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Ordinary Kryptonians in Kandor with the boost of yellow sunlight.

Considering what a few of them did to Doomsday, I'd wager Kryptonians would win

Now, unless this is a very weak fodder kryptonian...

Darkseid wins. He easily handled billions of Daxamites via TP.

sadly, depends on which Darkseid shows up

Originally posted by MrMind
sadly, depends on which Darkseid shows up

If he isn't weakened, as he is currently, he wins.

Or is this one of those "showings I don't like don't count/are a fabricated avatar that has nothing to do with actual canon" arguments?

Has the real Darkseid ever fought Superman?

Originally posted by Stoic
Has the real Darkseid ever fought Superman? The real Darkseid only appeared in final crisis iirc, So legitimately Supes should never fought the real darkseid

Originally posted by qwertyuiop1998
The real Darkseid only appeared in final crisis iirc, So legitimately Supes should never fought the real darkseid

Prove this lie.

Darkseid legitimately one-shots them all.

^Scans^
https://i.imgur.com/UnSQlvE.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/rhwgIvK.jpg
And Morrison's interview

Originally posted by qwertyuiop1998
^Scans^
https://i.imgur.com/UnSQlvE.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/rhwgIvK.jpg
And Morrison's interview


Superman beat up Darkseid on Apokolips.

So this is irrelevant.

Originally posted by panthergod
Superman beat up Darkseid on Apokolips.

So this is irrelevant. But he never encounter Darkseid true form which been pointed by Darkseid and Batman( Also Morrison intended all we saw before FC new gods was just they projections)
And considering Brainiac even in his Milton form could beating a bunch of new gods including orion and lightray in new genesis so made me don't thinking they are the same multiversal version in Final Crisis and Post-Final Crisis( Like in Rebirth Wonder woman title stated them are across the multiverse)

Originally posted by qwertyuiop1998
But he never encounter Darkseid true form which been pointed by Darkseid and Batman( Also Morrison intended all we saw before FC new gods was just they projections)
And considering Brainiac even in his Milton form could beating a bunch of new gods including orion and lightray in new genesis so made me don't thinking they are the same multiversal version in Final Crisis and Post-Final Crisis( Like in Rebirth Wonder woman title stated them are across the multiverse)

This is a combination of out of context backwards rationalization and fanboy theorizing.

4th Worlds are dimensionally 'formatted' into the mortal realm via Boomtubes.

All Morrison did was consolidate and expand upon ideas that had already been established in Mark Evanier, Rachel Pollack's run and by Byrne.

In Final Crisis, Darkseid's full god consciousness 'fell' to Earth. He was NOT as *physically* powerful as 'Boss Darkseid' or while possessing Dan Turpin's body. likewise, Kalibak was not anywhere near his standard formwhile fighting Tawky ****ing Tawny as a peer. Desaad got a relative upgrade while possessing that Alpha Lantern.

Mind you, when Darksied stated that this was his 'true' form, he was in Dan Turpin's body. Morrison specifically made a distinction between the mortal forms they were possessing and their classical Celestial' bodies. His CONSCIOUSNESS was fully decended on Earth, causing the dispair among humanity after the embodiment of the heroic fighting spirit, Orion, was killed. Darkseid is an sentient IDEA more than a physical being. Morrison is drawing upon his knowledge of esoteric and how deities have differing aspects or 'portrayals'. Final Crisis Darksied was a conceptual amalgamation of every prior Darkseid portrayal, recognizing them as facets of the diamond that is the core concept of Darkseid, just as his All Star Superman was itended to be a 'primal' superman, merging all versions of the character into one( just as he ddi with Batman in his Batman run, just as He tried to do with Superman since the 'Superman 2000 aborted reboot whose elements was later brought to All Star, Birthright, Red Son, the Loeb/Berganza Era and the post IC Busiek/Johns runs)

So NO, this was not a full retcon of what had been previously established, as New Gods having 'full god-forms' far above their standard portrayals had been establish since at least Mark Evanier's New Gods run. Similarly, Gruenwald's M-Bodies concept don't mean that Galactus' didn't really get beaten by Thor under Lee and Kirby, for example. This was not a Byrne 'Doombot' or Starlin 'Thanos clone' battleboard excuse nonsense. This was meant to RECONCILE differing Darkseid portrayals, not render them irrelevant.


Superman beat up Darkseid in the Fourth World. in Apokolips Now. He was formatted 'up' to New God proportions. That has never been retconned.

Originally posted by panthergod
This is a combination of out of context backwards rationalization and fanboy theorizing.

4th Worlds are dimensionally 'formatted' into the mortal realm via Boomtubes.

All Morrison did was consolidate and expand upon ideas that had already been established in Mark Evanier, Rachel Pollack's run and by Byrne.

In Final Crisis, Darkseid's full god consciousness 'fell' to Earth. He was NOT as *physically* powerful as 'Boss Darkseid' or while possessing Dan Turpin's body. likewise, Kalibak was not anywhere near his standard formwhile fighting Tawky ****ing Tawny as a peer. Desaad got a relative upgrade while possessing that Alpha Lantern.

Mind you, when Darksied stated that this was his 'true' form, he was in Dan Turpin's body. Morrison specifically made a distinction between the mortal forms they were possessing and their classical Celestial' bodies. His CONSCIOUSNESS was fully decended on Earth, causing the dispair among humanity after the embodiment of the heroic fighting spirit, Orion, was killed. Darkseid is an sentient IDEA more than a physical being. Morrison is drawing upon his knowledge of esoteric and how deities have differing aspects or 'portrayals'. Final Crisis Darksied was a conceptual amalgamation of every prior Darkseid portrayal, recognizing them as facets of the diamond that is the core concept of Darkseid, just as his All Star Superman was itended to be a 'primal' superman, merging all versions of the character into one( just as he ddi with Batman in his Batman run, just as He tried to do with Superman since the 'Superman 2000 aborted reboot whose elements was later brought to All Star, Birthright, Red Son, the Loeb/Berganza Era and the post IC Busiek/Johns runs)

So NO, this was not a full retcon of what had been previously established, as New Gods having 'full god-forms' far above their standard portrayals had been establish since at least Mark Evanier's New Gods run. Similarly, Gruenwald's M-Bodies concept don't mean that Galactus' didn't really get beaten by Thor under Lee and Kirby, for example. This was not a Byrne 'Doombot' or Starlin 'Thanos clone' battleboard excuse nonsense. This was meant to RECONCILE differing Darkseid portrayals, not render them irrelevant.


Superman beat up Darkseid in the Fourth World. in Apokolips Now. He was formatted 'up' to New God proportions. That has never been retconned. Thanks for clearing this up, Before I always thought we saw new gods before final crisis were just they projections