Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Actually saw this on Reddit yesterday.

I'm a Christian, I'm probably voting for him in 2020. Can't exactly call him a saint though.

(Sorry about the thread title. Fu#king glitchy site. I PM'd Imp to fix it.)


My favorite line from the article...

"A form of Christianity that could be co-opted by a political agenda suspect at its core."

That's okay. When you get a chance.

Thanks.

I have nothing against thevreligious. But teligion and politics should stay seperate. Trump is the Abin Saud of the Christian fundies.

Originally posted by Putinbot1
religion and politics should stay seperate.
Agreed.

The Church should not hold governance over how gay people live. And conversely the government should keep it's beak out of the Church (which sidenote I have a lot of respect for Buttigeig for calling out Beto on that shit).

Churches should be taxed, too.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol
Churches should be taxed, too.




Good luck with that. So many people find their "identities" in said groups and it becomes who they are, no separation hence the spill over (onto) everyone and thing they associate with.

Originally posted by Robtard
Because the guy who lies nigh every time he opens his mouth over thigns big and small alike, cheats on all his wives; with prostitutes and without even bothering to use protection, mocks disabled people, women and minorities and who has clearly never read the Bible ("Two Corinthians"; let alone follows it, somehow exudes their "Christian moral values" from his every pore.
"He mentioned God a couple of times, he says Merry Christmas, and he hates non-Christians and queerosexuals, just like us! That's our guy!"

Or it's more like "he might be a piece of shit, but he's more on our side when it comes to abortion, etc. than the democrats".

Unless someone can name me the democrat candidate that went out of their way to impress the evangelical crowd...like in any way?

Originally posted by Surtur
Or it's more like "he might be a piece of shit, but he's more on our side when it comes to abortion, etc. than the democrats".

Unless someone can name me the democrat candidate that went out of their way to impress the evangelical crowd...like in any way?
Anyone of them should have impressed them just by not being as big a c*nt as he is, but most evangelicals are easily swayed by false piety and mentions of God.

I stopped hanging out with evangelical friends because I realized they were fake as f*ck and lost causes when anything challenged their beliefs.

Cuz just remember: these people think abortion is murder. Keep that in mind. They literally think democrats approve of the murder of hundreds of thousands of babies *every single year*.

Nobody should be shocked they vote for republicans, even repugnant ones.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol
"He mentioned God a couple of times, he says Merry Christmas, and he hates non-Christians and queerosexuals, just like us! That's our guy!"

+ Bingo

Yep one guy. Moving on.

Originally posted by Surtur
Yep one guy. Moving on. Michele Bachmann is a woman... she has a large following.

Rick Perry thinks Trump is God's instrument. Pat Robertson said similar. You go on and dodge though.

Sure there are some crazies. And? You're actually not proving my argument wrong.

But hey I get it, you have a narrative: you wanna talk shit about evangelicals. Go for it, it doesn't bother me I think they're cray cray, but don't act like they'd be better off voting for a democrat

The "just some crazies" argument. Good, good.

Posting that Evangelicals don't do what you claim isn't "talking shit" about Evangelicals...

You didn't prove they don't do it because you posted one person.

Nor would you prove they don't do it if you posted 10 people.

Yes or no are you trying to claim they'd be better off voting for democrats?

I posted more than one person, so you're lying again. Pat Robertson alone has millions of followers who listen to his preachings, have you not heard of the "700 Club".

Originally posted by Robtard
I posted more than one person, so you're lying again. Pat Robertson alone has millions of followers who listen to his preachings, have you not heard of the "700 Club".
I've seen it and I don't f*cking believe it, nevermind how it's still on the air.

Originally posted by Robtard
I posted more than one person, so you're lying again. Pat Robertson alone has millions of followers who listen to his preachings, have you not heard of the "700 Club".

Didn't lie, I'd drop that. Yes or no would they be better off voting for democrats?

Originally posted by Eternal Idol
I've seen it and I don't f*cking believe it, nevermind how it's still on the air.

Millions of devote followers keep it going.

@surt

You did lie, as I posted three names and you said "one person". That's a lie.

Originally posted by Surtur
Didn't lie, I'd drop that. Yes or no would they be better off voting for democrats?

Yeah, especially if Medicare for All and tax reforms placing a larger burden on th be rich got passed.

Abortions don't affect the quality of their lives, even if they are not comfortable with the practice.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol
Yeah, especially if Medicare for All and tax reforms placing a larger burden on th be rich got passed.

Abortions don't affect the quality of their lives, even if they are not comfortable with the practice.



Neither does same-sex marriage, as we magically saw that the "sanctity of marriage" wasn't ruined for all male/female married couples.

Originally posted by Robtard
@surt

You did lie, as I posted three names and you said "one person". That's a lie.

I didn't lie, do not go down this road son

Originally posted by Robtard
@surt

You did lie, as I posted three names and you said "one person". That's a lie.
F*ck them too.

The FCC should have pulled the plug on it and evangelical shows just like it when they began wishing death on others and associating them with demonic forces.

Originally posted by Surtur
I didn't lie, do not go down this road son

Michele Bachmann, Rick Perry and Pat Robertson are three people, not "one person" as you claimed. You lied, kid. Even by Trump's shitty standards you lied. Moving on.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol
Yeah, especially if Medicare for All and tax reforms placing a larger burden on th be rich got passed.

Abortions don't affect the quality of their lives, even if they are not comfortable with the practice.

Here is the thing though, they view abortion as murder. Is it weird to get so upset over it? Maybe, but it's a major issue for them.

Don't try to use logic here, I'm asking you who they should vote for based on what seems to be important to them, not on what *you* feel should be important.

Originally posted by Robtard


Neither does same-sex marriage, as we magically saw that the "sanctity of marriage" wasn't ruined for all male/female married couples.


How could I have forgotten to mention gay marriage as another thing that affects their lives in no way, shape, or form?

Originally posted by Robtard
Michele Bachmann, Rick Perry and Pat Robertson are three people, not "one person" as you claimed. You lied, kid. Even by Trump's shitty standards you lied. Moving on.

You're done, moving on.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol
Churches should be taxed, too.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol
F*ck them too.

The FCC should have pulled the plug on it and evangelical shows just like it when they began wishing death on others and associating them with demonic forces.

They're protected.

Evangelicals have a huge amount of pull in government. Look at it this way, no Republican could feasibly hope to win the office of POTUS without the Evangelical mob behind them. Why they cater.

Evangelicals would lean more Democrat if they actually followed Jesus's teachings.

But this is a new mutant form of Christianity that has dogmatically bonded with a political Party. Like he says, that's particularly suspect.

Surt, I guess my reason in singling you out (I still doubt you actually read it btw) is that don't you find it a little creepy that Donald cynically and dishonestly adopted the large evangelical vote by selling out to a bunch of fundy cocksuckers. Doesn't it make you feel the least bit icky given your die-hard defense of the man and his legacy?

No I don't find Donald Trump acting like a standard politician creepy. If you do, I'd suggest sitting out the next election cuz there is nobody you could vote for without feeling creepy or hypocritical. They all pander to get votes. Look at the racist white democrats who pander to minorities, for example.

And the inevitable "it's different" responses(maybe not necessarily from you) will be one of the reasons Trump has any chance at all at winning in 2020.

Originally posted by Surtur
Here is the thing though, they view abortion as murder. Is it weird to get so upset over it? Maybe, but it's a major issue for them.

Don't try to use logic here, I'm asking you who they should vote for based on what seems to be important to them, not on what *you* feel should be important.
Isn't that exactly what they're doing though? Abortions make them uncomfortable, but they don't affect the quality of their lives. It's the best course of action for many other people's lives, and it's none of their business, but instead of simply choosing to not abort pregnancies themselves, they vote to make it illegal because they feel it's wrong and equate it to murder.

Anyhow, you asked if they'd be better off voting for Democrats, and the answer is yes...unless they're wealthy and want the biggest tax breaks they can get.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol
Isn't that exactly what they're doing though? Abortions make them uncomfortable, but they don't affect the quality of their lives. It's the best course of action for many other people's lives, and it's none of their business, but instead of simply choosing to not abort pregnancies themselves, they vote to make it illegal because they feel it's wrong and equate it to murder.

Anyhow, you asked if they'd be better off voting for Democrats, and the answer is yes...unless they're wealthy and want the biggest tax breaks they can get.

It's not rational, but it is what it is. Some illegal getting deported doesn't impact a lefties life, but they'll cry about it all the same.

And I guess I should rephrase my question to "would they be better off *based on what appears to be important to them*"

When I see evangelicals talk, it's not usually to cry about tax cuts.

Lol, Surt. To say all politicians participate in the same level of pandering and corruption as Trump is to be damn near blind.

Originally posted by Eternal Idol
Anyhow, you asked if they'd be better off voting for Democrats, and the answer is yes...unless they're wealthy and want the biggest tax breaks they can get.

see attached

Who said the same? It shouldn't *need* to be the same. Either corruption bothers you or it doesn't. Choose. "My guy is less corrupt than yours" is a shitty defense.

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
Lol, Surt. To say all politicians participate in the same level of pandering and corruption as Trump is to be damn near blind.



see attached

See: Equalization Tactics

-Blindly support X
-X does something bad
-Claim: "they're all bad!"
-Blindly support X

It's the way they justify the unjustifiable.

Originally posted by Robtard
See: Equalization Tactics

-Blindly support X
-X does something bad
-Claim: "they're all bad!"
-Blindly support X

It's the way they justify the unjustifiable.

^Only the unintelligent agree with this

Lol, Surt. I don't support semi-corrupt candidates either. Bernie Sanders doesn't take corporate handouts. So he's actually trying to represent The People.

Originally posted by Surtur
It's not rational, but it is what it is. Some illegal getting deported doesn't impact a lefties life, but they'll cry about it all the same.

And I guess I should rephrase my question to "would they be better off *based on what appears to be important to them*"

When I see evangelicals talk, it's not usually to cry about tax cuts.
No, but it does affect the quality of life for the people being deported and the families back home they were sending money to. Big glaring difference there between that example and abortions.

When you word it like that, sure, the evangelicals will feel better represented by Republicans, at least on the surface. They'd be better off under Democrats, not because they're Democrats, but because they're generally more progressive than Republicans, which tends to benefit non-wealthy people more.

And yes, you are using an equalization tactic.

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
And yes, you are using an equalization tactic.

He literally did it in his reply to you...

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
Lol, Surt. I don't support semi-corrupt candidates either. Bernie Sanders doesn't take corporate handouts. So he's actually trying to represent The People.

That's fine, but people tend to think whining over a behavior Trump does and supporting someone who does the same(even to a lesser extent) is okay. It is not. I'm glad you don't do that.

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
And yes, you are using an equalization tactic.

No I'm not.

Originally posted by Surtur
That's fine, but people tend to think whining over a behavior Trump does and supporting someone who does the same(even to a lesser extent) is okay. It is not. I'm glad you don't do that.

Here you're saying that if a given candidate accepts one shady donation of $50, it's no different than a candidate that accepts forty shady donations of $1,000,000.00.

When in reality, the latter is much worse. See: Equalization Tactics

I'm saying you either whine over both or neither. Only a piece of shit would think shady donations are okay as long as they are under a certain price.

Not equalizing isn't excusing the behavior, no matter how hard you try.

Good, don't excuse it. And if you feel taking shady donations means someone should not be in power you feel that way about *anyone* taking those kind of donations, no matter if it's 50 bucks or 50 million.

Hell the best part? You can do that while *still* thinking taking the 50 mil was worse. Awesome.

Equalization Tactic sandwich.

So tell me how much money in shady donations a person would have to take before you give a shit

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
Evangelicals would lean more Democrat if they actually followed Jesus's teachings.
Though I can see the argument for being democrat based on the faith, ie. caring through the poor and dispossessed, I don't think it's necessarily set in stone on the level of policy.

My personal stance on government largely derives from more pacifistic-leaning and peace upholding values in my faith, an aversion I have towards the use of violence and threat of violence, save for the preservation of human rights against violent actors, and I find the state to inherently exist as an institution of violence. Thus I am convicted towards a more classical liberal political philosophy, as while I believe in caring for the poor and and believe in a certain standard of sexual ethics beyond mere consent, I do not view these goals as justification for the leveraging of the violence of the state over other people.

Jesus probably wouldn't appreciate people who don't believe in him pulling this "what would jesus do " shit tho.

Originally posted by Surtur
So tell me how much money in shady donations a person would have to take before you give a shit

I'd have to know the specifics and context, as not everything is either black or white so to speak in reality, no matter how hard you try with your tactics.

eg if Buttigeig took $1,000.00 from the anti-Abortion lobby, I'd think that's shit, but he'd not lose my vote on that alone, as $1,000.00 effectively buys zero political pull. I'd also want to know why he did.

Same question to you. Go.

You didn't answer me though lol. I want a number. So $1,000 to Pete Butt wouldn't cause u to not vote for him, but you wouldn't agree with it.

Provide me the number now that would make u not vote for him.

Originally posted by Robtard
I'd have to know the specifics and context, as not everything is either black or white so to speak in reality, no matter how hard you try with your tactics.

eg if Buttigeig took $1,000.00 from the anti-Abortion lobby, I'd think that's shit, but he'd not lose my vote on that alone, as $1,000.00 effectively buys zero political pull. I'd also want to know why he did.

Same question to you. Go.

Robtard is alive.. HES ALIVE!

Originally posted by Surtur
You didn't answer me though lol. I want a number. So $1,000 to Pete Butt wouldn't cause u to not vote for him, but you wouldn't agree with it.

Provide me the number now that would make u not vote for him. Already answered that question. Specifics and context is needed.

Can you answer your own question now, since you seemingly think it's a simple answer.

Originally posted by Grand-Moff-Gav
Robtard is alive.. HES ALIVE!

Was Robtard believed to be not alive?

U gave a specific example about anti-abortion lobby so we can use that. Name the price that would cost you the vote, this should not be hard. We'll move on if your next response doesn't contain a specific figure.

But the question seems irrelevant, because any politician taking corporate hand-outs isn't just taking normal people pocket change amounts. They're probably in the hundreds of thousands and millions. So if they're taking corporate hands-outs at all, they're a no-go, because ultimately that's who they are representing. Not we the people.

@surt So you're going to dodge answering a question you posed. Okay, figured.

Originally posted by Robtard
Was Robtard believed to be not alive?

Whenever I come back and see a member I recall from the old days still posting I get all Rafiki/Brian Blessed.

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
But the question seems irrelevant, because any politician taking corporate hand-outs isn't just taking normal people pocket change amounts. They're probably in the hundreds of thousands and millions. So if they're taking corporate hands-outs at all, they're a no-go, because ultimately that's who they are representing. Not we the people.

Indeed, a person with a fundraising push that brings in 5.000.000 isn't likely to know, or even be able to screen, an individual amount of $50.

Originally posted by Robtard
@surt So you're going to dodge answering a question you posed. Okay, figured.

Lol you can't even answer the question, troll.

Originally posted by Grand-Moff-Gav
Whenever I come back and see a member I recall from the old days still posting I get all Rafiki/Brian Blessed.

Ah

Also, his Henry 8.0 is a gem

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
But the question seems irrelevant, because any politician taking corporate hand-outs isn't just taking normal people pocket change amounts. They're probably in the hundreds of thousands and millions. So if they're taking corporate hands-outs at all, they're a no-go, because ultimately that's who they are representing. Not we the people.

Shady donations are a no go no matter what, yes.

Originally posted by Surtur
Lol you can't even answer the question, troll.

Keep lying, but I did answer you directly it's on the previous page, specifics and context is needed.

eg 2: Now if Buttigeig knowingly took even a dollar from a group like NAMBLA (pedophiles), he'd lose my vote.

Are you going to dodge answering your own question again?

Originally posted by Robtard
Keep lying, but I did answer you directly it's on the previous page, specifics and context is needed.

eg 2: Now if Buttigeig knowingly took even a dollar from a group like NAMBLA (pedophiles), he'd lose my vote.

Are you going to dodge answering your own question again?

You literally gave a specific example of getting $1000 bucks and said it wouldn't make u not vote, I asked what the number in that scenario would need to be in order to change that.

What is the number?

We're moving on if your next response doesn't contain a figure. Up to you.

Originally posted by Robtard
Equalization Tactic sandwich.

Yeah, I like how in Surt's equalized morality world there's no difference between a guy who murdered one person out of self defence and a guy who premeditated the murder of thousands. Morality flatland!

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
Yeah, I like how in Surt's equalized morality world there's no difference between a guy who murdered one person out of self defence and a guy who premeditated the murder of thousands. Morality flatland!

It's more like some little weasel saying "this guy murdered a family of four, but at least he didn't kill as many as Ted Bundy".

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
Yeah, I like how in Surt's equalized morality world there's no difference between a guy who murdered one person out of self defence and a guy who premeditated the murder of thousands. Morality flatland!

It's impossible to murder someone in self-defense, at least in the US. I don't know what sh!tbag country you're thinking of.

Originally posted by Silent Master
It's impossible to murder someone in self-defense.

Yeah but these people love believing in the impossible.

Originally posted by Surtur
You literally gave a specific example of getting $1000 bucks and said it wouldn't make u not vote, I asked what the number in that scenario would need to be in order to change that.

What is the number?

We're moving on if your next response doesn't contain a figure. Up to you.

Another dodge...

Protip: Don't ask a question that you're uncomfortable answering yourself. Just poor tactics.

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
Yeah, I like how in Surt's equalized morality world there's no difference between a guy who murdered one person out of self defence and a guy who premeditated the murder of thousands. Morality flatland!

I think you meant "killed" in self defense, but yes.

They will use your typo to ignore the meat of your comment.

Originally posted by Robtard
Another dodge...

Protip: Don't ask a question that you're uncomfortable answering yourself. Just poor tactics.

Okay you refuse to answer so we will move on.

Answer was giving on page 3 and then repeated on page 4. Silly time-waster-troll games, you and SM really are made for each other.

Originally posted by Robtard
I think you meant "killed" in self defense, but yes.

They will use your typo to ignore the meat of your comment.

It's not about it being a typo, it's about it being an incorrect example that he knew people like you would latch onto as if an intelligent point was made.

Originally posted by Robtard
Answer was giving on page 3 and then repeated on page 4. Silly time-waster-troll games, you and SM really are made for each other.

We're moving on, you had your chance to answer. It's done now.

Originally posted by Surtur
It's not about it being a typo, it's about it being an incorrect example that he knew people like you would latch onto as if an intelligent point was made.
It was clearly a typo and you used that error to ignore the meat of his post. It's an old troll tactic.

My first response to him didn't even mention it.

Typo. You mean he meant to type killed, but his fingers slipped?

I typo can also be using a wrong word when it's obvious they meant another similar word. Call it a typo, call it a brainfart, or don't, time-waster-troll.

But you do acknowledge I addressed his point before I ever pointed it out right? You were mistaken.

LOL. None of us right-wing Christians actually worship Trump, ffs. OP and the person who wrote that article is just butthurt that Trump is so popular and no democrat can beat him in 2020. Keep crying.


Trump/Pence 2020.

Originally posted by Robtard
I think you meant "killed" in self defense, but yes.

They will use your typo to ignore the meat of your comment.

Yup, I noticed.

Anything Surt can do to avoid coming to terms with his obvious bias. Give him an inch and he'll take a mile. Okay, fixed, now will you confront your hypocrisy?

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
Yeah, I like how in Surt's equalized morality world there's no difference between a guy who killed one person out of self defence and a guy who premeditated the murder of thousands. Morality flatland!

Hint: Trump is not the guy killing out of self-defense. He's premeditated mass deception because it's in his very personality (which is made up of various disorders) and he was bought by the religious Right and peddled by their hypocritical goons. He's an obvious conman and to be one of the ones endlessly defending his non-stop treason is to be a victim of his con.



...

Originally posted by eThneoLgrRnae
LOL. None of us right-wing Christians actually worship Trump, ffs. OP and the person who wrote that article is just butthurt...

Good job only reading the title, but commenting anyway. Thanks for being irrelevant.

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
Yup, I noticed.

Anything Surt can do to avoid coming to terms with his obvious bias. Give him an inch and he'll take a mile. Okay, fixed, now will you confront your hypocrisy?



Hint: Trump is not the guy killing out of self-defense. He's premeditated mass deception because it's in his very personality (which is made up of various disorders) and he was bought by the religious Right and peddled by their hypocritical goons. He's an obvious conman and to be one of the ones endlessly defending his non-stop treason is to be a victim of his con.



...

Rob lied. I responded to your scenario and didn't mention a typo. I commented on it after somebody else did, but I did respond to your scenario without mentioning it(and I did notice it).

Your scenario is wrong no matter if you call it a murder or not. We were discussing people doing the same thing, but on different scales. That isn't what your example was about. It was about two different things. Self defense is not the same as murder. Two politicians of varying levels of corruption are not like a guy killing in self defense and one killing in murder.

Anyways, the bottom line is that the reason the christian right get behind Trump is because they believe that a republican will better serve their interests than a democrat. You can argue that they are mistaken in that belief, but the fact remains that is why they do it.

Yes there are some who "worship" him, but that's a very very tiny minority of the christian right. Plus God is a petty jealous little thing, it's a sin to worship other things.

Originally posted by Surtur
I get why Rob lied, but why would you fall for it? I responded to your scenario and didn't mention a typo. I commented on it after somebody else did, but I did respond to your scenario without mentioning it(and I did notice it).

Your scenario is wrong no matter if you call it a murder or not. We were discussing people doing the same thing, but on different scales. That isn't what your example was about. It was about two different things. Self defense is not the same as murder. Two politicians of varying levels of corruption are not like a guy killing in self defense and one killing in murder.


Saying the analogy breaks down is not an honest approach to the issue. It's an analogy. They're both moral issues, so yes, it's relevant. "Forms of killing" vs "Levels of corruption." You might still lock up someone who kills in self defense, but you probably not for as long as you would someone who murdered hundreds or thousands. Likewise with corruption. If someone took a little corrupt campaign contribution, but was otherwise relatively blameless would be less guilty than someone who purposely and knowingly took tons of corrupt contributions and conned anyone and everyone they came into contact with and didn't have an honest bone in their body. Intentions matter. And it's reflected in the justice system.

Surt defense: tries to say the analogy doesn't work.


Originally posted by Surtur
Anyways, the bottom line is that the reason the christian right get behind Trump is because they believe that a republican will better serve their interests than a democrat. You can argue that they are mistaken in that belief, but the fact remains that is why they do it.

I don't disagree.


Originally posted by Surtur
Yes there are some who "worship" him, but that's a very very tiny minority of the christian right. Plus God is a petty jealous little thing, it's a sin to worship other people.

Good lord, I'm pretty sure the writer meant for the use of "worship" in the title to be hyperbolic. But there is a disturbing level of admiration for Trump in that they think he was "chosen by God," as if he's a part of some divine intervention. (My eyes can't roll back in my head far enough). But the point is (if you had read the article) that the Right makes all sorts of excuses for Trump's rampant immorality when they completely rebuked Clinton for one little BJ. But like you said, it's the hypocrisy of him being associated with their political agenda and Clinton wasn't. So that makes his immorality OK...

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
Saying the analogy breaks down is not an honest approach to the issue. It's an analogy. They're both moral issues, so yes, it's relevant. "Forms of killing" vs "Levels of corruption." You might still lock up someone who kills in self defense, but you probably not for as long as you would someone who murdered hundreds or thousands. Likewise with corruption. If someone took a little corrupt campaign contribution, but was otherwise relatively blameless would be less guilty than someone who purposely and knowingly took tons of corrupt contributions and conned anyone and everyone they came into contact with and didn't have an honest bone in their body. Intentions matter. And it's reflected in the justice system.

Surt defense: tries to say the analogy doesn't work.

I accurately pointed out your analogy doesn't work(at least IMO) and pointed out a better analogy. Yes taking tons of shady donations is indeed worse than a little. But if $50 in shady donations is not enough to warrant the loss of a vote, I still would like to know the bare minimum in shady donations one would need to get before it begins to matter(this is aimed more at Rob, but you can answer too if you want).




It's why I put the word in quotes. And the disturbing level of admiration comes from a small minority of Christians.

As for Clinton, yes people tend to make excuses for why something is bad when the other side does it, but not when their side does.

And when both sides practice rampant hypocrisy it is futile to try to go to evangelicals "why don't you care more about trump doing bad things?". Plus for 99% of those saying that, what they really mean is "why don't you vote democrat?"

Originally posted by Surtur
I accurately pointed out your analogy doesn't work. Yes taking tons of shady donations is indeed worse than a little. But if $50 in shady donations is not enough to warrant the loss of a vote, I still would like to know the bare minimum in shady donations one would need to get before it begins to matter(this is aimed more at Rob, but you can answer too if you want).

1 dollar more than their candidate receives.

Originally posted by Surtur
I accurately pointed out your analogy doesn't work(at least IMO) and pointed out a better analogy. Yes taking tons of shady donations is indeed worse than a little. But if $50 in shady donations is not enough to warrant the loss of a vote, I still would like to know the bare minimum in shady donations one would need to get before it begins to matter(this is aimed more at Rob, but you can answer too if you want).

And I pointed out why the analogy does work. Not sure why you don't understand it. Sounds like you just want to throw it out because it's an analogy. And my previous answer to your question still stands: it's a stupid question to ask...

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
But the question seems irrelevant, because any politician taking corporate hand-outs isn't just taking normal people pocket change amounts. They're probably in the hundreds of thousands and millions. So if they're taking corporate hands-outs at all, they're a no-go, because ultimately that's who they are representing. Not we the people.


Originally posted by Surtur
And the disturbing level of admiration comes from a small minority of Christians.

I really think you're underestimating the evangelical influence. There are a lot of fundamentalist evangelical Christians. Much of my close family are. My dad is an evangelical die-hard Republican. It's not a small minority and they really do listen to people like Billy Graham's son and so forth...

THANK YOU, LORD JESUS, FOR PRESIDENT TRUMP

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
And I pointed out why the analogy does work. Not sure why you don't understand it. Sounds like you just want to throw it out because it's an analogy. And my previous answer to your question still stands: it's a stupid question to ask...

I disagree it doesn't work given we were talking about the same act, but on different scales. Killing in defense might get you locked up, but it's *not* the same as murder. We can just agree to disagree on the analogy it is not a big deal.

Well Rob feels there *is* an acceptable level of shady donations one can take. It's good that you realize it's wrong no matter how much one is getting. I'm still curious what his number is if $1,000 worth of shady donations isn't enough to cost someone his vote. I think that is a valid question, at least for someone who has admitted there is a level of corruption they are willing to tolerate.




I'm not saying there aren't a lot of evangelicals, I'm saying IMO it's not anywhere close to the majority of them who view Trump as "divine" or anything like that.

Originally posted by Surtur
Anyways, the bottom line is that the reason the christian right get behind Trump is because they believe that a republican will better serve their interests than a democrat. You can argue that they are mistaken in that belief, but the fact remains that is why they do it.

Yes there are some who "worship" him, but that's a very very tiny minority of the christian right. Plus God is a petty jealous little thing, it's a sin to worship other things.


That's correct that Trump serves our interests better (he put two conservatives on SC, after all). Pretty much every single democrat supports abortion which is something that doesn't sit well with most of us who have real Christian beliefs.


Yes, as God admits in the Bible, He is a very jealous God. However, he is far from being "little."


I stand by what I said in my original post that PL is just butthurt that Trump is so popular and the fact he knows no democrat has any real chance of beating him in 2020. PL can laugh it off all he likes but it's true.

Originally posted by Surtur
I'm not saying there aren't a lot of evangelicals, I'm saying IMO it's not anywhere close to the majority of them who view Trump as "divine" or anything like that.

A distinction without a difference. Evangelicals see Trump as fulfilling God's will, preparing for the end times, etc. Whether they consider him "divine" or just admire him, it doesn't matter.

The point is: evangelicals love Trump because he was bought by the religious Right and so many prominent fundamentalist Christian goons have been so strongly endorsing him.

And I mean, none of this is surprising, per se. I assumed it long ago, but to read exactly how it went down is interesting.

Trump reminds me of Chancellor Sutler from V For Vendetta...


...

The Christian right worships Donald Trump, because they are all trash. There, I saved everyone the read.

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
A distinction without a difference. Evangelicals see Trump as fulfilling God's will, preparing for the end times, etc. Whether they consider him "divine" or just admire him, it doesn't matter.

The point is: evangelicals love Trump because he was bought by the religious Right and so many prominent fundamentalist Christian goons have been so strongly endorsing him.

And I mean, none of this is surprising, per se. I assumed it long ago, but to read exactly how it went down is interesting.

Trump reminds me of Chancellor Sutler from V For Vendetta...


...

I think most just think he can better fulfill their needs(or what they think they need) than others can.

So it's no different than the reasons crazies wearing pussy hates voted for Hillary, cuz they felt *she* could best meet their needs.

Not saying everything is 100% the same so for those who read this and get ready to scream about how it's different? Yeah...don't

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
The Christian right worships Donald Trump, because they are all trash. There, I saved everyone the read.

I have an alternative:

"Some of the Christian right supports Donald Trump because they are ignorant, trashy, or hate the Dems so much that they'd rather support Trump than have to deal with evil Democrats. There, I saved everyone the read."


I know plenty of Christian Right-wingers who detest Trump. Adultery doesn't sit well with many Christians. Sure, many are hypocrites and self-righteous but if there is one thing that Christians are great at it is being self-righteous, judgmental pricks.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
The Christian right worships Donald Trump, because they are all trash. There, I saved everyone the read.

Hm, not a good post, sir. Which is unfortunate because you often have great posts.

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
Hm, not a good post, sir. Which is unfortunate because you often have great posts.
Since when? Most of his posts are him reading the worst possible intentions he can into the people he disagrees with and calling them *****. This isn't an unusual post from him. He's one of the least good faith actors I've run into in the GDF.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Since when? Most of his posts are him reading the worst possible intentions he can into the people he disagrees with and calling them *****. This isn't an unusual post from him. He's one of the least good faith actors I've run into in the GDF.

He just had a good post here, about 2/3rds of the way down... click

I just feel like at the end of the day, most of them aren't cultish. There is a loud minority that are. Some just do the typical "thank jesus" cuz they thank him for everything.

Your average Trumper

bTZPOtKlYF8
http://youtu.be/bTZPOtKlYF8

Basically: Trump is a "chosen one" of god; who god works through and if you go against the "chosen one" god will curse you and your children and their children etc., cos reasons.

If this isn't a mental illness, I don't know what else to call it. Edit: And cult-like behavior

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
Hm, not a good post, sir. Which is unfortunate because you often have great posts.

It is not a kind post, but it is an honest one.

The Christian Right purports to condemn gambling, but supports a casino magnate.

The Christian Right purports to condemn sexual immorality, but supports an adulterer and whoremonger.

I could go on and on.

For people whose identity is formed around these values to so quickly abandon them, and for what?

To leverage the power of government to fascistically impose their religious beliefs on the rest of a free society.

To hypocritically force others to live according to the values they abandoned in order to gain the power to force them to do so.

To create a kingdom on Earth in defiance of the bible in which they purport to believe?

No, these people are ****ing garbage.

It is not nice, but it is accurate. And they need the mirror held up to them if you ever want to ping their tiny little consciences. Because pretending that they are nice, misguided people who just need a little understanding gives them a free pass to continue their bullshit.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
It is not a kind post, but it is an honest one.

The Christian Right purports to condemn gambling, but supports a casino magnate.

The Christian Right purports to condemn sexual immorality, but supports an adulterer and whoremonger.

I could go on and on.

For people whose identity is formed around these values to so quickly abandon them, and for what?

To leverage the power of government to fascistically impose their religious beliefs on the rest of a free society.

To hypocritically force others to live according to the values they abandoned in order to gain the power to force them to do so.

To create a kingdom on Earth in defiance of the bible in which they purport to believe?

No, these people are ****ing garbage.

It is not nice, but it is accurate. And they need the mirror held up to them if you ever want to ping their tiny little consciences. Because pretending that they are nice, misguided people who just need a little understanding gives them a free pass to continue their bullshit.

Originally posted by Robtard
Your average Trumper

bTZPOtKlYF8
http://youtu.be/bTZPOtKlYF8

Basically: Trump is a "chosen one" of god; who god works through and if you go against the "chosen one" god will curse you and your children and their children etc., cos reasons.

If this isn't a mental illness, I don't know what else to call it. Edit: And cult-like behavior

That's mental illness.


When has God actually even chosen an adulterer, a philanderer, a thief, boor, vulgar, miscreant, all in one person, to be His chosen one?

The closest example I can think of is the calling of Isaiah because Isaiah, apparently, had a vulgar mouth. Before Isaiah could begin his prophetic dispensation, he had to touch a hot coal to his mouth to "cleanse" himself of his terrible mouth. Then, supposedly, he was good enough to document all those prophecies.


Any Christian want to help me understand how Trump could be God's chosen one a la Isaiah or Saul (Paul)?

See some sort of valid point might have been able to be made had he not tried to say that is an "average trumper". You'd have to also say the crazed pussy hat wearing russian conspiracy theory shouting person is the average democrat.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
The Christian Right purports to condemn gambling, but supports a casino magnate.

I could not find a source for this. Do you have the specific example you have in mind that also shows that all the members of this Christian Right support this?

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
The Christian Right purports to condemn sexual immorality, but supports an adulterer and whoremonger.

Factually, almost none do. Many condemn Trump for his wicked ways. You are referring to some Christian Evangelicals, which is part of the Christian Right. So a fraction of a fraction is what you really mean. What you did is called a sweeping generalization. Usually, you try to justify your logical fallacy by claiming it was hyperbole. If you do, then okay. If you don't, you're just ignorant like a racist person which makes you trash.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
I could go on and on.


Please do.

Such as his murder of thousand of innocents in his foreign soil campaigns that he continues from Obama's reign. This one is important. But many Democrats don't point it out (they used to: loved pointing it out until they got countered with "Didja you forget about Obama?" because it's inconvenient to call attention to the mass murder of innocents on foreign soil because it is a bipartisan position.

haha, I love self-righteous grandstanding like this. This is is why libtards virtue signal so much: it's fun to say stuff that makes you "more righteous" than others.

Suck my platitudes!

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
No, these people are ****ing garbage.

I agree. I am just not ignorant enough to make a sweeping generalization like you are. That's what racists do. estahuh

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
It is not nice, but it is accurate.

It's inaccurate. If this was Politifact Check, they'd rate your statement as "mostly false." estahuh

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
And they need the mirror held up to them if you ever want to ping their tiny little consciences. Because pretending that they are nice, misguided people who just need a little understanding gives them a free pass to continue their bullshit.

Agreed.

Perhaps if Trump was a democrat and a strong supporter of mass infantacide -- instead of being all the other things you mentioned about him -- like literally every democrat nominee is then I suppose you'd have no problem believing he was chosen by God or whatever lol. As if God would actually be ok with that lol.


For the record, I don't think Trump is anything close to being a saint or Christ-like but I do thank God nearly every day that he is president and that b*tch Hillary ain't. I do not worship him regardless of what idiots like Adam may think but I do think he postponed the fall of America for several years by becoming president.


Our economny was in the shitter under Obama despite what you may think (although I agree that the warmonger Bush had a lot to do with that) and we were on the road to economic collapse. Trump averted that for at least a short period, imo, and I still believe and no one will convince me otherwise that if Hillary had been electe4d that we woiuld've gotten into a nuclear war by now.

I read: "Perhaps if Trump was a democrat and a strong supporter of mass infantacide", then stopped.

Another unhinged star/fly diatribe it seems.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
It is not a kind post, but it is an honest one.

The Christian Right purports to condemn gambling, but supports a casino magnate.

The Christian Right purports to condemn sexual immorality, but supports an adulterer and whoremonger.

I could go on and on.

For people whose identity is formed around these values to so quickly abandon them, and for what?

To leverage the power of government to fascistically impose their religious beliefs on the rest of a free society.

To hypocritically force others to live according to the values they abandoned in order to gain the power to force them to do so.

To create a kingdom on Earth in defiance of the bible in which they purport to believe?

No, these people are ****ing garbage.

It is not nice, but it is accurate. And they need the mirror held up to them if you ever want to ping their tiny little consciences. Because pretending that they are nice, misguided people who just need a little understanding gives them a free pass to continue their bullshit.

That's more like it. 👌

But I would say that though there ARE many hypocritical leaders of the Christian Right who blatantly go against what they're supposed to stand for (homosexuality, child pornography, molestation, etc) a lot of the *supporters* of the Christian Right are genuinely nice and misguided. I say this because much of my family is just misguided. But yes, the cult leaders are much more insidious and diabolical. Cancerous trash.

Originally posted by eThneoLgrRnae
Perhaps if Trump was a democrat and a strong supporter of mass infantacide -- instead of being all the other things you mentioned about him -- like literally every democrat nominee is then I suppose you'd have no problem believing he was chosen by God or whatever lol. As if God would actually be ok with that lol.


For the record, I don't think Trump is anything close to being a saint or Christ-like but I do thank God nearly every day that he is president and that b*tch Hillary ain't. I do not worship him regardless of what idiots like Adam may think but I do think he postponed the fall of America for several years by becoming president.


Our economny was in the shitter under Obama despite what you may think (although I agree that the warmonger Bush had a lot to do with that) and we were on the road to economic collapse. Trump averted that for at least a short period, imo, and I still believe and no one will convince me otherwise that if Hillary had been electe4d that we woiuld've gotten into a nuclear war by now. durbaby

Abstinence makes the church grow fondlers

Originally posted by Putinbot1
durbaby






Yup, education, foreign relations, the middle east, and the environment are headed straight for the shitter. Trump is saving America! God be praised!

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
That's more like it. 👌

But I would say that though there ARE many hypocritical leaders of the Christian Right who blatantly go against what they're supposed to stand for (homosexuality, child pornography, molestation, etc) a lot of the *supporters* of the Christian Right are genuinely nice and misguided. I say this because much of my family is just misguided. But yes, the cult leaders are much more insidious and diabolical. Cancerous trash.

Your beliefs do not make you a good person, your actions do. If you believe good things, but do bad things, then you are still a bad person. We need to stop carrying water for people who think and say the right things, but then throw all of those purported beliefs and values out the window when it comes time to put their money where their mouths are.

Originally posted by eThneoLgrRnae
Perhaps if Trump was a democrat and a strong supporter of mass infantacide -- instead of being all the other things you mentioned about him -- like literally every democrat nominee is then I suppose you'd have no problem believing he was chosen by God or whatever lol. As if God would actually be ok with that lol.


For the record, I don't think Trump is anything close to being a saint or Christ-like but I do thank God nearly every day that he is president and that b*tch Hillary ain't. I do not worship him regardless of what idiots like Adam may think but I do think he postponed the fall of America for several years by becoming president.


Our economny was in the shitter under Obama despite what you may think (although I agree that the warmonger Bush had a lot to do with that) and we were on the road to economic collapse. Trump averted that for at least a short period, imo, and I still believe and no one will convince me otherwise that if Hillary had been electe4d that we woiuld've gotten into a nuclear war by now.

If a Christian baker cannot bake a cake for a gay couple, because that would be supporting their sin, then how can a Christian voter cast a ballot for an adulterer and whoremonger without also supporting his sin?

It seems like a pretty selective application of your biblical principles.

Moreover, why would you wish to delay any of the things you believe Trump has delayed?

If you believe in the second coming, then why would you wish to delay the events that must come to pass before Jesus returns?

It is almost like you are not confident of your salvation, and want to delay the judgment.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Your beliefs do not make you a good person, your actions do. If you believe good things, but do bad things, then you are still a bad person.

You're like a Christian Prophet with those words:

James 2:18,19





All Praise Prophet Poe for his words are just and righteous.

...

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
If a Christian baker cannot bake a cake for a gay couple, because that would be supporting their sin, then how can a Christian voter cast a ballot for an adulterer and whoremonger without also supporting his sin?



https://media2.giphy.com/media/QgixZj4y3TwnS/giphy.gif

It's a good question. I don't know how supportive they were of Trump beforehand, but I do know that the Evangelical "Community" loves and admires Billy Graham, so I imagine his magazine must have a pretty big impact.

I just wonder if Focks News 24-hour propaganda machine will cover this or if it will just be a minor blurb on the outskirts of the internet.

I told you before the trump worshipers were not as numerous as you thought...

Originally posted by Surtur
I told you before the trump worshipers were not as numerous as you thought...

81% of evangelicals voted for Trump. And roughly a quarter of the population is evangelical. So yes, it's YUGE for votes.

Voting for someone and worshipping them are two entirely different things

Originally posted by Silent Master
Voting for someone and worshipping them are two entirely different things


It's sad that something as obvious as that has to be explained to him lol.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Voting for someone and worshipping them are two entirely different things

In our duopoly political system, a vote for someone can often represent a vote AGAINST another. In this case, many votes for Trump - a ton of them were Democrats - were actually votes against Hillary.

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
81% of evangelicals voted for Trump. And roughly a quarter of the population is evangelical. So yes, it's YUGE for votes.

No it's not yuge, but I can tell people need some sort of victory over the guy so okay.

This is the end, the walls are closing in, etc etc.

Evangelical support of Trump is actually huge: https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2016/11/09/how-the-faithful-voted-a-preliminary-2016-analysis/

Edit: ^ That was in 2016, we'll see how Evangelicals do in 2020.

Considering there are about 95million people who identify as Evangelicals in the US, that's a huge potential voting pool to draw from.

@robbie: of course it's huge. He's pro-life while all the democrats support late-tem abortion (hell, some even support killing the baby AFTER it's been born). Big deal. That doesn't mean they worship him lol.


Anyone who is truly Christian knows deep down that abortion is wrong... very wrong. It's not just some minor side issue with evangelicals.

Originally posted by Robtard
Evangelical support of Trump is actually huge: https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2016/11/09/how-the-faithful-voted-a-preliminary-2016-analysis/

Edit: ^ That was in 2016, we'll see how Evangelicals do in 2020.

Considering there are about 95million people who identify as Evangelicals in the US, that's a huge potential voting pool to draw from.

Which democrat voter should earn the evangelical support then? Creepy Joe? Do tel who Christians should vote for if not Trump.

Originally posted by dadudemon
In our duopoly political system, a vote for someone can often represent a vote AGAINST another. In this case, many votes for Trump - a ton of them were Democrats - were actually votes against Hillary. I have relatives who did that -- and they've regretted it since.

Originally posted by Mindship
I have relatives who did that -- and they've regretted it since.

Choosing for shit will get you shit regardless of whether or not you were trying to show a larger pile of shit you didn't like it.

Ah, the spite vote.

Thanks fer givin' me even LESS faith in humanity.

I wouldn't be surprised if the majority of votes were people voting against either Trump or Hillary. rather than for them.

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
Ah, the spite vote.

Thanks fer givin' me even LESS faith in humanity.

The spite impeachment votes didn't already give you less faith?

Originally posted by Patient_Leech
Ah, the spite vote.

Thanks fer givin' me even LESS faith in humanity.

I broke down the numbers in another post.

Lots of Pro-Bernie spit voters in 2016. Millions.

Tons of Dems voted for Trump that had voted for Dems and Bernie prior to the general election.

I believe this was called the "Bernie Effect" or maybe I'm confusing terms. Something like that.

Democrats: Trump is racist

*many vote for him*

Hmmm!

Maybe up to 13% of previous Obama voters voted for Trump in 2016...

So millions of people?

Originally posted by Robtard
Maybe up to 13% of previous Obama voters voted for Trump in 2016...

Damn.


That's more than I thought. I thought it was 7% but didn't want to throw numbers out there and be wrong.