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who wins

Interesting thread. Did the World Forger create the Magic in the Universes? Or does Magic and the otherkind predate WF and even Perpetua herself?

no indication he created it during the witch mark arc. i don't think all otherkind are the same level though. circe seemed to deal with one of them without too much trouble by simply binding it. the upside down man is different, and he apparently devoured hecate. i'd say hecate>>wf so i def don't see wf beating him. but some of the others? yeah, for sure.

Originally posted by leonidas
no indication he created it during the witch mark arc. i don't think all otherkind are the same level though. circe seemed to deal with one of them without too much trouble by simply binding it. the upside down man is different, and he apparently devoured hecate. i'd say hecate>>wf so i def don't see wf beating him. but some of the others? yeah, for sure. why do you think Hecate > WF?

Originally posted by Diesldude
Interesting thread. Did the World Forger create the Magic in the Universes? Probably not intentionally.

But as Manhattan noted: "magic" is really just left over scraps of creation that the magicians are able to tap into:

http://i.imgur.com/8JjTl26h.jpg


So from a certain point of view, I suppose magic might exist as a corollary of WF creating the multiverse. /shrug

Originally posted by Diesldude
why do you think Hecate > WF?

well, i think the idea behind witch mark was pretty clear--hecate wanted to rewrite magic across the multiverse. the scope of that is....well, it's far beyond anything we've seen wf definitively pull off imo. clearly not a stance everyone will agree with. lol what is certainly undeniable is that we've seen her offensive power, so based on that alone i'd say she wins this. the upside down man seemed outside her power though and came from beyond the wall (apparently). that would also place the otherkind outside wf's influence as well, so either way, i don't think he fares well against the more powerful of the otherkind. /shrug

Originally posted by leonidas
well, i think the idea behind witch mark was pretty clear--hecate wanted to rewrite magic across the multiverse. the scope of that is....well, it's far beyond anything we've seen wf definitively pull off imo. clearly not a stance everyone will agree with. lol what is certainly undeniable is that we've seen her offensive power, so based on that alone i'd say she wins this. the upside down man seemed outside her power though and came from beyond the wall (apparently). that would also place the otherkind outside wf's influence as well, so either way, i don't think he fares well against the more powerful of the otherkind. /shrug
Upside down man came from Dark multiverse.

Its like nobody here reads anything.

https://i.postimg.cc/5tnVLNSM/RCO019.jpg

Read and learn.

yup, you're right.

the reason i thought the way i did was this early scan:

https://imgur.com/a/LwgZOul

stuck in my head that blood seemed to say they came through the tear, but clearly they are from the dark multiverse.

in light of that, this becomes tougher to call. we still haven't seen anything in terms of offense from wf, so i'm still inclined to say he loses to the upside down man.

Originally posted by leonidas
yup, you're right.

the reason i thought the way i did was this early scan:

https://imgur.com/a/LwgZOul

stuck in my head that blood seemed to say they came through the tear, but clearly they are from the dark multiverse.

in light of that, this becomes tougher to call. we still haven't seen anything in terms of offense from wf, so i'm still inclined to say he loses to the upside down man.
Forger created a duplicate of everything in the multiverse including the dark multiverse/upside down man. He created Barbatos who was supreme in it. He actually populated every universe including the dark multiverse.

Yet you think Forger loses to one of his creations? Is he your new Mordru?

Originally posted by Galan007
Probably not intentionally.

But as Manhattan noted: "magic" is really just left over scraps of creation that the magicians are able to tap into:

http://i.imgur.com/8JjTl26h.jpg


So from a certain point of view, I suppose magic might exist as a corollary of WF creating the multiverse. /shrug

Originally posted by leonidas
well, i think the idea behind witch mark was pretty clear--hecate wanted to rewrite magic across the multiverse. the scope of that is....well, it's far beyond anything we've seen wf definitively pull off imo. clearly not a stance everyone will agree with. lol what is certainly undeniable is that we've seen her offensive power, so based on that alone i'd say she wins this.


As you predicted, i'm going to disagree with your opinion in bold.

Hecate was going to rewrite magic across the multiverse, while WF was going to replace the entire Multiverse. Which feat would have been greater? I would say WF's.

WF owned Barbatos with 2 fingers that's bigger than anything Hecate did.

Originally posted by leonidas
wf's influence as well, so either way, i don't think he fares well against the more powerful of the otherkind. /shrug

Not sure what you mean by outside her power, he was was supposedly her counterpart from the dark. He wasn't from beyond the wall so i guess he's under WF's influence? Your argument, apologies for the lack of a better word, weak.

If we take your argument, that he is outside of WF's influence because he's supposedly beyond the wall but if he was't which he isn't then that would indicate he's under WF's influence and weaker because he is part of WF's creation.

But if he was truly from beyond the wall, which he isn't, but lets say he was and because of this he's somehow outside of WF's influence, that doesn't indicate his power levels in comparison to WF's because just because something is from beyond the wall doesn't mean it is more powerful than beings on this side of the wall.