Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Fellow Americans, now that the corona stimulus bill has passed and funds will be going out to not only businesses, but individuals, how do you intend to spend your socialism cash (if you qualify)?

Nice of them to give me back some of my money.

I see a lot of coping in that post, but not an answer. Well?

$600 worth of handy J's from Backfire whilst sitting in a fume cupboard. (Observing safe coronavirus infection protocols)

Then I'd murder him and take his $600 too.

depends on how much money. If it's a thousand, I'll rent robtard's mom for one of her famous rub n tugs. the other $999.55 will sit in my account until the crisis is over.

Originally posted by Robtard
Fellow Americans, now that the corona stimulus bill has passed and funds will be going out to not only businesses, but individuals, how do you intend to spend your socialism cash (if you qualify)? I doubt I'm eligible. If I do get a check I will donate the money.

I'd buy Broly and Carver an "Idiots guide to logic and reasoning."

Originally posted by Robtard
I see a lot of coping in that post, but not an answer. Well?


Nah, it's obvious that you're the one who is coping.

Originally posted by Robtard
I see a lot of coping in that post, but not an answer. Well?

Are you ok?

Originally posted by Badabing
I doubt I'm eligible. If I do get a check I will donate the money.

It's not called donating when you give it to hookers.

I'll buy Robtard's wife something VERY special as she has always been so good to me!

He should ditch Pence and pickup Andrew Yang for his VP I tell yeah now!

I looked at the details and I'm not eligible.


If I was, I would need the money. I'd just pay bills.

Id buy CD a dummies guide to making jokes

Either going to get one $1000 prostitute or 1000 $1 prostitutes.

Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
I'll buy Robtard's wife something VERY special as she has always been so good to me!

Originally posted by Silent Master
Are you ok?

He's not okay, this triggered him something fierce. He got mad over Pelosi folding and then posted this thread lol.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Are you ok?
Originally posted by Surtur
He's not okay, this triggered him something fierce. He got mad over Pelosi folding and then posted this thread lol.

^ Still coping and dodging. Enjoy your socialism cash, you two.

Originally posted by dadudemon
I looked at the details and I'm not eligible.


If I was, I would need the money. I'd just pay bills. Can you hook me up with a link to where you saw the eligibility requirements? I've been looking on google for a whole 15 seconds and I can't find anything.

Originally posted by Tzeentch
Can you hook me up with a link to where you saw the eligibility requirements? I've been looking on google for a whole 15 seconds and I can't find anything.



https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2020/3/23/21190955/stimulus-checks-from-government-approved

https://i.imgur.com/8dhOb2c.png

Also found this, covers similar to above, but it adds the provision for people who make so little they don't file taxes:

The text of the bill has not yet been released, but under an earlier draft of the bill, many American tax filers would receive one-time payments of $1,200, or $2,400 for married couples who filed their 2018 taxes jointly. Families would also receive an additional $500 for each child. Meanwhile, under the earlier proposed legislation, individuals with very low income with little or no tax liability would receive $600 each. -snip

Do wonder if that covers people who already live on government assistance.

Thanks lads. Looks like I'd be getting around 1500 bucks'ish, according to that chart.

Edit- Ah, should have read the article first. 1200. Meh, I'm still working and getting 40 hours (city employee baby), so I'll probably just pay off some credit card debt or something.

Just looking at a single person, a one-time payment of $1,200.00 isn't going to go very far, if you're someone who will be out a job for even two months.

Wasn't part of the Democrat's veto logic that they wanted larger payouts?

It's definitely one of those situations where it's better then nothing, but I agree more needs to be done. Personally I'll be okay even without any payout at all, because I'm still working, but for the average person you're right that 1200 isn't going to go very far.

Originally posted by Robtard
Just looking at a single person, a one-time payment of $1,200.00 isn't going to go very far, if you're someone who will be out a job for even two months.

This is where a UBI is important. It's a moderate libertarian economic idea for a reason.


If we already had a UBI, this economic tragedy wouldn't really have happened.


The UBI should be $1500 a month with locality pay adjustments similar to the per diem adjustments federal workers get when they travel and work.


https://www.gsa.gov/travel/plan-book/per-diem-rates


For example, base is $1500. But you live in San Francisco:



Comes out to this:

https://www.gsa.gov/travel/plan-book/per-diem-rates/per-diem-rates-lookup/?action=perdiems_report&state=CA&fiscal_year=2020&zip=&city=San%20Francisco



The state with the lowest cost of living should be the baseline of $1500 a month. Then ever dollar amount in the per diem figure, by percentage, over the cheapest place, would be multiplied again $1500.

https://worldpopulationreview.com/states/cheapest-states-to-live-in/


For example, Mississippi has the lowest cost of living in the US.


Cost indiex of MS is 86.1. They become "1." Every index gets an automatic +13.9.




"But, dadudemon, this will encourage people to live in expensive cities." Nope, it will drive up costs. It should be done by state instead of cities.


That way, people don't flock to San Fran to get a higher UBI payout.

Originally posted by Tzeentch
Wasn't part of the Democrat's veto logic that they wanted larger payouts?

It's definitely one of those situations where it's better then nothing, but I agree more needs to be done. Personally I'll be okay even without any payout at all, because I'm still working, but for the average person you're right that 1200 isn't going to go very far. They're giving people crumbs, so they don't make a stink about the other 1.66trillion going to the already rich. 2008 all over again.

Giving money to poor people and middle class people is communism.

Originally posted by Robtard
They're giving people crumbs, so they don't make a stink about the other 1.66trillion going to the already rich. 2008 all over again.
Yeah. People have been giving the Dems shit for the past week for vetoing the first bill, but this puts things in perspective.

Originally posted by Tzeentch
Giving money to poor people and middle class people is communism.


Yeah. People have been giving the Dems shit for the past week for vetoing the first bill, but this puts things in perspective.





And giving money to the corporations is also socialism.

All of it is socialism. One is a populace socialism. The other is a corporatist socialism.

Both are the collective use of public funds to support people and groups in a nation.

Originally posted by dadudemon
And giving money to the corporations is also socialism. NO. Corporations earned government subsidies by being successful, ambitious, innovative risk-takers and job creators.

Originally posted by Badabing
I doubt I'm eligible. If I do get a check I will donate the money.

I need about three fity.

**** you Robtard!!!!

Bills and then savings

I have a plan to move to Ohio sometime this year or early next, but quite obviously I need groceries and to take care of my half of my bills here

Originally posted by Tzeentch
NO. Corporations earned government subsidies by being successful, ambitious, innovative risk-takers and job creators.

I'm not sure if this a troll moment but anyone that can remember back to 2008 and look at the financial fiasco knows that isn't an accurate statement.

Corporations can get grants just from having ideas and massive amounts of $$ for legal teams to focus on getting said funds and using lobbyists to influence govt spending and taxes.

I'm not denying success but I'm also not eating the shit sandwich that "corporations" (large entities not small mom and pop s/c-corps) somehow make it without govt influence.

Large corporations put their thumbs on the scale of capitalism to help control regulation, taxes, laws/rules that limits free market competition.

Anyhow...yeah Corporations!

Originally posted by carthage
Bills and then savings

I have a plan to move to Ohio sometime this year or early next, but quite obviously I need groceries and to take care of my half of my bills here

Why Ohio? Sounds like a mundane move.

Originally posted by Robtard
^ Still coping and dodging. Enjoy your socialism cash, you two.

Dodging what? You being butthurt across multiple threads? Lol.

So are these getting mailed or is there a process one has to go through for it?

Originally posted by Surtur
Dodging what? You being butthurt across multiple threads? Lol.

He's so mad that he once again forgot that I supported Bernie, so his socialism cash remark isn't going to trigger me. Like my post triggered him.

I wonder if Rob will be mad when the stock market goes back up

Originally posted by Zenwolf
So are these getting mailed or is there a process one has to go through for it?

No idea. Mailed and direct deposit are both options being discussed. Whatever your 2018 or 2019 tax filing info was determines your eligibility. I'd assume the same would apply if you got direct deposit done.

Originally posted by dadudemon
No idea. Mailed and direct deposit are both options being discussed. Whatever your 2018 or 2019 tax filing info was determines your eligibility. I'd assume the same would apply if you got direct deposit done.

So reading that article, I guess with that example of $85k AGI, I don't make that much at all so I figure I'm eligible.

Seems like it. Being married will greatly help.

So many damn marriage benefits.

Originally posted by BrolyBlack
I wonder if Rob will be mad when the stock market goes back up

IMO they don't really want people dead cuz of this virus, but they do want it to temporarily tank the economy in order to cost him the election. You can tell with the sense of giddiness in which negative news about the economy is reported on.

Originally posted by Robtard
Fellow Americans, now that the corona stimulus bill has passed and funds will be going out to not only businesses, but individuals, how do you intend to spend your socialism cash (if you qualify)?

Go to Disneyland

Originally posted by Mairuzu
Go to Disneyland


F*CKIN' MAIRUZU!!!!!!!!!!

Welcome back, dude.

131

i think they closed disneyland

ffuuu

Originally posted by Mairuzu
131

Welcome back

*yawn*

You should save that money and instead by yourself a functioning brain, loser.

what are you going to buy with your $1200, starfly? drugs?

Eon shouldn't you be saving it for a sex change

Originally posted by Bashar Teg
what are you going to buy with your $1200, starfly? drugs?


Is Eon Blue your new butt-buddy? What's a matter, is robbie's butt and micro-penis not sufficiently pleasing you anymore? Eon Blue's probably isn't any bigger so he probably won't satisfy your homo desires either.


Fyi, I probably won't be getting this extra money nor do I really need it.


Though it is always nice to have even more money lol.


Edit: Wanna make it clear that I am not claiming to be rich, by any means. In fact, I'm far from it. I just think these checks should only be given to those who truly need it.

Originally posted by Surtur
Eon shouldn't you be saving it for a sex change Sex doesn't give change during a pandemic, tap or money order only.

Originally posted by eThneoLgrRnae
*yawn*

You should save that money and instead by yourself a functioning brain, loser.

You just admitted you are Star.

Oh look, it's the resident clueless, actually real homo of KMC forums responding to one of my posts.

I'm sooooo very honored.

Originally posted by eThneoLgrRnae
Oh look, it's the actually real resident homo of KMC forums responding to one of my posts. I'm so honored.

I am the King of the Gays. Bow down before my majesty, peasant.

Richard Gere is Adam's court jester and he juggles gerbils and makes them "disappear".

Side note: Richard Gere has never been happier.

Originally posted by eThneoLgrRnae
Oh look, it's the resident clueless, actually real homo of KMC forums responding to one of my posts.

I'm sooooo very honored. Yeah you would be, f*ggot.

^not even worth reading that troll post let alone responding to it.

Originally posted by eThneoLgrRnae
^not even worth reading that troll post let alone responding to it. Good call, your butthole's sore enough. Adam saw to that.

Originally posted by Surtur
Richard Gere is Adam's court jester and he juggles gerbils and makes them "disappear".

Side note: Richard Gere has never been happier.

Orko is my court jester.

https://media3.giphy.com/media/nuxFWr2lasuTm/source.gif

Done wasting my time in these childish little back and forth insults with you and other leftist brainwashed idiots.

Originally posted by eThneoLgrRnae
Done wasting my time in these childish little back and forth insults with you and other leftist brainwashed idiots. It'd be awfully nice if you screamed that into my taint you little fairy.

I want a check, but I make too much money. Shelter in place sucks for me too, I want some compensation.

What can we really do with these checks? They'll have some double edge I'm sure. As for socialism I feel nothing is whole and organized. I'm sick of hearing about that. if we get sick and die so be it.

Originally posted by Emmy Evangeline
What can we really do with these checks?

Give someone a paper cut. Right on the specific part of their finger where if they bend the finger it opens up the cut.

Originally posted by Surtur
Give someone a paper cut. Right on the specific part of their finger where if they bend the finger it opens up the cut. Oohhh that's evil.

Originally posted by Emmy Evangeline
What can we really do with these checks?

Buy something I want, but do not need, and would not buy on a whim with my own money, like a $1,5000 Dyson 360 Eye robot vacuum.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Oohhh that's evil.

https://media.giphy.com/media/x7gjmBuaHrWak/giphy.gif

i think trump voters who lose their jobs over this crisis should forgo any stimulus money and added unemployment assistance, since they're still mad that democrats were the ones who fought the original version to put those in place, and y'all were like "NOOOOO JUST PASS IT!!!!1121"

https://www.myhighplains.com/video/austin-company-looking-to-dock-paychecks-for-those-receiving-stimulus-checks/4436156/

Sad

wow that is just vile

isn't that embezzlement, on a federal level?

Originally posted by Robtard
The money isn't coming from Trump.

The money is coming from us tax-payers, a one-time payment to appease the plebs; while doing little to actually help them, while the already rich take the lion's share again (similar to the 2008 bailouts).

It's socialism and now your Trump loving ass loves it.

Do you have a breakdown?

I'll find it.


I want to see how much money is going to the rich and how much is going to the people.


Found it:

https://www.visualcapitalist.com/the-anatomy-of-the-2-trillion-covid-19-stimulus-bill/


Individuals / Families $603.7 billion 30%
Big Business $500.0 billion 25%
Small Business $377.0 billion 19%
State and Local Government $340.0 billion 17%
Public Services $179.5 billion 9%



Looks like the rich get 25%. That's not a lion's share.

A "small business" doesn't necessarily mean a small antique ship run by Mr. and Mr. Gary and Brandon earning $150k a year.

Their standard definition of a small business includes operations with up to $7 million in revenue or 500 employees, depending on the industry. And there are countless exceptions, with revenue thresholds set as high as $35.5 million, and employee counts as high as 1,500! -Forbes

Originally posted by Robtard
A "small business" doesn't necessarily mean a small antique ship run by Mr. and Mr. Gary and Brandon earning $150k a year.

Their standard definition of a small business includes operations with up to $7 million in revenue or 500 employees, depending on the industry. And there are countless exceptions, with revenue thresholds set as high as $35.5 million, and employee counts as high as 1,500! -Forbes

Are you taking the stance that small business owners are rich people on average and that the stimulus to help small business owners from going out of business is actually a stimulus check for more rich people?

Because the average small business owner makes $73,000 but SBA has even lower numbers:




https://www.patriotsoftware.com/blog/accounting/how-much-do-small-business-owners-make-average-income/

No. That the majority of the money allotted for SBs will go to the minority of SBs that earn in the millions and are a "small business" in name only.

eg That fictional antique store isn't going to get the same amount of money as a SB that earns 25mil a year.

Originally posted by Robtard
No. That the majority of the money allotted for SBs will go to the minority of SBs that earn in the millions and are a "small business" in name only.

eg That fictional antique store isn't going to get the same amount of money as a SB that earns 25mil a year.

This is what it covers:



Other than the $10 billion in grants, the money is for payroll. Paying the employees.


Not the rich like you said.

Even if your small business makes less than $100 million a year and has 500 employees, you may not have the cash to pay your employees to keep them around during the lockdowns. You think the money is going to the rich in this scenario but that is false. And you're going about it as dishonestly as possible and I don't know why.

Is it because Pelosi couldn't sneak in her unrelated legislation and this bill was touted as a major Republican win?



Lion share of the money is going to the every day American. Even the large corporations will have to use some of that money to pay the little guy. It's not largely going into the pockets of "the rich" like you say.

This not the 2008-2012 bailouts where execs gave themselves big bonuses from the stimulus payouts. Not yet, at least. And a majority of this is going to the average American.

"To ease the strain on businesses around the country, the Small Business Administration (SBA) will be given $350 billion to provide loans of up to $10 million to qualifying organizations. These funds can be used for mission critical activities, such as paying rent or keeping employees on the payroll during COVID-19 closures.

As well, the bill sets aside $10 billion in grants for small businesses that need help covering short-term operating costs." -snip



^That proves my point...

Originally posted by Robtard
"To ease the strain on businesses around the country, the Small Business Administration (SBA) will be given $350 billion to provide loans of up to $10 million to qualifying organizations. These funds can be used for mission critical activities, such as paying rent or keeping employees on the payroll during COVID-19 closures.

As well, the bill sets aside $10 billion in grants for small businesses that need help covering short-term operating costs." -snip



^That proves my point...


It does not. Not at all. It proves you wrong.

Not sure if these are the tactics you use with Surtur but it's retarded and pathetic.




Edit - Because you were wrong and know you're wrong, and will use any tactic to wriggle out of being wrong, let's cut this tactic off before you try it:

https://www.collinsdictionary.com/us/dictionary/english/lions-share

"If a person, group, or project gets the lion's share of something, they get the largest part of it, leaving very little for other people."

You're definitely wrong. And it looks like a comfortable majority will go to average everyday Americans even with some of the money going to the corporations, which represents a minority.

It's says "to provide loans of up to $10 million to qualifying organizations.", an actual small business like the antique shop isn't going to be given 10mil, not even 1mil. They'll get maybe a few months of payroll and operating costs, maybe 4-7k. While the not-really-small-business-business who is a multi-million company will get millions like a big business.

I'm not playing games, maybe you are?

To your edit: Okay, you are playing games, silly semantics now.

Originally posted by Robtard
It's says "to provide loans of up to $10 million to qualifying organizations.", an actual small business like the antique shop isn't going to be given 10mil, not even 1mil. They'll get maybe a few months of payroll and operating costs, maybe 4-7k. While the not-really-small-business-business who is a multi-million company will get millions like a big business.

I'm not playing games, maybe you are?

To your edit: Okay, you are playing games, silly semantics now.

Wonder why you left this off your quote?




Would you care to retry your reply to me but with a more honest approach to the topic?

It was giving examples of what they "can" be used for, not what they must be used for.

ps I don't appreciate your attempt at painting me as dishonest, considering the full quote is right above my post.

Originally posted by Robtard
It was giving examples of what they "can" be used for, not what they must be used for.

ps I don't appreciate your attempt at painting me as dishonest, considering the full quote is right above my post.

Okay, since you were real with me, I'll be real with you. Read the whole post and don't just had-wave it as 'dadudemon useless fluff.'

You telling me you don't appreciate me tell you that you're being dishonest means you respect my opinion enough that it matters. I can work with that.

Your original post, which I responded to, made it seem like the Phase 3 COVID-19 recovery bill had been changed significantly and that a large majority of the money was going to rich people (which would obviously rustle my jimmies as I am opposed to this type of behavior from the government). I had been following this bill closely for over a week. I thought I knew the content and it was already passed.

Because I trusted your input on these topics, assuming you weren't misleading and were just jimmy-rustled about it as I would be, I was like, "Well, shit, this sucks."

So I looked it up to get the exact figures to see how f*cked up the situation was.

Then I saw you were either a dirty-filthy liar or just misinformed.

So I posted the content and didn't skip any details. Politely. So you could still save face. Because I know you have an anti-Robtard following and I don't want to give them too much fuel: those discussions and immature conversations have long worn out their amusement.

But you didn't want to save face. You doubled down and tried being very dishonest with a tactic that is easily veritable: most small business owners make less than you and I. They are, individually, eligible for the tax refund and the small business help.

And for small businesses on the larger side, they can even get grants to pay their landlords to keep from having to close.

But for everyone else, if they are eligible, they can get loans to keep their payroll going for their employees: a stop-gap before having to declare chapter 11 and sell off assets, lay employees off, furlough, etc.

Then you descended into classic word games and goalpost stuff - standard. It's the same treatment you give Surtur. Which I always find retarded.


If the rich try to line their pockets with this money, as very large small business owners, they'd still have to prove they were eligible for the loans that will have to pay back, anyway. So they are not lining their pockets, at best, and this will harm them long term if they cannot recover, at worst. It's just a stop-gap.


Almost all of these funds will go to the "little guy" not some rich corportist.

Okay

...so what you're saying is that the money will...trickle down?

Originally posted by Bashar Teg
...so what you're saying is that the money will...trickle down?

No, I didn't say or imply that.

You're either eligible for a payroll loan or you're not. Guess who the payroll loan is for?

Originally posted by Bashar Teg
...so what you're saying is that the money will...trickle down?


Trumpers are fans of trickle down economics because 'trickling' reminds them of being peed on.

I will give it to my parents. They are retired, but could use it. I don't need it.

Stimulus checks are socialism, which means communism because Fox news and McCarthy told me so.

Hard pass.

Originally posted by Stealth Moose
Stimulus checks are socialism, which means communism because Fox news and McCarthy told me so.

Hard pass.

if you get one please mail it back to Uncle Sam

Originally posted by BrolyBlack
if you get one please mail it back to Uncle Sam

I would, but the Post Office is a unionized madhouse of socialism. So I'll have to walk it there on my own two feet, wearing the shoes I crafted from the blood of my socialist enemies, singing the pledge of allegiance instead of reciting it, and being woefully ignorant of anything more than 50 miles away from my hometown.

Originally posted by BrolyBlack
if you get one please mail it back to Uncle Sam


Ya, I'm sure he'll do that.

Originally posted by Stealth Moose
Stimulus checks are socialism, which means communism because Fox news and McCarthy told me so.

Hard pass.

:rolls eyes:

Originally posted by Stealth Moose
I would, but the Post Office is a unionized madhouse of socialism. So I'll have to walk it there on my own two feet, wearing the shoes I crafted from the blood of my socialist enemies, singing the pledge of allegiance instead of reciting it, and being woefully ignorant of anything more than 50 miles away from my hometown.

If you were this resilient in real life, you could be a super solider. On ward and upward my friend!

Idk, life hasn't changed much for me personally. I do live in almost constant fear that my 67-year-old grandmother could get it but besides staying inside everything is the same.

I'm gonna use it for food (groceries and take out) and either a tv series or some games.

When I posted about it before for those of you that care, she ended up not having it.

Glad to hear your grandmother is doing well, J

Originally posted by Jmanghan
Idk, life hasn't changed much for me personally. I do live in almost constant fear that my 67-year-old grandmother could get it but besides staying inside everything is the same.

I'm gonna use it for food (groceries and take out) and either a tv series or some games.

When I posted about it before for those of you that care, she ended up not having it.

Good, glad to read she didn't get the virus.

Thanks ya'll. Appreciate it.

So some people are posting about receiving their checks. Speak up.

What you'd do with it?

Did you really needed it?

If so, how far did it take you, are you okay going forward?

Originally posted by Robtard
So some people are posting about receiving their checks. Speak up.

What you'd do with it?

Did you really needed it?

If so, how far did it take you, are you okay going forward?

My honey got hers. She put it in the joint checking account.

It is just sitting there. Doing nothing. Because we can't do anything with it.

We were supposed to go on vacation at the end of March, to Houston (again), but we had to cancel all the plans.

What is in Houston?

Buildings. A few trees.

And Tacos... LOTSA TACOS!!!!!!!

Adam has no interest in those.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
What is in Houston?

The 4th largest city in the US has tons of things to do, shop in, and eat. It's such a huge city that it feels like we can never come close to doing all the things we want to while there.

We need to visit it another 100 times or so. I'm thinking about relocating to Houston - it's my favorite US City, so far.

https://media.giphy.com/media/DJhTPoqXLyEdW/giphy.gif

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
What is in Houston?

Second most in gay bars after Dallas...

Robbie knows.... Cause He is a Raging Homophobic.

Originally posted by dadudemon
The 4th largest city in the US has tons of things to do, shop in, and eat. It's such a huge city that it feels like we can never come close to doing all the things we want to while there.

We need to visit it another 100 times or so. I'm thinking about relocating to Houston - it's my favorite US City, so far.

I hear Austin is better.

Originally posted by Robtard
Second most in gay bars after Dallas...

I have been to Dallas. I was not impressed. It was weird seeing Texan stereotypes come to life. Men dressed as cowboys, and women with big hair and lots of make-up in 88 degree weather.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
I have been to Dallas. I was not impressed. It was weird seeing Texan stereotypes come to life. Men dressed as cowboys, and women with big hair and lots of make-up in 88 degree weather.


An Indian friend claims there's a lot of Indians somewhere in Texas. I forget where exactly.


But if this friend is any indication, I can totally see them dressing and acting like cowboy stereotypes.

Originally posted by cdtm
An Indian friend claims there's a lot of Indians somewhere in Texas. I forget where exactly.


But if this friend is any indication, I can totally see them dressing and acting like cowboy stereotypes.

It's either Sugarland of Stafford TX. Both of them have more Indians (by number) than any other cities in Texas, by far.

Didn't create this, but every KMC Trumper needs a similar sig:

https://i.imgur.com/vbjHpRC.png

Spot on. Bravo!

So I guess: giving people their money=socialism

Okie dokie

The "economic stimulus" checks are indeed a form of socialism; no amount of coping will change that.

Did you get your $600.00 yet? What did you spend it on if so?

No, giving people back their own money isn't socialism.

Not up for debate

Originally posted by Surtur
No, giving people back their own money isn't socialism.

Not up for debate

Surtur, you should know better.

I'll tell you why you should know better:

https://i.imgur.com/JtQulJ0.gif

The bottom 3 quintiles of household income already get a net benefit from the federal government. Only the top two quintiles of household income have a net surplus contribution to the government through their tax dollars.

Obviously, this is on average. There are likely exceptions in each quintile including the lowest one. It's definitely harder to be one of those surplus exceptions in the lowest quintile but I am not bold enough to claim all bottom quintile households are net-negatives.

Meaning, they are NOT getting their tax dollars back. They are getting bonuses on taxes they are already negative on.

This is simply incomone redistribution to the bottom three quintiles of income by household.


https://www.heritage.org/taxes/report/how-the-wealth-spread-the-distribution-government-benefits-services-and-taxes-income



Funnily enough, Robtard is likely a tax-net-surplus household and has every right to prance, strut, and posture about this being income redistribution. He should be posting, "Socialism! How dare you! I earned this money!"




Edit - Also, Surtur, you need some of this:

https://i.imgur.com/yXZZsea.jpg

uhuh

You should know by now not to waste graphs and shit on responses where I'm just trolling Rob lol.

He was clearly triggered and had to bump this thread, it had to be done.

The good ole "I was just joking!!1!" after daddy reams his ass. I lol'd.

Originally posted by Robtard
The good ole "I was just joking!!1!" after daddy reams his ass. I lol'd.

Hypocrisy noted.

Originally posted by Surtur
You should know by now not to waste graphs and shit on responses where I'm just trolling Rob lol.

He was clearly triggered and had to bump this thread, it had to be done.

Clearly, you were joking. Clearly, you'd take the position against income redistribution (I oppose opposition to income redistribution because I support a UBI*).

So my point would only serve to support you positions on this topic in any other context. Hence, the smartass tone in my reply and meme that I stole from you.


*I'd like to dive into this, further. I've been the poorest of poor as a kid. I know what it is like. And it seems any minor bump in the rode destroys your budget. You live frugally when you make $27K a year? Great, better not get sick, have house problems, or car problems. Because your entire budget is blown. It's just not the same being a low-income person, trying to climb the socio-economic ladder.

For that reason, I think we should oppose anyone or any entity that tries to make life harder for the poor but easier for the rich. I can afford bumps in the road. But my young parents could not. A UBI would create a safety net that would empower people to make better life choices. We'd have far less single mothers and the amount of repair NOT having single mothers could do for America would be tremendous.

Many of our problems can be traced backed to having kids raised in single parent homes.

Originally posted by Robtard
Fellow Americans, now that the corona stimulus bill has passed and funds will be going out to not only businesses, but individuals, how do you intend to spend your socialism cash (if you qualify)?

Welll....isn't this basically giving you back your own money? Is that really socialism?

Originally posted by dadudemon


For that reason, I think we should oppose anyone or any entity that tries to make life harder for the poor but easier for the rich. I can afford bumps in the road. But my young parents could not. A UBI would create a safety net that would empower people to make better life choices. We'd have far less single mothers and the amount of repair NOT having single mothers could do for America would be tremendous.

Many of our problems can be traced backed to having kids raised in single parent homes.

How would a UBI reduce men from leaving their children? I could see where it would help single mothers support their children, but making Father's stay? I think there's more to that than money.

Originally posted by Robtard
Fellow Americans, now that the corona stimulus bill has passed and funds will be going out to not only businesses, but individuals, how do you intend to spend your socialism cash (if you qualify)?

I bought some new shoes. Now I can stand in the bread line comfortably.

Originally posted by socool8520
How would a UBI reduce men from leaving their children? I could see where it would help single mothers support their children, but making Father's stay? I think there's more to that than money.

It's in the research results from the limited research we have on UBI's.


For some reason, it greatly reduces single motherhood (a major win), sends young men and young women to college significantly more (another major win), and - for some weird counterintuitive reason - it makes people work more often.


Here's a question I want researchers to resolve for me regarding true UBI's:

What about a true UBI causes people to work more often?


This group, here, is doing research on UBI in a meaningful way:

https://www.givedirectly.org/basic-income/

They discuss the pros and cons and publish their research.


1 problem: their study group is Kenya which is a far more poorer country than a place like Canada, the UK, Japan, or the US. These results may only be applicable to countries like Kenya where a UBI might be the difference between a college education and death (weird polar opposites).

Originally posted by socool8520
Welll....isn't this basically giving you back your own money? Is that really socialism?

It's the government taking the money of the working masses and redistributing it as they see fit. It's part socialism and part communism, all rolled into one. Corruption too, whole lot of corruption in their.

Originally posted by socool8520
Welll....isn't this basically giving you back your own money? Is that really socialism?

I just saw this question. Robtard answered some of it.


Look at my post. It's redistribution of wealth from the top 2 quintiles of income earners. That's the basics of basics of socialism.


Contrast that with communism where it seeks to redistribute to a point of equity (all denizens get an equal redistribution of economic output).

Originally posted by dadudemon
It's in the research results from the limited research we have on UBI's.


For some reason, it greatly reduces single motherhood (a major win), sends young men and young women to college significantly more (another major win), and - for some weird counterintuitive reason - it makes people work more often.


Here's a question I want researchers to resolve for me regarding true UBI's:

What about a true UBI causes people to work more often?


This group, here, is doing research on UBI in a meaningful way:

https://www.givedirectly.org/basic-income/

They discuss the pros and cons and publish their research.


1 problem: their study group is Kenya which is a far more poorer country than a place like Canada, the UK, Japan, or the US. These results may only be applicable to countries like Kenya where a UBI might be the difference between a college education and death (weird polar opposites).

I remember you bringing this up before. The thing is that these are pretty small sample group and a different cultures. They also don't tend to last for a long time. I think the longest one cited was at about 12 years.

The Kenya UBI relies on other countries. The idea of paying for it seems to gut a lot of other things. I get that cuts should be made, but how much are we willing to cut from everywhere? The consolidation of current welfare wouldn't come close to paying for it. You could gut the military funding, but how weak should the military be? Then what about universal healthcare? Is that included in this UBI?

I think this is why many of the proposals were voted down. We would have to tax the hell out of the rich, and cut a lot of the funding for other programs (not that isn' needed).

Donated it to nyc food bank.

Originally posted by Mindship
Donated it to nyc food bank.

*big applause*

Originally posted by socool8520
I remember you bringing this up before. The thing is that these are pretty small sample group and a different cultures. They also don't tend to last for a long time. I think the longest one cited was at about 12 years.

Correct, the one I listed (which collected a lot of commentary and research and constitutes what I believe is the best collection of information on UBI I can find) is a 12 years study in Kenya and it is still ongoing.

A true study would need to last about 25 years. That's a longass time. It needs to last through young adults having children and those children reaching the age of 24-25. Why? Need to see education and Socio-Ecnomic Status (SES) outcomes which should also include Socio-Economic Mobility.

Originally posted by socool8520
The Kenya UBI relies on other countries. The idea of paying for it seems to gut a lot of other things. I get that cuts should be made, but how much are we willing to cut from everywhere? The consolidation of current welfare wouldn't come close to paying for it. You could gut the military funding, but how weak should the military be? Then what about universal healthcare? Is that included in this UBI?

$100 million seems like they are getting funded from any place except for Kenya and Kenyans. Private funding. Making the viability of such research, when applied to the US which would cost us $2 trillion + annually, quite low (in my opinion).

Originally posted by socool8520
I think this is why many of the proposals were voted down. We would have to tax the hell out of the rich, and cut a lot of the funding for other programs (not that isn' needed).

That's where proposal's like Yang's come in. He'd cut many social programs to support the UBI. But the US isn't social-programmed enough to bridge the gap between funding and budget deficits. Making it even harder on the US to pull something like this off.

Part of the US problem is how debt laden we are. I think we need to introduce much better consumer credit protections than Obama introduced to help us with the housing market crash. Debt obligations should not last longer than 10 years and interest should not constitute greater than 15% of income. Meaning, people should not be able to get loans and credit lines that would cause their credit payments to have more than 15% of their income, total.

This means houses that cost $900,000 should not be purchasable by anyone who cannot afford to pay $8,865 a month in a housing payment. Why? (($900,000/10 years)*(1.15 in max interest))/12 months in each year to get a monthly payment maximum. Add in insurance and property taxes and you're looking at a $9,000-$9,500 a month house payment.


But America is great! America is awesome! We debt laden the people into oblivion.

In our great country that runs on debt, you can buy that same house with a monthly payment of $4,678.42! But how?

By paying $548,731.64 in interest based on a 30 year FHA loan.

Amazing! You can almost by 2 houses of equal value for the cost of the 900,000 home.


In my proposed credit system, the banks can only charge $135,000 in max interest. That's max. They will likely have to adjust those numbers down because most people will have other debts and are capped at 15% interest of their income from all debt sources.

Even under the current system, it shows that with the amortization schedule, you could only charge 2.83% in interest for the 10 year loan (because the total cost of the loan shouldn't exceed 15% in interest based on the cap I've set on loans and total income to interest).

https://i.imgur.com/7ETo8FH.png



Imagine how much buying power the American people would have if this policy would be implemented. Money would no longer go to wasted sectors of the economy which rely purely on making money off of imaginary money. More money would go into tangible goods and services instead of fees and interests of fake money. The rich as well as the poor would benefit fairly from these practices but the poor would more especially benefit from it as a function of their raw dollar amounts available in their monthly budgets ($100 extra each month means much more to someone making $28k a year than someone making $280K a year).