handling gladiator, max fighting supes but often with physical stats as well as tk? but rachel's tk let's her hang with thor--no way she can't hang with max.

there really isn't any way this is anything but very close imo.

Best TK feat for Maxima is creating a psionic highway for most of her planet's people across her galaxy to earth.

https://s22.postimg.cc/5glqos871/image.jpg https://s22.postimg.cc/oyge4qcul/image.jpg

It's notable because her galaxy is 100 trillion lightyears away from Earth.

https://s8.postimg.cc/i4gz6utrl/image.jpg https://s8.postimg.cc/3y18bmqm9/image.jpg

^ that's crazy, she's above rachel's level for sure

I don't know anything about Maxima but Rachel saved every physical light in existance.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Best TK feat for Maxima is creating a psionic highway for most of her planet's people across her galaxy to earth.

https://s22.postimg.cc/5glqos871/image.jpg https://s22.postimg.cc/oyge4qcul/image.jpg

It's notable because her galaxy is 100 trillion lightyears away from Earth.

https://s8.postimg.cc/i4gz6utrl/image.jpg https://s8.postimg.cc/3y18bmqm9/image.jpg

That's pretty uber.

Didn't Maxima beat and amp Brainaic in TP? During that Panic in the Sky arc.

when he was amped he was>>than she was and had her on her knees though she was resisting him, impressively. she beat him once he was cut off from his amp.

Originally posted by zopzop
In TP : Maxima. Even if you believe Rachael is the better telepath (lol),
I know this is a waste because you tend to be unwavering, but...

For even further reference,

The Cuckoos + Emma were about to take Legion out before Emma got sucker punched by Ruth.
https://postimg.cc/image/ylt7rv2uf/
https://postimg.cc/image/m76frl12f/

And, while this feat may not be allowed under standard rules, Emma does kill Legion all on her own in a possible future. Marvel, at the least, seems to think she's capable of it, even if we can't use the feat.
https://postimg.cc/image/x9biq5d6f/
https://postimg.cc/image/7qj6d51c7/

Future Young Jean slapped them all + Young Jean. Xavier Jr slapped Future Young Jean. Rachel slapped Xavier Jr.

Rachel's telepathy showing here is downright bonkers if we take it at face value. It's several slaps above the original slap dude.

I haven't followed the discussion, only in parts, so I don't know if this is relevant, but...

If I recall, Future Jean explicitly states that time travel affects telepathy, no?

Jean defeated Slipstream the guy who could move forward 5 seconds in time.

EDIT: The quote function is really not working at all for me. Trying to copy/paste to edit and wound up double posting by accident.

Found the scan, at last...

http://tinypic.com/r/2pt5tex/9

Originally posted by abhilegend
Best TK feat for Maxima is creating a psionic highway for most of her planet's people across her galaxy to earth.

https://s22.postimg.cc/5glqos871/image.jpg https://s22.postimg.cc/oyge4qcul/image.jpg

It's notable because her galaxy is 100 trillion lightyears away from Earth.

https://s8.postimg.cc/i4gz6utrl/image.jpg https://s8.postimg.cc/3y18bmqm9/image.jpg It's a great feat of psionic endurance, but in terms of raw TK strength, I still think Maxima pulling together continent-sized fissures while vastly weakened is a bit more quantifiable in a versus/battle setting. /shrug

Regardless, I've always found the psionic highway feat a bit odd, due to its absurd implications. After all, the speed at which Maxima and her people crossed that distance implies either:
a.) Their walking speed is many, many, many orders of magnitude beyond c.
OR
b.) That Maxima is capable of projecting said highway through space at many, many, many orders of magnitude beyond c.

Obviously the latter would be a bit more 'logical', but it still comes from out of nowhere given that most other times Maxima ventured to earth, she did so by way of spacecraft. /shrug

Originally posted by Galan007
It's a great feat of psionic endurance, but in terms of raw TK strength, I still think Maxima pulling together continent-sized fissures while vastly weakened is a bit more quantifiable in a versus/battle setting. /shrug

IMHO, Maxima creating an entire metal skyscraper is the more impressive feat. Not only did she assemble the thousands of tons of material to make the structure, she DESIGNED IT while assembling it. Instantly. That's power AND skill.

Didn't Rachel Grey sort of redesign the Phoenix force for herself.

Originally posted by zopzop
IMHO, Maxima creating an entire metal skyscraper is the more impressive feat. Not only did she assemble the thousands of tons of material to make the structure, she DESIGNED IT while assembling it. Instantly. That's power AND skill. Indeed, that feat is quite impressive. Among many things, it also depicts how fine-tuned/intricate Max's TK can be:
https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/39029527_P00008.jpg https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/39029528_P00009.jpg https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/39029529_P00010.jpg

https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/39029530_Extreme_Justice_1995-1996_006-001.jpg https://s7d1.turboimg.net/t1/39029531_Extreme_Justice_1995-1996_006-002.jpg




But imo, this is just a gargantuan showing of raw TK strength:
Originally posted by Galan007
Posted this in a different thread, but it is better-suited here...


A weakened Maxima uses TK to close one of the massive fissures created by Starbreaker, which nearly destroyed Almerac:
http://i.imgur.com/KG4wXeLm.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/TXOxJCYm.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/SuX1M8Jm.jpg

*Confirmation that she closed/sealed the fissure alone:
http://i.imgur.com/3ZLItjd.jpg

And as I said: Maxima was very weak at the time, as she had just been attacked by Starbreaker the issue prior:
http://i.imgur.com/jK4FQk5.jpg


To give you a sense of scale, here is how large the fissure(s) were:
http://i.imgur.com/bhD8eCEm.jpg


Had she not been "exhausted" at the time, even a feat of that magnitude would have been child's play... Max was crazy-powerful.