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This is current Goku in the manga.

How would he do against Broly from the movie?

Goku with UI? Isn't that form around blue Gogeta level?

Broly wouldn't stand a chance.

Originally posted by Mendax
This is current Goku in the manga.

How would he do against Broly from the movie?

Broly massacres him and also massacres anime CUI Goku from ToP.

We really have no idea what current Goku is capable of just yet.

He's certainly grown vastly more powerful since entering that RoSaT-esque chamber and training with Merus, though, and it appears that he's at least able to activate UI(omen) at will now. Additionally, Merus was about to use his full power against Goku during their final training session, until Whis intervened. Even though we don't know how powerful Merus is in comparison to, say, Whis, the fact that an Angel was about to go all-out against Goku is pretty telling of his power now.

tl;dr
I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Goku has surpassed movie Broly by this point. We should know for sure if that's the case in the next few chapters.

Pretty academic to call off the training session because of how much power Merus was using.


That's the entire point of training, to surpass your trainer. What would Whis do if Goku and Vegeta became his equal? How is tiering someone up somehow more impartial then testing the limits of that training in a full fight?

Is Whis so arrogant he can't imagine mortals getting that strong? If so, I hope they blow right past him someday, and force him into acknowledging his hubris by facing an epic beat down he can't walk away from.

It had more to do with Merus.

He was about to use his full power against Goku, which would have constituted a "battle". Evidently Angels participating in a full-fledged battle like that is against the Angel code, which is why Whis intervened.

Prior to that, Whis and Daishinkan were just writing it off as "training"(which is acceptable for Angels), because Merus wasn't going all-out.

Originally posted by Galan007
It had more to do with Merus.

He was about to use his full power against Goku, which would have constituted a "battle". Evidently Angels participating in a full-fledged battle like that is against the Angel code, which is why Whis intervened.

Prior to that, Whis and Daishinkan were just writing it off as "training"(which is acceptable for Angels), because Merus wasn't going all-out.


It's a strange distinction though

If it's about interference in mortal affairs, then powering up someone with angel techniques is way more meddlesome then beating one down in a fight.


I just get the feeling these laws hinge on the belief that mortals can never reach Angel tier power levels. I kind of want to see what happens if a mortal does manage to surpass an Angel, to the point of winning a fight.



Would Zeno be obligated to erase them?

It's evidently just part of the Angel laws: they can't use their full power against a mortal, as that constitutes a proper "battle". However, "training"(using less than their full power) is acceptable... And Merus wasn't really teaching Goku an Angel technique, as UI is something that Goku had already achieved on his own -- Merus was just helping him develop/control the ability. Again, Daishinkan and Whis were okay with the training until Merus was going to go all-out.

I don't think there's a "cap" on how powerful mortals can become... But at the same time, I'm sure the Angels never expected a mortal to come anywhere near their tier of power.

Originally posted by cdtm
Pretty academic to call off the training session because of how much power Merus was using.


That's the entire point of training, to surpass your trainer. What would Whis do if Goku and Vegeta became his equal? How is tiering someone up somehow more impartial then testing the limits of that training in a full fight?

Is Whis so arrogant he can't imagine mortals getting that strong? If so, I hope they blow right past him someday, and force him into acknowledging his hubris by facing an epic beat down he can't walk away from.

And if someone with common sense is writing Dragon Ball, mortals can't reach angels in billions of years. Even when they will reach angels in extremely long time, they are mortals no more. Now if they become modernized more and more like Marvel where everyone is reaching here and there cosmic beings, then yes mortals can reach angels and DBS becomes a series that is no longer watchable/readable.

Broly arc SSB Goku could outmaneuver SSJ Broly and slap away a few of his blasts with difficulty, and post Merus training SSB Goku is WAY above that, much less Omen Goku. That's if even Broly could pull off SSJ at will without the proper trigger or training.

I have:

Current UI Omen Goku > LSSJ Broly > current SSB Goku > Ssj Broly that faced Ssj Gogeta > initial Ssj Broly > post ToP SSB Goku

As long as he does not fool around and goes quickly for the kill, I have current UI Omen Goku capable to put down the LSSJ Broly who was beaten up by SSB Gogeta.

IF Goku went in for the kill right away, he might be able to defeat Broly... But Goku usually fights his opponents for a good bit of time before ever deciding to go the lethal route. Don't know if I've ever seen him use lethal attacks right out of the gate. If he fought like that against Broly, it would be a huge mistake given Broly's exponential(and seemingly unending) power growth during battle.

Barring lethal/all-out attacks right out of the gate, I'm still not confident that current UI Goku could actually damage FPSS Broly. Not even SSB Gogeta's attacks really did anything at all to him -- Broly soaked everything that was dished out, and just kept getting more and more powerful. He was an absolute tank.

So far as we know, the only attack that would have actually beaten Broly was SSB Gogeta's "full force" Kamehameha. I suppose UI Goku *might* have output similar to(or even greater than) Gogeta's strongest attack(maybe)... But he'd have to use it immediately to have a shot at taking Broly down, imo.

Current UI Omen Goku loses horribly. He ain't putting down LSSJ Broly, not to mention LSSJ Broly raw power is still above current Omen Goku anyway and of course LSSJ Broly power would raise even further if Gogeta wouldn't put him down.

SSB Gogeta from movie massacres Current Omen UI Goku and so would LSSJ Broly.

Originally posted by Galan007
IF Goku went in for the kill right away, he might be able to defeat Broly... But Goku usually fights his opponents for a good bit of time before ever deciding to go the lethal route. Don't know if I've ever seen him use lethal attacks right out of the gate. If he fought like that against Broly, it would be a huge mistake given Broly's exponential(and seemingly unending) power growth during battle.

Barring lethal/all-out attacks right out of the gate, I'm still not confident that current UI Goku could actually damage FPSS Broly. Not even SSB Gogeta's attacks really did anything at all to him -- Broly soaked everything that was dished out, and just kept getting more and more powerful. He was an absolute tank.

So far as we know, the only attack that would have actually beaten Broly was SSB Gogeta's "full force" Kamehameha. I suppose UI Goku *might* have output similar to(or even greater than) Gogeta's strongest attack(maybe)... But he'd have to use it immediately to have a shot at taking Broly down, imo.

Originally posted by Inedian
Current UI Omen Goku loses horribly. He ain't putting down LSSJ Broly, not to mention LSSJ Broly raw power is still above current Omen Goku anyway and of course LSSJ Broly power would raise even further if Gogeta wouldn't put him down.

SSB Gogeta from movie massacres Current Omen UI Goku and so would LSSJ Broly.

Actually I was rethinking about it a little bit on my own, and your interventions helped confirming it: I have changed my mind about this chain.
To have current UI Omen Goku being capable to put down the end-of-the-movie LSSJ Broly who was constantly growing in power would mean that he would solidly be stronger than Beerus.
However, I effectively don't see current UI Omen Goku being more powerful than a 100% Beerus using UI Omen as well.
At the end of the day it took a serious SSB Gogeta to really stomp and corner Broly, and it is implied that base Gogeta >= post ToP SSB Goku.
So yeah, I change my power chain:

SSB Gogeta >> LSSJ Broly > FP Beerus > current UI Omen Goku ~ Ssj Gogeta > Ssj Broly (against Ssj Gogeta) ~ current SSB Goku > Ssj Broly (against movie Goku/Vegeta) > post ToP SSB Goku > the rest

I am waiting where Moro really stands, i don't think we have seen all from him.

Well yes, his implied power seems to be huge. We have to wait and see.