Originally posted by RealistRacism
The burden of proof is on you. I shouldn't have to write extra words addressing a point you haven't proven.
I didn't realise Dooku replenishing his force reserves as per the ROTS Novel was in dispute. If it is I'll have to dig up my copy of the ROTS novel to find it, but is that necessary when we both know it's there?
Originally posted by RealistRacism
Interesting. It seems you've discovered that the fight depicted in the novel is vastly different to the one in the movie - due to the omission of certain significant events - in which Dooku utterly dominates the duel until the very end. Obviously the sequence is longer in the book, because you have to cut out bits and pieces of scenes to make them fit within the time constraints of a movie. You simply can't use both forms of media at once to come to a conclusion, due to the aforementioned time limitations. So where does that leave us? Go by what's said in Stover's novel? Or George Lucas' higher canon movie? Before you say it;
1.) Yes I know George edited and approved the novel, but it doesn't matter. His higher canon movie shows a completely different set of events on the Invisible Hand.
2.) Yes, the novel was based closely off the script. Irrelevant for the same reason; George's Movie and final word > Script and Novel
You can't just pick and choose where the novel or movie matters more, consistency please
The RotS novel details an extended sequence in which chairs hurled at one another, Dooku lands physical strikes, hurls a table at Anakin and pins him against the wall etc. The duo were "raining blows almost at random" and "cutting chairs to pieces and Force-hurling them in every conceivable direction" and while Dooku may have been dealing with this easily, it'd still no doubt be expending a noticeable amount of his force energy simply because of the amount of time this was going on for. Except, you've ignored this fact and deferred straight to the movie. I guess that means I'm entitled to do the same to whichever part of the novel I don't like.
If you want to go off the movie - and only the movie - as evidence that the jobbing part of the fight was short, then I will base my answers on how the rest of the fight was shown in the movie - and only that;
1.) Dooku easily outmuscles Kenobi.
2.) He meets the duo's strength with one-hand above his head.
3.) Dooku pushes Kenobi to the ground.
4.) The Count starts to go up the stairs, then proceeds to fend off Anakin's strikes whilst walking up them backwards.
5.) Dooku meets the two combatants in a blade-lock once again, breaking it with such force that it staggers their weapons backwards, before ragdolling Kenobi and nonchalantly kicking Skywalker into a wall.
6.) Anakin kicks Dooku off the balcony and attacks him furiously. Dooku defends against all of these attacks and gives him a little half-smirk at 2:06; Count Dooku DOMINATES Two Handsome Men with his Curve-Shafted Red Rod
7.) The Count taunts Anakin into going full-dark side, he does and the old man dies.
George's intent was obvious; The duo are absolute trash to Dooku, until Anakin gets enraged
The New Legends rule here are the same as the Old Canon rules. Which are that the film takes priority.
Alan gave the example of the ROTS Novel stating Anakin couldn't see Palpatine moving against Windu because he moved so fast. Galan states that doesn't happen in the film, as he never see them Saber fight, so that part of the novel should be disregarded.
But what have I pointed from the novel that needs to be disregarded due to a blatant contradiction. It's you who keeps bringing up Dooku only lost due to tiring because he was under unfair circumstances. I just pointed to the movie to show he didn't actually fight the 2 of them together for very long. Like literally seconds.
Things that I brought up, like the Power of Anakin's blows are not contradicted, given Dooku is giving ground almost the entire fight, including up the stairs against Anakin alone.
As for parrying both their blows, that would be to do with positioning. Their Sabers meet mid way through Dooku's but near the top of the Duo's Sabers.
Dooku smirking also doesn't mean much, given even in the novel he uses Dun Moch on Anakin.
The bits of the novel I'm bringing up are what's going on in the combatants minds. The movie depiction can't possibly contradict that.
Now I get that if we completely ignore the novel, and completely ignore TCW series, and ONLY go by the movie, then yes of course there could be an argument for Dooku winning a 1 v 1 solo against Anakin.
However this isn't the movie only versus forum. This has now become the default Legends forum, which you were all for. That doesn't change when it doesn't suit your stance.
Originally posted by RealistRacism
Literally no concession... He uses a fraction of his power that was gathered over the course of about one second. This isn't what I said was exhausting the Count...
There's really nothing else there (in the movie) to exhaust him. And again if we go by the novel, Dooku reached out through the Force to replenish his Force Reserves anyway. Which again isn't/can't even be contradicted by the film, not that we see any reason why he'd need to in the film.
In any case the novel makes it pretty clear, the tiredness Dooku faced was due to fighting Skywalker. Kenobi had little to do with it.
Originally posted by RealistRacism
You applied the logic that his stamina was horrible based on a few seconds from the movie. In that fight, he was dominating and suffering from no such hinderance. The novel however, does make note of his age and waning reserves, but that's because the sequence at the beginning is far longer... Are you okay Thor? You may want to rethink this one.
Actually the script, which follows the movie sequence of events almost exactly, also refers to Dooku tiring as Anakin grows stronger.
There's really nothing to rethink unless you want to take this to the Movie Versus Forum. In which case I've already stated, based on that piece of evidence alone, of course an argument could be made for Dooku winning a 1 v 1 rematch against Skywalker.
But as soon as you include the novel or TCW that clearly isn't the case.
Originally posted by RealistRacism
So blows from a furious Anakin cost him more in reserves than a "whipcrack" of power? Wow, that's quite something.
Each blow, yeah, according to the novel.
Again supporting my case that if Dooku was tiring, it was all related to combating Anakin and had little/nothing to do with Obi-Wan.
Originally posted by RealistRacism
This is just false. You haven't even said anything of substance here, just the same tired, old talking points. Prove it, or shut up.
Well that's like your opinion.
I have at least gone through the movie clip as well as the novel. But it's not like your argument isn't the same old as well lol. Same old Dooku was tired, it wasn't fair on him.
