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Who's to you the most witty and manipulative villain to you? Wilson Fisk (Netflix's Kingpin) or Walter White?

If Walter White had a clue, his empire never would have crumbled.


Fisk owned the underworld, because he wasn't so incompetent to shoot his right hand man over a petty argument, or any other stupid shit he did.


He'd walk all over Walt in witty repartee, too.

Kingpin is better IMO in that regard. Though, to be fair to Walt, his plan was never to build a 20-year drug empire or something similar, so he had different priorities than most people in that life do. His aim was maximizing profits in the shortest amount of time, because of his illness. And when things happened that he felt compromised that priority, he didn't always think things through before he acted.

I think if he wasn't sick and had planned a more long-term game from the start, things could have turned out differently. Then again, if it wasn't for the cancer giving him the kick up the butt he got, he might never have done anything.

Originally posted by cdtm
If Walter White had a clue, his empire never would have crumbled.


Fisk owned the underworld, because he wasn't so incompetent to shoot his right hand man over a petty argument, or any other stupid shit he did.


He'd walk all over Walt in witty repartee, too.

Your opinion is again garbage as per the usual, you incompetent alcoholic.

Walter was a force of nature and a human bomb. He would seize Fisk within his crosshairs and obliterate him with meticulous precision.

Who is the better character? Walter White by a country mile. He's easily one of the best TV characters of all time. MCU Kingpin is cool and all, but Daredevil doesn't have close to the level of writing quality that Breaking Bad does.

Who's the better criminal mastermind? Now that's a more interesting question.

On the surface, you would assume Kingpin, but what we see of Fisk, he's far more impulsive and emotional than Walter is. He attacks people for no reason, and mostly gets by on his reputation. Walter however started from absolutely nothing and ended up becoming the top of the Albuquerque underworld.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Who is the better character? Walter White by a country mile. He's easily one of the best TV characters of all time. MCU Kingpin is cool and all, but Daredevil doesn't have close to the level of writing quality that Breaking Bad does.

Who's the better criminal mastermind? Now that's a more interesting question.

On the surface, you would assume Kingpin, but what we see of Fisk, he's far more impulsive and emotional than Walter is. He attacks people for no reason, and mostly gets by on his reputation. Walter however started from absolutely nothing and ended up becoming the top of the Albuquerque underworld.

Naah! I think Walter's downfall was his love for Jesse. Honestly, Jesse was a pain in the man's ass throughout the 5 seasons.

Of course, maybe at the beginning he was necessary and introduced him into the world of drugs, but he became an anchor for Walt.

Fisk would have pulled strings behind the scenes to screw with his personal life and leave him vulnerable to manipulation and compromise, like he did with Dex and Nadeem.

Naah, I think Walt's downfall was due to him placing too much trust and love on Jesse.

If Jesse wouldn't have betrayed him, Walt would have come on top.

Walt's inner good made him naive to believe Jesse was an adequate partner.

I suppose you can look at it that way. But at the same time, Walt destroyed him over the seasons. Seriously, compare him in S1 and S5. Being around Heisenberg broke him as a person. Because there were also times when he wanted out, but Walt dragged him back in.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
I suppose you can look at it that way. But at the same time, Walt destroyed him over the seasons. Seriously, compare him in S1 and S5. Being around Heisenberg broke him as a person. Because there were also times when he wanted out, but Walt dragged him back in.

That's why, I don't get Walt's obsession with Jesse. Everything Walt made he made it himself... Jesse wasn't really an asset.

I think Walt trully loved him, like a son. He wanted to help him, but Jesse just didn't learn to appreciate that.

I think Gus was right when he told Walt that he was bad for business.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
That's why, I don't get Walt's obsession with Jesse. Everything Walt made he made it himself... Jesse wasn't really an asset.

I think Walt trully loved him, like a son. He wanted to help him, but Jesse just didn't learn to appreciate that.

I think Gus was right when he told Walt that he was bad for business.

Walter was trying to convince *himself* that he loved Jesse like a son, but Jesse knew early on that wasn't true. Jesse was just a pawn in Walter's schemes, to be used and abused at will.

Walter was trying to have it both ways. He wanted to be a loving family man and also a crime lord, but he enjoyed being a crime lord more.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Walter was trying to convince *himself* that he loved Jesse like a son, but Jesse knew early on that wasn't true. Jesse was just a pawn in Walter's schemes, to be used and abused at will.

Walter was trying to have it both ways. He wanted to be a loving family man and also a crime lord, but he enjoyed being a crime lord more.

Used him how though!? I mean, Gale was certainly doing a better job and without making all the trouble Jesse made.

Jesse was a rock in Walter's shoe throughout the 5 seasons.

I think Fisk had the evil side advantage. The guy loved no one and therefore was relentless and flawless... It was until he met Vanessa that he turned weak.. Heisenberg always had his family and friends to refrain him.

Walt did care about Jesse. That's why Walt rescued Jesse from his meth slavery situation.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Used him how though!? I mean, Gale was certainly doing a better job and without making all the trouble Jesse made.

Jesse was a rock in Walter's shoe throughout the 5 seasons.

What show were you watching? In the very first episode, Walter blackmails Jesse into teaching him how to manufacture meth. Later on, he blackmails Jesse again into meeting up with Tuco Salamanca, which leads to Jesse getting beaten up and ending up in the hospital. Jesse was perfectly happy being a small time drug dealer, but that wasn't good enough for Walter. Then he ropes in Jesse's friends and gets one of them shot and killed.

Throughout the show, he acts like he's Jesse's father figure, but he only cares about Jesse as much as he's useful. Sure, he saved Jesse from those other drug dealers, but those guys were obvious bad dudes that even Gus turned his his nose up at.



Gale was older and already had a mentor in Gus Fring. He wasn't able to be manipulated the way Jesse was.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
What show were you watching? In the very first episode, Walter blackmails Jesse into teaching him how to manufacture meth. Later on, he blackmails Jesse again into meeting up with Tuco Salamanca, which leads to Jesse getting beaten up and ending up in the hospital. Jesse was perfectly happy being a small time drug dealer, but that wasn't good enough for Walter. Then he ropes in Jesse's friends and gets one of them shot and killed.

Throughout the show, he acts like he's Jesse's father figure, but he only cares about Jesse as much as he's useful. Sure, he saved Jesse from those other drug dealers, but those guys were obvious bad dudes that even Gus turned his his nose up at.



Gale was older and already had a mentor in Gus Fring. He wasn't able to be manipulated the way Jesse was.

This.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
What show were you watching? In the very first episode, Walter blackmails Jesse into teaching him how to manufacture meth. Later on, he blackmails Jesse again into meeting up with Tuco Salamanca, which leads to Jesse getting beaten up and ending up in the hospital. Jesse was perfectly happy being a small time drug dealer, but that wasn't good enough for Walter. Then he ropes in Jesse's friends and gets one of them shot and killed.

Throughout the show, he acts like he's Jesse's father figure, but he only cares about Jesse as much as he's useful. Sure, he saved Jesse from those other drug dealers, but those guys were obvious bad dudes that even Gus turned his his nose up at.



Gale was older and already had a mentor in Gus Fring. He wasn't able to be manipulated the way Jesse was.

At the end of the series, Heisenberg refuses to kill Jesse despite he knowing that he was going to betray him.

Isn't that love?

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
At the end of the series, Heisenberg refuses to kill Jesse despite he knowing that he was going to betray him.

Isn't that love?

In Felina? Walter was about to die. He had lost the love and respect of his family, and everyone hated him. What would be the point?

I do think that Walter cared about Jesse to a certain point, but the show was all about exposing how Walter deep down was not a good man. He corrupted his entire family and made their lives worse despite the fact that he thought he loved them.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
In Felina? Walter was about to die. He had lost the love and respect of his family, and everyone hated him. What would be the point?

I do think that Walter cared about Jesse to a certain point, but the show was all about exposing how Walter deep down was not a good man. He corrupted his entire family and made their lives worse despite the fact that he thought he loved them.

I'm just saying that partnering with Jesse was an error. A quite evident one and yet he insisted on being with him.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
I'm just saying that partnering with Jesse was an error. A quite evident one and yet he insisted on being with him.

Jesse was Walter's only safe way into the drug world. If he had gone to someone else, he would have gotten laughed at or shot.

Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Jesse was Walter's only safe way into the drug world. If he had gone to someone else, he would have gotten laughed at or shot.

At the beginning. He was unnecessary since he met Gus.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
I'm just saying that partnering with Jesse was an error. A quite evident one and yet he insisted on being with him.

Nobody cares what you are saying.

Originally posted by BrolyBlack
Nobody cares what you are saying.

Please stop derailing this thread. Thank you.

Stop de railing the other threads then, hypocrite.

Originally posted by BrolyBlack
Stop de railing the other threads then, hypocrite.

You are the one derailing them. Stick to topic or leave.

Take your same advise your giving in this thread and apply it to the others because so far you have not

Both of you SHUT THE F*CK UP and get back to topic.

Stop flaming people, Broly!!!!!

Heisenberg wins. Better villain and would own Fisk in a battle.

one guy ran Albuquerque, the other guy ran New York City. No contest, Fisk wins