Spider-Man's future in the Marvel Cinematic Universe

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Impediment
https://www.ign.com/articles/2019/08/20/breaking-spider-man-out-of-the-mcu-marvel-sony-cant-reach-deal

I guess Aunt May will be 22 in the next reboot.

Darth Thor
Nooooooo!!!!!!

Darth Thor
So who should I be pissed at? Sony or Disney? Sounds like Disney tbh. Every time they step over Feige they make dumb ass decisions.

But guess I should be greatful I got to see Spidey in an Avengers movie.

BruceSkywalker
I read the article and its more Sony's fault..

Josh_Alexander
Such terrible news... The whole Spiderman Far from Home was meant to consolidate Spiderman as an Avenger and for this to take Tony's position...

This is certainly bad news.

Darth Thor
Reading online and the Disney c***suckers showing they are brain dead corporate slaves putting the fault solely on Sony.

Disney were demanding half the profits of a Spider-Man movie.. Thats not what Feige initially agreed with them. And of course Sony wouldnt agree to that after they just got Venom to gross 850million on a small budget and without Spider-Man.

Edit - But then maybe its our fault for not boycotting Venom hmm

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Reading online and the Disney c***suckers showing they are brain dead corporate slaves putting the fault solely on Sony.

Disney were demanding half the profits of a Spider-Man movie.. Thats not what Feige initially agreed with them. And of course Sony wouldnt agree to that after they just got Venom to gross 850million on a small budget and without Spider-Man.

50 was too high, I agree.

The whole spider-sense introduction was USELESS!

Darth Thor
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander

The whole spider-sense introduction was USELESS!


In the MCU it was only ever known as Peter Tingle mad

Thats like official given he wont be back.

cdtm
Originally posted by cdtm
Sounds like Disney didn't want to incur any risk.

They got greedy, played hardball, and that's why they were recently caught padding their profit margins by at least 6 billion (According to a repeat whistle blower, who was conveniently fired over reporting co-workers too much, or some such bs excuse no one can prove isn't true.)

Darth Thor
^ What risk? It was working well for them.

cdtm
Originally posted by Darth Thor
^ What risk? It was working well for them.


The article said they balked at being "co-financers".

Josh_Alexander
So...The whole Tony going back to save Peter and dying in the process was useless...

Why does it feel like Endgame was boycotted?

ares834
So they set up Spider-Man to be the next linchpin of the MCU and then this happens... lol

Dr Will Hatch
As much as this sucks and I'm against it, I have to admit that I was never 100% on board with MCU Spider-Man. I liked him a lot in Civil War, and Homecoming was amazing, but there were always problems nagging me. The biggest one is that he felt like a side character, like Tony Stark Jr, and because Peter was so tied up in Tony's life, he never got a chance to develop his own identity. I was also bothered by how the MCU erased Uncle Ben, who is arguably the most important reason Peter became Spider-Man in the first place. Also, as much as I hate to say it, but Far From Home kind of sucked. It didn't feel like a Spidey movie at all.

Ridley_Prime
Yeah, let's be honest with ourselves, MCU Spidey was pretty much Iron Man Jr.

The news still sucks though.

quanchi112
Sucks but the MCU was great without him. Sony will never achieve these heights on their own but I have way too many exciting characters from the Fox deal to let this affect me. If this does come to pass I will be just fine. Spider-Man had his moment in the sun in IW and EG were unlike any previous films in the history of cinema.

cdtm
I feel kind of bad for Tom Holland. His career is just taking off, and now this. It could ruin him.

Darth Thor
Not really buying the Iron Man Junior stuff. Its not like his suit was anything like even Rhodeys or Peppers, let alone Tonys. It was hardy more than body armour Pete could quickly get into. And aside from some surveillance tech, there were no new abilities he got from it that he didnt already have in comics.

I like Tony being his superhero mentor. But Tony died anyway, so....

Anyway Civil War and Infinity War will always be two of my favourite comic book films, and thats in large part to Spidey being in them.

Dr Will Hatch
IMO, he shouldn't have Stark Tech at all. He shouldn't be involved with Stark beyond a small mentoring capacity. He shouldn't be involved with SHIELD. Peter should be his own character.

quanchi112
I did not really enjoy either Spider-Man film. Weak entries of the MCU but I did like him in the teamup films. Sony will regret it.

Dr Will Hatch
By the way, f.uck Tom Rothman.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
By the way, f.uck Tom Rothman. thumb up

steverules_2
Phuuuuuuuck, I like Spider-Man! Why does Disney have to be total dicks and ruin it

quanchi112
Originally posted by steverules_2
Phuuuuuuuck, I like Spider-Man! Why does Disney have to be total dicks and ruin it Blame Sony and their success. Without Feige this will falter. MCU is the only company to ever pull tgis off long term to build into a finale previously inconceivable ten years ago.

jaden_2.0
Seems pretty dumb. They could easily take a leaf out of DC's book and simply have a different Spiderman not linked to the MCU like what DC are doing with Joker and leave Holland in the MCU and split the cost/profits on the licensing.

Robtard
Holland's the best SM thus far and it seems like he's contracted to the character regardless of being in the MCU of not, so that's good.

But I still want SM to be in the MCU, Disney/Marvel does a better job, hopefully it's just a bargaining chip Sony is using to get more money out of the deal.

Galan007
This will get sorted out.

Disney's built up Spidey WAY too much in the MCU to just drop him now without a fight.

Josh_Alexander
Spiderman leaving the MCU is dire news. The MCU will certainly be affected should this happen, considering that Peter has had a lot of importance in IW and EG.

If it's true that both Marvel and Sony would be affected, clearly Marvel is the most affected.

Retconning is bad news and filling Tom's absence will be worse.

Inhuman
Back to shitty amazing Spiderman tier movies
And stupid decisions like wanting to make movies based on Silver Sable , etc.

cdtm
Disney is finished.

Robtard
Originally posted by Galan007
This will get sorted out.

Disney's built up Spidey WAY too much in the MCU to just drop him now without a fight.

I really think (hope) so too. Just a matter of both companies agreeing on the "X' amount of dollars.

cdtm
Originally posted by Robtard
I really think (hope) so too. Just a matter of both companies agreeing on the "X' amount of dollars.


Considering their history in negotiations, it's a miracle this agreement lasted as long as it did.


I'd imagine the negotiations go like this:


"You pay for everything, we take a 50% cut."

"We demand a higher cut, because we're spending all the money. Unless you want to chip in on the funding?"

"50/50, you pay, take it or leave it. We're Disney, *****, HAHA!"

Arachnid1
****.

****.

NemeBro
Originally posted by Galan007
This will get sorted out.

Disney's built up Spidey WAY too much in the MCU to just drop him now without a fight. It will probably get sorted out when either Disney swallows its pride and accepts a smaller cut of the profits or bankrupts itself to buy the license to Spider Man (which is the worst possible scenario btw).

cdtm
Originally posted by NemeBro
It will probably get sorted out when either Disney swallows its pride and accepts a smaller cut of the profits or bankrupts itself to buy the license to Spider Man (which is the worst possible scenario btw).


You don't rise in Disney by being a reasonable, well adjusted human being.

Kazenji
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48588878002_89f05a5ef2_b.jpg

BruceSkywalker
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
50 was too high, I agree.

The whole spider-sense introduction was USELESS!


Sony is moe at fault but lets see how they handle eveytghing, but also I've read sony might be crawling back to marvel coz of the backlash..


also of not idiot dceu dirty c%cksuckers know that making money is the name of the game for all movie studios.. of course dceu has had to reboot, and a higher up who is a pervert rapist



Originally posted by steverules_2
Phuuuuuuuck, I like Spider-Man! Why does Disney have to be total dicks and ruin it


wasn't disney.. disney wanted a 50/50 share of the profits , they also wanted sony to share in the production costs...

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by BruceSkywalker
Sony is moe at fault but lets see how they handle eveytghing, but also I've read sony might be crawling back to marvel coz of the backlash..


also of not idiot dceu dirty c%cksuckers know that making money is the name of the game for all movie studios.. of course dceu has had to reboot, and a higher up who is a pervert rapist

5% on the first dollar. Sony is certainly kidding by this point.

I agree that a 50% is too high, but certainly Marvel is it's right to demand a better deal.

BruceSkywalker
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
5% on the first dollar. Sony is certainly kidding by this point.

I agree that a 50% is too high, but certainly Marvel is it's right to demand a better deal.


I won't be at all surprised if they resign but im taking a wait and see approach

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by BruceSkywalker
I won't be at all surprised if they resign but im taking a wait and see approach

Yeah, both industries will lose... Marvel nor Sony have made any official publications about it, so there's that.

TheVaultDweller
Both sides are being shitbags IMO. 5% is laughably low, considering how much of the MCU is incorporated into those films (and how much MCU good will brought fans onboard for this after the ASM shitshow), as well as the fact that they have other strictly MCU characters appearing in them. But 50% is also being excessively greedy and asking too much.

Galan007
Originally posted by NemeBro
It will probably get sorted out when either Disney swallows its pride and accepts a smaller cut of the profits or bankrupts itself to buy the license to Spider Man (which is the worst possible scenario btw). Both companies are just comparing dick sizes right now.

I can only imagine that Disney will ultimately accept a smaller percentage of the co-financing stake and continue producing Spidey-related material. They'd still pull in a huge profit given the draw of these films, and you'd *think*, as a business, they would put monetary gain over their corporate ego.

We'll see, I guess. /shrug

Kazenji
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48591398087_9f8ea5357a_b.jpg

Darth Thor
Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Both sides are being shitbags IMO. 5% is laughably low, considering how much of the MCU is incorporated into those films (and how much MCU good will brought fans onboard for this after the ASM shitshow), as well as the fact that they have other strictly MCU characters appearing in them. But 50% is also being excessively greedy and asking too much.


Is 5% laughably low? You do realise Sony gets nothing when Spider-Man is in the Avengers right?

Disney also gets 100% of Spider-Man merchandising rights (which is a huge thing btw), so its only in their interest to help Sony not take this franchise down the drain.

I mean Sure negotiate on the 5%. But as far as Im aware Sony did not refuse to negotiate on the %.

This solely Disney being dicks. Not Marvel btw (the whole initial deal was Feige idea). Just Disney.

But hey they were dicks when they fired James Gunn as well, and im guessing Feige kept fighting his cause to bring him back into the fold.

Originally posted by Inhuman
Back to shitty amazing Spiderman tier movies
And stupid decisions like wanting to make movies based on Silver Sable , etc.

Lets be real. Its not like Homecoming was a masterpiece. The best Spider-Man movie is still SM2, a 100% Sony one.

The fun for us fans was seeing Spidey with the Avengers.

Psychotron
Finally the homosexual twink Tom Holland is gone. Maybe Spider-man can be good again. Then again, it's Sony.

roughrider
Reading the article, The Disney/Sony partnership is in doubt, that's all. The thread title is misleading.

Second, Sony needs Spider Man in the MCU than the other way around. Cut off in his own universe, with no one but Sony making the film, it will get f**ked up again. They - Sony - have proven time and again. Spider Man in the MCU is a genie they can't put back in the bottle.

It will be several years before Spider Man could be needed for a major crossover again. I say wait Sony out.

Kazenji
News to me, Him being gay.

Impediment

Galan007
Negotiations are still ongoing:
https://www.cbr.com/spider-man-sony-marvel-studios-negotiating-deal/

Kazenji
I'm sure something like that can be done in the comics, Could easily be another Spider-Man from another universe.

TheVaultDweller
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Is 5% laughably low? You do realise Sony gets nothing when Spider-Man is in the Avengers right?

Disney also gets 100% of Spider-Man merchandising rights (which is a huge thing btw), so its only in their interest to help Sony not take this franchise down the drain.

I mean Sure negotiate on the 5%. But as far as Im aware Sony did not refuse to negotiate on the %.

This solely Disney being dicks. Not Marvel btw (the whole initial deal was Feige idea). Just Disney.

But hey they were dicks when they fired James Gunn as well, and im guessing Feige kept fighting his cause to bring him back into the fold.



Disney MCU wasn't a floundering shitshow before this partnership, unlike Spider-Man was at Sony. And as I understand it, it's 5% of opening day. Not total amount. So, if you work out 5% of opening day of the two films and combine that, and then compare that with their total combined box office run, it seems very low to me, considering the people the MCU would also need to hire and pay on these projects, over the production and post-production process, both on and offscreen. Actors, executives, continuity guys to make sure it lines up consistently with things in the wider MCU etc.

I suppose the actors might/should be covered by Sony, but the behind the scenes people linking to the wider MCU would be Disney guys.

Bentley

SquallX

quanchi112
Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Both sides are being shitbags IMO. 5% is laughably low, considering how much of the MCU is incorporated into those films (and how much MCU good will brought fans onboard for this after the ASM shitshow), as well as the fact that they have other strictly MCU characters appearing in them. But 50% is also being excessively greedy and asking too much. It is just business so what? Making money is the name of the game. A deal still can be struck. Disney would share the costs and the MCU is their baby which greatly benefits Sonys Spider-Man. They are just dick measuring atm.

quanchi112

Darth Thor
Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Disney MCU wasn't a floundering shitshow before this partnership, unlike Spider-Man was at Sony.


Firstly, it wasn't a shit show. SM1, SM2 and even TASM1 were all solid IMO. SM1 was the first true Marvel blockbuster.

But you're confusing who needed the deal more initially, with the details of if it's actually a mutually beneficial deal to carry on for both sides.

Also don't put this on the MCU. Feige was happy with the deal. It was the deal he proposed in the first place. This is all the higher ups at Disney interfering.


Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
And as I understand it, it's 5% of opening day. Not total amount. So, if you work out 5% of opening day of the two films and combine that, and then compare that with their total combined box office run, it seems very low to me,


Not really. Because they get to use Spidey free of charge in the Disney/Marvel financed MCU films.

Again this was the original deal both sides agreed to. Marvel didn't NEED Spider-Man, but they WANTED their flagship character in the mix. Plus the have the merchandising rights including movie merchandising (which I'm guessing didn't sell too well for TASM2)Which is why it was mutually beneficial.


Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
considering the people the MCU would also need to hire and pay on these projects, over the production and post-production process, both on and offscreen. Actors, executives, continuity guys to make sure it lines up consistently with things in the wider MCU etc.

I suppose the actors might/should be covered by Sony, but the behind the scenes people linking to the wider MCU would be Disney guys.


I'm sure that's all covered in the production cost. Including Feiges fee for working on the films.

The main thing you could say Marvel is losing is Time. Time spent planning the Sony movies.

But hey ask for a bit extra on the budget cost. But asking for half the profits is ridiculous. Sony are not getting any of the profits from Infinity War or Endgame, and you can't tell me having Spidey in those had zero effect on the box office, and just general excitement for those films.

But hey, sure negotiate the %. I've not read anywhere Sony completely refused negotiations on that. Just don't get arrogant and completely take the piss, simply because you're Disney.


Originally posted by quanchi112
It is just business so what? Making money is the name of the game. A deal still can be struck. Disney would share the costs and the MCU is their baby which greatly benefits Sonys Spider-Man. They are just dick measuring atm.


Surprisingly Quans making sense.

Darth Thor
Originally posted by Galan007
Negotiations are still ongoing:
https://www.cbr.com/spider-man-sony-marvel-studios-negotiating-deal/



Good.

quanchi112
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Firstly, it wasn't a shit show. SM1, SM2 and even TASM1 were all solid IMO. SM1 was the first true Marvel blockbuster.

But you're confusing who needed the deal more initially, with the details of if it's actually a mutually beneficial deal to carry on for both sides.

Also don't put this on the MCU. Feige was happy with the deal. It was the deal he proposed in the first place. This is all the higher ups at Disney interfering.





Not really. Because they get to use Spidey free of charge in the Disney/Marvel financed MCU films.

Again this was the original deal both sides agreed to. Marvel didn't NEED Spider-Man, but they WANTED their flagship character in the mix. Plus the have the merchandising rights including movie merchandising (which I'm guessing didn't sell too well for TASM2)Which is why it was mutually beneficial.





I'm sure that's all covered in the production cost. Including Feiges fee for working on the films.

The main thing you could say Marvel is losing is Time. Time spent planning the Sony movies.

But hey ask for a bit extra on the budget cost. But asking for half the profits is ridiculous. Sony are not getting any of the profits from Infinity War or Endgame, and you can't tell me having Spidey in those had zero effect on the box office, and just general excitement for those films.

But hey, sure negotiate the %. I've not read anywhere Sony completely refused negotiations on that. Just don't get arrogant and completely take the piss, simply because you're Disney.





Surprisingly Quans making sense. I am always right. Just like with the Hulks character development and the Russos decisions you went off base with your feelings as your only source. Be like me and be objective.

Josh_Alexander

TheVaultDweller
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Firstly, it wasn't a shit show. SM1, SM2 and even TASM1 were all solid IMO. SM1 was the first true Marvel blockbuster.

But you're confusing who needed the deal more initially, with the details of if it's actually a mutually beneficial deal to carry on for both sides.

Also don't put this on the MCU. Feige was happy with the deal. It was the deal he proposed in the first place. This is all the higher ups at Disney interfering.

Not really. Because they get to use Spidey free of charge in the Disney/Marvel financed MCU films.

Again this was the original deal both sides agreed to. Marvel didn't NEED Spider-Man, but they WANTED their flagship character in the mix. Plus the have the merchandising rights including movie merchandising (which I'm guessing didn't sell too well for TASM2)Which is why it was mutually beneficial.

I'm sure that's all covered in the production cost. Including Feiges fee for working on the films.

The main thing you could say Marvel is losing is Time. Time spent planning the Sony movies.

But hey ask for a bit extra on the budget cost. But asking for half the profits is ridiculous. Sony are not getting any of the profits from Infinity War or Endgame, and you can't tell me having Spidey in those had zero effect on the box office, and just general excitement for those films.

But hey, sure negotiate the %. I've not read anywhere Sony completely refused negotiations on that. Just don't get arrogant and completely take the piss, simply because you're Disney.



I never once referenced the Raimi Spider-Man movies. They happened ages ago at this point and aren't relevant to the current situation to be honest. I specifically referred to ASM in my first post, which had mixed reviews from a lot of people on the first one and was almost universally panned on the second. And at no point did I say it was the MCU's doing or even remotely mentioned Feige. I was simply pointing out the huge positive impact it had for the recent films, as well as the goodwill that came with it. Because not everything from Disney has that much goodwill nowadays *cough*starwars*cough*.

And I'm talking film media and money and return based on how much time, effort and work is put in there specifically. And yeah, of course Spider-Man is also a draw for some people. But a lot of those people are already invested in the MCU in anyways, whereas people were still making jokes about how awful Electro (and Goblin) was in ASM2. So, while both had an impact, one was clearly greater.

And I already said that I thought asking for half was excessively greedy. So, that's not a point of contention. And I took my stance because, at the time, it was implied that it had totally broken down, which would mean that Sony themselves was beyond even suggesting a compromise. But as the article Galan posted says, things are still ongoing, so things could still work itself out.

Disney is kinda on the short-end here though. They tied so much of the next phase into Far From Home that they kinda really need Spidey for at least another film or two IMO, if only to pass the torch they just passed to him onto someone else again. So, that might give Sony some power at the table.

TheVaultDweller
When you laugh at the jokes only to realise that they're probably very accurate.

twA9mV9R0hY

Also, lol at the Venom jab.

Inhuman
Reminder that this was the last idea Sony had when it came to live action Spider-Man films

https://i.imgur.com/W0JJDpA.jpg

quanchi112
laughing out loud

TheVaultDweller
Originally posted by Inhuman
Reminder that this was the last idea Sony had when it came to live action Spider-Man films

https://i.imgur.com/W0JJDpA.jpg

I love how one of his superpowers was that the gap between his front teeth disappeared.

https://moviecomicswhoswho.files.wordpress.com/2013/09/electrofilm.jpg

Darth Thor
Originally posted by Inhuman
Reminder that this was the last idea Sony had when it came to live action Spider-Man films

https://i.imgur.com/W0JJDpA.jpg


And Good luck to Disney trying to sell those Electro toys with their Spider-Man movie merchandising rights.

Something tells me the FFH Mysterio toys wont have a problem selling.

TheVaultDweller
Originally posted by Darth Thor
And Good luck to Disney trying to sell those Electro toys with their Spider-Man movie merchandising rights.

Something tells me the FFH Mysterio toys wont have a problem selling.

I dunno, man. Depending on how hard that Electro thing is, it could be satisfying to punch.

BruceSkywalker
TOLD YOU.. Sony is more at fault...


https://deadline.com/2019/08/kevin-feige-spider-man-franchise-exit-disney-sony-dispute-avengers-endgame-captain-america-winter-soldier-tom-rothman-bob-iger-1202672545/

Darth Thor
Campea saying the full original report confirmed Sony offered Disney a 30% stake in the Spider-Man films. Disney refused. Disney also demanded 50% of the entire Spider-Man movie franchise including the Venom verse films.

This was obviously a ploy by Disney to get Spidey back on a super cheap deal. Like getting joint control for free.

As for Sony downplaying the facts, they were trying to salvage any remnants of renegotiation. They even say in their official statement something akin to they still hope Spidey can rejoin the MCU at some point.

So yeah keep playing dumb and blaming Sony. Ill support the future Sony films and cant wait to see Spider-Man in the next Venom movie thumb up

TheVaultDweller
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Campea saying the full original report Sony offered Disney a 30% stake in the Spider-Man films. Disney refused. They also demanded 50% of the entire Spider-Man movie franchise including the Venom verse films.

This was obviously a ploy by Disney to get Spidey back on a super cheap deal. Like getting controlling interest for free.

As for Sony downplaying the facts, they were trying to salvage any remnants of renegotiation. They even say in their official statement something akin to they still hope Spidey can rejoin the MCU at some point.

So yeah keep playing dumb and blaming Sony. Ill support the future Sony films and cant wait to see Spider-Man in the next Venom movie thumb up

Well, in light of this... Yeah, this is on Disney. 30% is more than generous IMO. This could also be an intentional tactic though. Make the first one unreasonable, but then walk it back to something less, but still more than the initial 30% offer. Don't know how successful that would be though.

Josh_Alexander
30% is certainly a marvelous deal. I personally would think Sony offering around 10% to 20% max.

But 30%! Disney better think about it twice.

quanchi112
Originally posted by BruceSkywalker
TOLD YOU.. Sony is more at fault...


https://deadline.com/2019/08/kevin-feige-spider-man-franchise-exit-disney-sony-dispute-avengers-endgame-captain-america-winter-soldier-tom-rothman-bob-iger-1202672545/ **** Sony. . Thor hates Disney to the point of being a hater. D. Thor actually cannot wait to see a character whose entire film past is in the MCU in the next venom film. The kid is a moron. Look at the past Spider-Man films and how it blew up on them. Sony is disgusting.

BruceSkywalker
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
30% is certainly a marvelous deal. I personally would think Sony offering around 10% to 20% max.

But 30%! Disney better think about it twice.


not sure why folks believe campea coz i could care less what he says.. but if sony and disney make up, then that could happen

quanchi112
Sony was more than likely behind the leaked story as to apply pressure but their stocks fell. Backfired.

Impediment
Sony will never sell Spidey to Disney.

Fite me IRL.

NemeBro
Originally posted by Impediment
Sony will never sell Spidey to Disney.

Fite me IRL. If Disney offered a big enough sum for it I think they would, but at that point it probably wouldn't even be worth it.

Josh_Alexander
ijKR444wfek&t=623s

WatchMojo's got it right! Feels to me like Disney will have to bend the knee here...

steverules_2
Originally posted by Impediment
Sony will never sell Spidey to Disney.

Fite me IRL.


I will fight you in an active volcano

quanchi112
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
ijKR444wfek&t=623s

WatchMojo's got it right! Feels to me like Disney will have to bend the knee here... Their stocks already fell since the public will of the people supports Disney. I wish you were more knowledgeable.


https://comicbook.com/marvel/2019/08/20/sony-stock-drops-after-split-disney-marvel-spider-man-movies/

You lose.

roughrider
I'm sure this story isn't over. Like Disney & PIXAR reportedly splitting in the previous decade, or James Gunn getting fired from directing Guardians Of The Galaxy vol. 3, I think the final chapter hasn't been written here yet.

Kazenji
That's why i said "Could easily be another Spider-Man from another universe"

BruceSkywalker
Originally posted by quanchi112
Sony was more than likely behind the leaked story as to apply pressure but their stocks fell. Backfired.

that's possible..


Originally posted by Impediment
Sony will never sell Spidey to Disney.

Fite me IRL.


when and where big grin big grin big grin big grin


Originally posted by roughrider
I'm sure this story isn't over. Like Disney & PIXAR reportedly splitting in the previous decade, or James Gunn getting fired from directing Guardians Of The Galaxy vol. 3, I think the final chapter hasn't been written here yet.



I was about to say something similar.. You ae totally spot on

Darth Thor
Originally posted by quanchi112
Their stocks already fell since the public will of the people supports Disney. I wish you were more knowledgeable.


https://comicbook.com/marvel/2019/08/20/sony-stock-drops-after-split-disney-marvel-spider-man-movies/

You lose.


It hardly dropped at all.

SquallX

Darth Thor
Originally posted by quanchi112
**** Sony. . Thor hates Disney to the point of being a hater. D. Thor actually cannot wait to see a character whose entire film past is in the MCU in the next venom film. The kid is a moron. Look at the past Spider-Man films and how it blew up on them. Sony is disgusting.


If you honestly think Disneys demands were completely reasonable here then I suggest you never run your own business.

I also suggest you never invest in shares if youre going to panic of slight drops throughout the day.

YousufKhan1212
Sony's hold on the Spider-Man's film rights is so iron clad that it reminds me of how Maul refuses to stay dead. It's nearly impossible for them to lose the rights, they're doing anything they can to keep them.

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by YousufKhan1212
Sony's hold on the Spider-Man's film rights is so iron clad that it reminds me of how Maul refuses to stay dead. It's nearly impossible for them to lose the rights, they're doing anything they can to keep them.

Perhaps Marvel's best choice should things turn sour is to let Sony produce his Spider movies, wait for Sony to mess up again but this time instead of throwing a life jacket at them they let Sony drown to the point where they are forced to sell.

Sony is seriously getting to cocky and are forgetting that Marvel literally saved the Spiderman franchise for them.

Josh_Alexander

Surtur
These people just need to get their shit together.

SquallX

Bentley
Sony did the right choice honestly

Surtur
Disney is so greedy don't they have enough money.

BruceSkywalker
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Perhaps Marvel's best choice should things turn sour is to let Sony produce his Spider movies, wait for Sony to mess up again but this time instead of throwing a life jacket at them they let Sony drown to the point where they are forced to sell.

Sony is seriously getting to cocky and are forgetting that Marvel literally saved the Spiderman franchise for them.


This could potentially happen given the very bad press Sony is getting right now. Tom Rothman gotta prove he won't f%ck up Spidey which he undoubtedly will

Darth Thor
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Perhaps Marvel's best choice should things turn sour is to let Sony produce his Spider movies, wait for Sony to mess up again but this time instead of throwing a life jacket at them they let Sony drown to the point where they are forced to sell.

Sony is seriously getting to cocky and are forgetting that Marvel literally saved the Spiderman franchise for them.


Out of the Sony only films- 5 live action Spidey movies, one animated and one Venom film, id argue Sony has only messed up twice. 2/7 times isnt a bad record.

And even when they mess up they still bank money tbh.

Spidey is their biggest franchise plain and simple. They wont give away controlling interest in their biggest property. That would be asinine.

If Marvel wants to please the fans they can do. They have nothing to lose. If they want to be greedy f***s they can do that to. Clearly their brain dead corporate fan boys will worship then either way.

Darth Thor
Originally posted by Darth Thor

If Marvel wants to please the fans they can do.

Disney*

This is all Disney. Not Marvels fault at all. Feiges the one who started this arrangement for the fans.

Surtur
I don't want yet another Spider-Man reboot. Find a way to continue using the current one or just stop for a while.

Inhuman
Sony pictures has been losing money for years now and is in bad shape. I don't think pumping out animated Spider Man movies, or films based on Black Cat or Silver Sable that could make small profits will help them much.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Bentley
Sony did the right choice honestly

Make sure your wine doesn't contain methanol.

You're losing it, Bentley.

NemeBro
Originally posted by Inhuman
Sony pictures has been losing money for years now and is in bad shape. Got a source?

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Disney*

This is all Disney. Not Marvels fault at all. Feiges the one who started this arrangement for the fans.

Technically, Russos started it.

As they asked Feige to get Spidey for them to use in CW.

Darth Thor
Originally posted by Inhuman
Sony pictures has been losing money for years now and is in bad shape. I don't think pumping out animated Spider Man movies, or films based on Black Cat or Silver Sable that could make small profits will help them much.


Clearly you missed Venom which grossed $850million on a $100mill budget.

At this point a Venom/Spidey crossover clearly has the billion dollar potential and thats without bending over and taking it up the anus from Mickey.

StiltmanFTW
50-50 =/= taking it up the anus.

Sony doesn't understand the character, they tried turning him into a skateboarder.

Darth Thor
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
50-50 =/= taking it up the anus


Giving up controlling interest in their biggest movie franchise for absolutely no reason is taking it up the Butt. No studio, no business would accept that without some kind of massive pay off.

This isnt even close to the original deal which both sides were happy to make. Its simple greed on Disneys side, not giving a shit about the fans.


Originally posted by StiltmanFTW

Sony doesn't understand the character, they tried turning him into a skateboarder.

Yeah, his true characterisation should be as Iron Man Junior right?

But again this isnt Marvel. Its all Disney. Just like with the firing of James Gunn situation.

Inhuman
Originally posted by NemeBro
Got a source?

https://i.imgur.com/Os9tMri.jpg

https://www.google.com/amp/s/screenrant.com/sony-pictures-profits-losses-2016/amp/


That was in 2017. And having a few profitable movies since then doesn't fix that situation much.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Clearly you missed Venom which grossed $850million on a $100mill budget.

You forgot to include marketing, advertisment, and distribution, less overseas profits percentages, etc

Darth Thor
I think Russos should demand 50% of the Avengers franchise.

I mean 50/50 is totally fair right?



Originally posted by Inhuman

You forgot to include marketing, advertisment, and distribution, less overseas profits percentages, etc


You mean like with every film?

I mean Are you honestly denying Venom was a massive success? It grossed 8.5 times its budget. Far From Home didnt. And Homecoming certainly didnt.

Like What is this Fake News week?

Inhuman
Originally posted by Darth Thor
You mean like with every film?

I mean Are you honestly denying Venom was a massive success? It grossed 8.5 times its budget. What is this Fake News week?

Link to where I said Venom was a failure.
What I said was that a few profitable movies Sony had had in a couple years are not enough to get them out the hole they are in.

BruceSkywalker
Originally posted by Inhuman
Sony pictures has been losing money for years now and is in bad shape. I don't think pumping out animated Spider Man movies, or films based on Black Cat or Silver Sable that could make small profits will help them much.


this is so undoubtedly true



Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
50-50 =/= taking it up the anus.

Sony doesn't understand the character, they tried turning him into a skateboarder.


exactly.... no reason for disney to not want more money.. other studios would do the same..

eThneoLgrRnae
A Marvel Universe w/out Spider-Man is like a DCU w/out Superman, Batman, or Wonder Woman. Doesn't really matter to me as although I do like SM I have no more interest in the movie MU after Endgame.

Josh_Alexander

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander


They screwed just as badly or worse with Amazing Spiderman 2.



Worse.

SM 3 is a meme goldmine and still had some redeeming qualities, such as Sandman, who was f*cking perfect.

TASM 2 was a mistake. It hurt to watch it. Gwenn's death is the only thing they got right.

NemeBro
Originally posted by Inhuman
That was in 2017. And having a few profitable movies since then doesn't fix that situation much.

To be more accurate, that article was from 2017. The actual financial data being cited is from 2016.

A lot can happen in three years so, frankly, I don't find your source particularly relevant right now tbh, especially considering you seem to be forgetting that Sony was making the lion's share of the money from the MCU Spidey films.

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Worse.

SM 3 is a meme goldmine and still had some redeeming qualities, such as Sandman, who was f*cking perfect.

TASM 2 was a mistake. It hurt to watch it. Gwenn's death is the only thing they got right.

Well, we all laugh at McGuirre's dances and emo personality, that was redeemable.

What's evident is that Sony has a bad record for long term quality. They seem able to start a franchise but not to maintain it.

There's no evidence to suggest that they'll do better now. Perhaps they will, perhaps they'll continue to repeat their failures.

StiltmanFTW
Maguire, not McGuirre.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
What's evident is that Sony has a bad record for long term quality. They seem able to start a franchise but not to maintain it.

There's no evidence to suggest that they'll do better now. Perhaps they will, perhaps they'll continue to repeat their failures.

They are no long-term planners, that's for sure.

Inhuman
Originally posted by NemeBro
To be more accurate, that article was from 2017. The actual financial data being cited is from 2016.

A lot can happen in three years so, frankly, I don't find your source particularly relevant right now tbh, especially considering you seem to be forgetting that Sony was making the lion's share of the money from the MCU Spidey films.

So what your are trying to say is that the Spiderman films (after ASM2 ) alone were enough to bring the entirety of the Sony film division out of the dumpster.
Cute theory tbh.

NemeBro
Originally posted by Inhuman
So what your are trying to say is that the Spiderman films (after ASM2 ) alone were enough to bring the entirety of the Sony film division out of the dumpster? Still no relevant evidence?

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Maguire, not McGuirre.



They are no long-term planners, that's for sure.

Hopefuly both sides are just applying pressure and trying to show strength... They'll come back to the table.

roughrider
Get Disney too angry, and they'll eat up Sony too. stick out tongue

Sony is playing a dangerous game, thinking they can pull Spidey out of the
MCU and that the Marvel fans wouldn't burn their studio to the ground in retaliation.

CaveDude33211
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Worse.

SM 3 is a meme goldmine and still had some redeeming qualities, such as Sandman, who was f*cking perfect.

TASM 2 was a mistake. It hurt to watch it. Gwenn's death is the only thing they got right.

Wasn't Gwenn's death what killed fan-interest in having a sequel?


I took my girlfriend to see that movie opening night - big mistake.


On the way home she was in tears and wouldn't shut up about Gwenn dying.

Her: "I can't believe she died! They killed her! She and Spiderman won't be able to have babies now!"

Me: "She was supposed to die. It was based off the original comics."

Her: "I hate you! I hate you! Gwenn shouldn't have died! I hated this movie and so did all my friends! Arghhhh!"

Me: "It's just a movie. Jesus Christ."

Her: "Gwenn shouldn't have died!"

Me: "Shut up!"


I dumped her a year later.

She gave good head, but she was annoying as hell and dumb as a bag of bricks.

cdtm
It put me to sleep. It's worse then bad, it's actually unwatchable.

roughrider
Originally posted by cdtm
It put me to sleep. It's worse then bad, it's actually unwatchable.

The best thing about TASM 2 is that it put Peter on the road to the MCU with Captain America: Civil War, because of it's failure. It proven to be a win in the end.

gauntlet o doom
I believe Spiderman and Sony have benefitted immensely from Marvel Studios involvement in the Tom Holland iteration of Spiderman, moreso than the other way around, so it wasn't unreasonable for Disney to negotiate for greater than the 5% movie profits they were receiving. Had Sony developed another Spiderman movie on their own, given how the previous two were received, it would have made less than Justice League and critically received worse than ASM2. I think a 50-50 split was reaching on Disney's part, however as always in negotiations, the first offer must always be more than what you're expecting to get; I think realistically Disney would have been happy with a 25-30% share.

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by gauntlet o doom
I believe Spiderman and Sony have benefitted immensely from Marvel Studios involvement in the Tom Holland iteration of Spiderman, moreso than the other way around, so it wasn't unreasonable for Disney to negotiate for greater than the 5% movie profits they were receiving. Had Sony developed another Spiderman movie on their own, given how the previous two were received, it would have made less than Justice League and critically received worse than ASM2. I think a 50-50 split was reaching on Disney's part, however as always in negotiations, the first offer must always be more than what you're expecting to get; I think realistically Disney would have been happy with a 25-30% share.

thumb up

BruceSkywalker
Originally posted by gauntlet o doom
I believe Spiderman and Sony have benefitted immensely from Marvel Studios involvement in the Tom Holland iteration of Spiderman, moreso than the other way around, so it wasn't unreasonable for Disney to negotiate for greater than the 5% movie profits they were receiving. Had Sony developed another Spiderman movie on their own, given how the previous two were received, it would have made less than Justice League and critically received worse than ASM2. I think a 50-50 split was reaching on Disney's part, however as always in negotiations, the first offer must always be more than what you're expecting to get; I think realistically Disney would have been happy with a 25-30% share.


great post

Darth Thor
Originally posted by gauntlet o doom
I believe Spiderman and Sony have benefitted immensely from Marvel Studios involvement in the Tom Holland iteration of Spiderman, moreso than the other way around, so it wasn't unreasonable for Disney to negotiate for greater than the 5% movie profits they were receiving. Had Sony developed another Spiderman movie on their own, given how the previous two were received, it would have made less than Justice League and critically received worse than ASM2. I think a 50-50 split was reaching on Disney's part, however as always in negotiations, the first offer must always be more than what you're expecting to get; I think realistically Disney would have been happy with a 25-30% share.


Word is Sony offered a 70/30 split but Disney refused anything less that 50%.

And even a 70/30 split would have been a Huge change to the original contract which all the fans were expecting to be renewed without issue.

Disney was already benefitting by having Spider-Man play a huge part in the last 2 Avenger films both of which grossed over $2billion, neither of which Sony received anything for.

On top of that Disney benefited from the toy/merchandise sales of these new well/received Spider-Man films.

Disney are simply being greedy at the expense of the fans.

-Pr-
https://cosmicbook.news/spider-man-deal-7-movies-avengers

No idea if true, but still, if it is, that's good.

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by -Pr-
https://cosmicbook.news/spider-man-deal-7-movies-avengers

No idea if true, but still, if it is, that's good.

Wouldn't be surprising.

The last thing Disney wants is to lose Spidey

SquallX
I do find Tom Holland to be a little two face when he just outright unfollowed Sony on social media for this. It would seem it forgot it was because of Sony he got the job, because Marvel wanted Asa Butterfield.

I do think loyalty to a certain point is required from Holland. Then again knowing the power Disney holds, they might have forced him to make a choice.

Darth Thor
Not sure about cosmic book news as a source, but this would be an offer Sony Might Accept.

The whole Venom being in the MCU thing would be further confirmation that Disney wanted 50% (now possibly 30%) of everything Sony makes Spider-Man related. Not just the Solo Spider-Man films.

Darth Thor
Originally posted by SquallX
I do find Tom Holland to be a little two face when he just outright unfollowed Sony on social media for this. It would seem it forgot it was because of Sony he got the job, because Marvel wanted Asa Butterfield.

I do think loyalty to a certain point is required from Holland. Then again knowing the power Disney holds, they might have forced him to make a choice.


Holland said in an interview last year that he wouldnt play Spidey if he had to give up the MCU.

So that doesnt surprise me.

SquallX
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Holland said in an interview last year that he wouldnt play Spidey if he had to give up the MCU.

So that doesnt surprise me.

Disney really got him by the balls then.

Then again, he wants to turn Spider-Man gay. So **** him.

Adam Grimes
Will you ever stop posting negative and poor thought-out posts? 😂

I don't think anyone finds your emo vision entertaining tbh.

SquallX

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by SquallX
I do find Tom Holland to be a little two face when he just outright unfollowed Sony on social media for this. It would seem it forgot it was because of Sony he got the job, because Marvel wanted Asa Butterfield.

I do think loyalty to a certain point is required from Holland. Then again knowing the power Disney holds, they might have forced him to make a choice.

Well consider that the MCU backlash is a fact...Him showing loyalty to Sony could cripple his career if not outright destroy it.

Holland choosing sides with Disney is the smartest move.

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Holland said in an interview last year that he wouldnt play Spidey if he had to give up the MCU.

So that doesnt surprise me.

It's all strategy.

SquallX
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Well consider that the MCU backlash is a fact...Him showing loyalty to Sony could cripple his career if not outright destroy it.

Holland choosing sides with Disney is the smartest move.

Never had a problem with that. I just thought since it was Sony that hired him, he should have showed a little respect to Sony.

He could have been the middle ground between both companies, but he just outright kicked Sony to the curb the second he had a chance.

I have no problem with him choosing Disney, it was just the speed he did it in.

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by SquallX
Never had a problem with that. I just thought since it was Sony that hired him, he should have showed a little respect to Sony.

He could have been the middle ground between both companies, but he just outright kicked Sony to the curb the second he had a chance.

I have no problem with him choosing Disney, it was just the speed he did it in.

Don't forget that the cinema industry is still an industry, where business is still the priority.

You can't allow your heart to play a part when business is concerned. Loyalty is but an outcome of money in the industry... Capitalism is all about interest and none about feelings.

Darth Thor
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Well consider that the MCU backlash is a fact...Him showing loyalty to Sony could cripple his career if not outright destroy it.

Holland choosing sides with Disney is the smartest move.


Nah he should have stayed neutral.

What if his next big films are with other studios? Then they will all know he will screw them for Disney? Not smart.

He is butthurt himself over the MCU split. He said it last year that he wouldnt give up his MCU ticket for a Sony only Spider-Man.

Darth Thor

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Nah he should have stayed neutral.

What if his next big films are with other studios? Then they will all know he will screw them for Disney? Not smart.

He is butthurt himself over the MCU split. He said it last year that he wouldnt give up his MCU ticket for a Sony only Spider-Man.

Fair point, yeah, I changed my mind, he should have stayed neutral.

BruceSkywalker
Originally posted by -Pr-
https://cosmicbook.news/spider-man-deal-7-movies-avengers

No idea if true, but still, if it is, that's good.

it does sound true, but who knows....


Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Wouldn't be surprising.

The last thing Disney wants is to lose Spidey


would you say Sony Needs Disney more than Disney needs Sony or the other way around

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by BruceSkywalker
it does sound true, but who knows....





would you say Sony Needs Disney more than Disney needs Sony or the other way around

In the short term, definitely Disney needs Fox more. Current MCU has involved Spider Man too much...

Remember how things were tense when Batista said he would resign as Drax?

A simple change of actor for a character can have dire effects in a movie... Now imagine eliminating a character from the picture! He leaving will definitely leave a whole in the MCU trajectory, despite he being abscent from Phase 4.

What's worse, Marvel currently has no way (at least not that I see of) to justify within the movies the abscence of Spiderman. They literaly can't use him at all... They can't mention him nor directly make reference as to why his departure.

So, storytellingwise, Disney has the losing side.

In terms of money, I see Fox having the losing side.

Darth Thor
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander

So, storytellingwise, Disney has the losing side.

In terms of money, I see Fox having the losing side.


Obviously you mean Sony not Fox.

Good points. This is a bit of a disaster for both sides. And both were benefiting from the previous deal which BOTH SIDES agreed to.

The beauty of that deal was no profit sharing on either side, and thats the only reason it happened and benefited everyone especially the fans.

BruceSkywalker
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
In the short term, definitely Disney needs Fox more. Current MCU has involved Spider Man too much...

Remember how things were tense when Batista said he would resign as Drax?

A simple change of actor for a character can have dire effects in a movie... Now imagine eliminating a character from the picture! He leaving will definitely leave a whole in the MCU trajectory, despite he being abscent from Phase 4.

What's worse, Marvel currently has no way (at least not that I see of) to justify within the movies the abscence of Spiderman. They literaly can't use him at all... They can't mention him nor directly make reference as to why his departure.

So, storytellingwise, Disney has the losing side.

In terms of money, I see Fox having the losing side.


which is why i fully except them to make up sooner or later

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Obviously you mean Sony not Fox.

Good points. This is a bit of a disaster for both sides. And both were benefiting from the previous deal which BOTH SIDES agreed to.

The beauty of that deal was no profit sharing on either side, and thats the only reason it happened and benefited everyone especially the fans.

Sony sorry! All the Fox-Disney deals, switching panoramas with Sony is still fresh.

Yeah, I think Fox benefited from having his character make real profit, while Disney made his overall franchise more powerful and compelling.

Originally posted by BruceSkywalker
which is why i fully except them to make up sooner or later


Let's hope that's the case.

I think Disney was feeling confindent after getting Fox (This time I do mean Fox, not Sony).

Josh_Alexander
https://wegotthiscovered.com/movies/disney-deal-spiderman-include-venom-mcu/

Sounds like the nightmare is coming to an end...

-Pr-
Originally posted by -Pr-
A few sites are saying that Kit Harrington (Jon Snow from GoT) is going to be revealed to be playing an MCU character at the big Disney expo-thing that's happening this weekend.

Given his age and being something of a big-ish name, I wouldn't be surprised if he's gonna get one of the bigger characters. Prepare for the internet to lose their minds if he gets made Wolverine, though.

Darth Thor
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander

Let's hope that's the case.

I think Disney was feeling confindent after getting Fox (This time I do mean Fox, not Sony).


Also they are in massive debt after the Fox purchase. They paid wayyyy too much for Fox after Universal tried to outbid them.

So now they are immediately shutting down any part of Fox making a loss, and trying to desperately grab profit wherever they can find it. Hence walking into this Sony renewal acting like d***s.

Inhuman
Originally posted by -Pr-


Based on his height, he could be a semi accurate Logan.

Darth Thor
Okayyy so now deadline are reporting that Disney had a 25% profit sharing offer on the table for half a year which Sony were not accepting, then in a final weird move they shot that up to 50% before calling the whole thing off.

So Disney shut down the deal.

This changes the story a lot. I think was fair for Disney to demand a 1/4 share, but I also think was fair for Sony to refuse sharing their biggest property like that.

Deadline also made it clear the profit sharing was only for the films Feige was involved in. IOW only the Holland Spider-Man films.

No ones to blame here, its just business. We got 5 films out of it, but one side was happier with the results than the other, so it had to end.

Josh_Alexander
onhygON2Vrk

Sounds like it's over. I knew Disney had to bend the knee!

Venom in the MCU! smile

Darth Thor
^ Fake news bro. Deadlines still reporting its over.

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