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Who will win in the following :

*Canon 1. Light saber duel
2. Both use force powers and abilities

*Legends 1. Light saber duel
2. Both use force powers and abilities

Going with Maul on canon don't know about Legends.

Originally posted by juggernaut74
Going with Maul on canon don't know about Legends.

Legends is far worse for Kylo.

Maul gets stomped in force
No idea about sabers given his general incompetence

Maul loses in a force contest but wrecks him in a duel.

Kylo wins in a tough fight

Close fight sabers only, but Kylo stomps all out

Kylo wasn't capable of overhelming a Praetorian Guards with his Force powers. Being unarmed, he was trashed by clowns of ren. He needed a lightsaber to stomp them.

It's impossible to describe how badly Maul stomps this trash.

Yeah Maul loses this one

@ xPRIMEx i thought Maul did well against Pre Viszla he tanked a few grenades but Viszla sort of had tech in this favour which seemed to deceive Maul .. Maul defeated him without using force powers etc not bad i guess ..

@xPRIMEx

I'm not lowballing him. His "feats" does.

Originally posted by McP
@xPRIMEx

I'm not lowballing him. His "feats" does.
Stomping the knights of Ren>struggling against pirates and a dog

Originally posted by xPRIMEx
Stomping the knights of Ren>struggling against pirates and a dog

Cool sorry excuse my ignorance how powerful are the knights of Ren considered or tier wise etc ?

Maul mauls him

Kylo's force powers are greater, but I still don't know where to put him in sabers.

Originally posted by xPRIMEx
Stomping the knights of Ren>struggling against pirates and a dog

That dog would eat all of clowns of ren alive. They were inferior even to those loosers, patethician guards (or were they called pretorians with no guards? smth like that). Nothing comperable to IG MGds tbh.

Kylo is ~30 y/o by the time of the ST, he began his training at 14 y/o I believe. With 16 years of training and the potential of his bloodline, he scales far beyond Maul. Luke was Vader level after what, 4 years of training?
There is no reason to believe otherwise. The only arguments I see are because Rey beat him in TFA and because he was challenged by the praetorian guards. However it’s explained that Rey grew rapidly due to her dyad with Kylo, gaining some of his skills and power. Also the ROS novel states that if Kylo wasn’t injured, she never even would have stood a chance anyway. As for the praetorian guards, we have no idea how they would stack up against Maul or any other PT/OT characters, so you can’t use that as a means of scaling.

Originally posted by Eli Vanto
Kylo's force powers are greater, but I still don't know where to put him in sabers. Agree.

Kylo has quite a few feats/accolades that certainly indicate his Force power is superior, but his saber skill is what I'm unsure of. He's not some talentless feeb, but he also doesn't have many lightsaber showings to pull from.

Originally posted by Galan007
Agree.

Kylo has quite a few feats/accolades that certainly indicate his Force power is superior, but his saber skill is what I'm unsure of. He's not some talentless feeb, but he also doesn't have many lightsaber showings to pull from.
Basically what I said above. With 16 years of training, probably 10 or so years under Luke, and with the potential of his bloodline, his lightsaber skills should be top tier. Keep in mind Anakin trained for 10 or so years by the time of RoTS, and Luke only had 4 years of training by the time of RoTJ. Both were top tier lightsaber combatants.

I agree with the logic. It is heavily implied that Kylo had a similar potential to the likes of Anakin and Luke, so it makes sense that he could have very well become a high-level swordsman after nearly 20 years of instruction from Luke himself(whose skills were already on par with Vader's as of RotJ.)

I'm just saying that there isn't much actual info to pull from, as Kylo doesn't have many feats/accolades in that respect.

Originally posted by McP
Kylo wasn't capable of overhelming a Praetorian Guards with his Force powers. Being unarmed, he was trashed by clowns of ren. He needed a lightsaber to stomp them.

It's impossible to describe how badly Maul stomps this trash.

^
Obviously not.

Kylo is ~30 y/o by the time of the ST, he began his training at 14 y/o I believe. With 16 years of training and the potential of his bloodline, he scales far beyond Maul. Luke was Vader level after what, 4 years of training?
There is no reason to believe otherwise.

Nothing more then your asumption. In that way of thinking, in terms of a new canon, Anakin/Vader should never be even reachable for Luke. Perhaps Luke was capable of learning super-quickly. And perhaps Kylo was even slower-learner then Anakin. I guess so. Perhaps if he would be a member of Yoda's race, and would have a few ages of training, he wouldn't be that inferior.

But I have to be fair, when he was in a one vs one against any non-Force user, he was very effective.

But your logic is inherently flawed as already proven with the Anakin comparison. Anakin, with ten years of formal training, was inferior to Luke with four years of training. Not to mention Rey, with a single year of training, was Kylo's equal.

Also, Maul apparently had great potential as well. Probably not as high as Kylo, but it's unlikely to be greatly inferior considering he had the potential to surpass Sidious.

^
No, it isn't. I just proved it. By your scalling, Luke who was just barely trained, shold never be able to beat Vader, who had decades of trainign and experience and - in shitsney canon - is condisered to be superior to his ROTS Anakin version. Anakin had 10 years of training as Kenobi's padawan + 3 years of training on the battlefield during a war. And then he had more then 10 years (if we use his version between ROTS and ANH) or about 20 years (ANH version) to hone his skills. How is Luke even comperable to him? And yet, Luke is considered to be his equal as of ROTJ ergo superior to likes of ROTS Obi-Wan, Anakin, Mace, Dooku.

EDIT:
Doesn't matter, Ares834 explained it shorter and better.

Another asumption. Really, not a valid point as along as you somehow will prove it with any kind of quote or canon's statement.

Very underrated character.

And the only good thing that came from the sequels

Originally posted by xPRIMEx
As to your point about Rey, she gained a lot of Kylo's power and skill thru their dyad. Stupid as it is, that was stated in the TLJ novelization.

Maul was able to easily take on two Jedi in their prime, he put up a decent fight against Darth Sidious, fought Pre Vizla who's a trained warrior without the use of the Force and beat him, he also defeated Greivous in combat

Kylo has that great feat of stopping the blaster bolt and holding it in place for several minutes and ragdolling non Force users and inexperienced ones as well but most of his Force abilities aren't combat related as good as they are like the mind reading or the transporting objects or the healing and Force gateway with Rey, all great uses of the Force but none really applicable in a heated battle, as far as his lightsaber showings hes got very little; he struggled against Snokes guards but was able to easily beat the Knights of Ren which is a good showing but they don't have sabers so id imagine they would be at a severe disadvantage to somebody with a lightsaber

All in all if you compare battle feats Maul wins this one for sure

He was also amped by the Dyad BS when he fought the clowns of Ren. So much for his only decent combat showing...

^^ i forget what issue it was Maul killed 3 high ranked robots/droids at once with one strike with high speed.. im not sure what they were called but i heard they had a very high rank and were deadly against jedi or light saber wielders etc .. It was in some canon comic series...

^^ yeah hopefully the new cartoon series may show him with some good feats ..
But he does have some decent feats just generally I guess ..

Is Galaxy of Adventures canon? Kylo recently did this

https://youtu.be/oX_WcRTj180

^edit: *upper

Kylo gets stomped like always.

Maul slaughters. Kylo is worse than featless in sabers.

Originally posted by Psychotron
Maul slaughters. Kylo is worse than featless in sabers. Kylo Ren destroys him tbh. He dominated Rey who defeated a dyad amped Palpatine. Love Maul but the new Star Wars characters are insanely powerful.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Kylo Ren destroys him tbh. He dominated Rey who defeated a dyad amped Palpatine. Love Maul but the new Star Wars characters are insanely powerful.

Rey was amped when she faced One Sith Sidious. Regular Rey was almost killed by Sidious' drain.

Kylo is the biggest pussy ever put on screen, he gets destroyed by Maul just because of that, no argument can help him.

Originally posted by Psychotron
Rey was amped when she faced One Sith Sidious. Regular Rey was almost killed by Sidious' drain. No, she was not. Ben probably beats him too had he recovered or had a saber. Kylo would beat him into the dirt like he had Rey. Kylo is the best duelist of all time.

Originally posted by Inedian
Kylo is the biggest pussy ever put on screen, he gets destroyed by Maul just because of that, no argument can help him. Kylo handily crushed Rey on screen the gal who defeated a dyad amped Palpatine. Sorry but these two are the peak of power in Star Wars save amped Palpatine who was all power no dueling skills or even a light saber anymore.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Kylo handily crushed Rey on screen the gal who defeated a dyad amped Palpatine. Sorry but these two are the peak of power in Star Wars save amped Palpatine who was all power no dueling skills or even a light saber anymore.

It's good to know that Ray completely on her own defeated Sidious ... Kylo defeated Rey who defeated Sidious

Originally posted by Inedian
It's good to know that Ray completely on her own defeated Sidious ... Kylo defeated Rey who defeated Sidious She did so under how own abilities after inspired by the Jedi. Glad you agree. Ben was not armed or had recovered before Palpatine threw him. Ben beats him too if he is armed.

Originally posted by quanchi112
She did so under how own abilities after inspired by the Jedi. Glad you agree. Ben was not armed or had recovered before Palpatine threw him. Ben beats him too if he is armed.

No doubt about it.

You are the best poster ever on KMC.

Originally posted by Inedian
No doubt about it.

You are the best poster ever on KMC. You are finally starting to come to your senses.

Originally posted by quanchi112
No, she was not. Ben probably beats him too had he recovered or had a saber. Kylo would beat him into the dirt like he had Rey. Kylo is the best duelist of all time.

Nobody cares about your headcanon, fanboy.

What did you all think about Mauls recent feats from ep 11&12 ?

The battle of the losers The question isn't so much as who would win a fight, but who sucks harder. Gonna go with Darth Maul since Ren at least gets some dignity in Rise of Skywalker even if it isn't much.

@xPrimex cool.. but when he was unarmed in ep 12 Ashoka was trying to kill him with the light saber trying to behead him he dodges it and seemed to use quite a powerful force push on her ...

He still lost to her

Originally posted by xPRIMEx
He still lost to her

True he lost . David Filoni finally confirms that maul is the more superior and better Combatant compared to Ahsoka , but just lost due to his overconfidence and arrogance


https://youtu.be/Z_LbLVIrUVU

Maul is always overconfident. So basically he's a good swordsmen but a complete retard so he may as well be worse than Ahsoka.

Originally posted by ozz81
True he lost . David Filoni finally confirms that maul is the more superior and better Combatant compared to Ahsoka , but just lost due to his overconfidence and arrogance


https://youtu.be/Z_LbLVIrUVU

Is there actual screenshots of these tweets? Not saying it isn't true, but I'd love to see the actual source.

kylo is waaaay more powerful. That's probably enough to win.

Originally posted by ozz81
True he lost . David Filoni finally confirms that maul is the more superior and better Combatant compared to Ahsoka , but just lost due to his overconfidence and arrogance


https://youtu.be/Z_LbLVIrUVU Filoni also confirms ahsoka was around maul's level as a combatant.
Even if we disregard that his overconfidence is now an in-character trait, he's not significantly above tcw ahsoka.

Originally posted by Dark-Kenshin
The battle of the losers The question isn't so much as who would win a fight, but who sucks harder. Gonna go with Darth Maul since Ren at least gets some dignity in Rise of Skywalker even if it isn't much. TBF, Rey is super uber powerful. Stalemating her ain't bad when you consider the disney buff

Yeah, and the VD also seems to indicate a parity between Kylo and Luke/Vader, in terms of saber skill.

Kylo stomps

I thought the novel put that to circumstances and confirmed that kylo and rey are on the same level overall?

Originally posted by xPRIMEx
He still lost to her


This is just trolling.

He had her beat in Sabers and dominated her on 2 other occasions with the Force.

Hes not gonna underestimate Kylo Ren, so his losses to Padawan Kenobi, Ahsoka and Kanan are not relevant in the least here.

What level light saber is Kylo/Ben ranked canonically ? Ie 9 , 8 etc ?

Who knows. But I cant see him being above Maul/Dooku level.

The only noteworthy person hes beaten in Sabers was basically a Padawan. And Any real skill and power she had was from the Dyad with him. So he basically beat a less powerful and less skilled version of himself.

Until I see something more impressive from him, Maul wins a Saber fight. Heck not even sure if Kylo has better Force feats anymore.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Who knows. But I cant see him being above Maul/Dooku level.

The only noteworthy person hes beaten in Sabers was basically a Padawan. And Any real skill and power she had was from the Dyad with him. So he basically beat a less powerful and less skilled version of himself.

Until I see something more impressive from him, Maul wins a Saber fight. Heck not even sure if Kylo has better Force feats anymore.

Does Kylo have any feats above Mauls hyperdrive feat from Clone Wars?

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/0/0b/Elphrona_outpost_destruction.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20200213072502

Not bad. That might be more impressive than Mauls.

Looking closer I would put that above Mauls.

Cool im thinking the Hyperdrive that maul bought down did that have some sort of sort of energy or electro magnetic energy holding it in place etc? Because the HD maul bought down that was some sort of solid metal etc and will be stronger material wise than the statues kylo bought down etc?

https://youtu.be/FFkFwjvK3ms

actually doesnt Maul bring down 3 HD, or it was just a side effect from the 2 he had bought down initially ?

Pretty sure Maul destroys the structures they're attatched to and then makes them fall faster. They seem to be already falling before he sends them further down.

Originally posted by Scizard
Pretty sure Maul destroys the structures they're attatched to and then makes them fall faster. They seem to be already falling before he sends them further down.
Yep, ren's feat is miles more impressive and he's not at his peak.

Dammit you guys are right. It does seem that way.

Maul was pulling on the hyperdrives and the pipes got dislodged due to the movement. You can literally see the hyperdrives shaking. If Maul was just pulling the pipes there would be no reason for the Hyperdrives to shake like that before they fall. There are also mini explosions. No reason for those if Maul didn't affect the hyperdrive directly.
Also, the small pipes that popped out aren't what connects those things to the ship.In the video lnked by ozz81 you can clearly see the hypedrives are massive pillars that connect down, likely to the floor bellow, so Maul would have to destroy that portion of it for them to fall.The feat is very impressive.

Maul is significantly more skilled in the art of a duel, but Kylo is significantly stronger in the Force, from what I'm betting. This is ultimately a lightsaber skill vs Force strength contest, Maul probably takes it more times than not.

Kyo was significantly more powerful decades prior to his prime tbh. This might just be a ragdollin

Kylo stomps tbh