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Let's run Steve before he became Cap vs Arthur Fleck Joker:

R1: H2H

R2: Steve has the trash can lid, Joker has a knife

R3: Steve has his basic training rifle (M1 Garand?) and Arthur has whatever pistol he used to kill MurrAY.


Battleground is the alleyway where Steve gets beat up until Bucky clocks the bully in the First Avenger, and both combatants can also use whatever is lying around.

steve beats up fleck with the greatest of ease

Fleck dominates round one.

Round two not sure, round three Steve wins.

I'm with NemeBro on this one. Pre-serum Steve was sickly as phuck. From CA:TFA:

https://66.media.tumblr.com/2eea9b96de6723c7439204fd03bde3f4/tumblr_n41d7qS3rp1qau3b7o3_250.gif

And that's not even getting into the size/reach/mass advantage Fleck has. Arthur would likely get beaten to a pulp by the average healthy adult/older teenager in a fist fight, but pre-serum Steve was not one of those.

I'm going to have to strongly disagree on some random guy "ending" Joker with one punch. He was weak but he wasn't that weak. If he was, he wouldn't have been able to still pull out his gun and kill these guys while they were beating on him:

mUPJckUSdzo

And the gif I posted is from The First Avenger. So, whether it makes sense or not, that's what the writers chose to include.

This is pretty tough to call. Good point for both.

More like good points against both.

OP should have added Foggy Nelson from Netflix Daredevil for a triple non-threat match.

You’re welcome!

Originally posted by NemeBro
He got jumped by like five teenagers after having a piece of wood shattered over his face while he was running full-sprint into it. Not a single one of you who have posted in this thread would have performed noticeably better under the same circumstance.

I was actually going to post about this bit as well, but figured the scene with the three guys in the subway train was already enough to get the point across. And I'm lazy.

Because I rewatched that scene with the teens in the alleyway as well. And, with more consideration, I think that was also partly down to Arthur's mental state there that he didn't do more. Because he was too much of a pu$$y to stand up for himself at the beginning of the film, and pretty much just started crying when the kids started kicking him. In contrast, in the vid I posted where he had already changed mentally to a degree, you can actually see the shift to anger at around the 2:40 to 2:42 mark. Beginning of film Arthur probably would have just played dead.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Fleck dominates round one.

Round two not sure, round three Steve wins.

I agree

Arthur at the end of the movie was totally different than in the beginning. I'm pretty sure Joker (Arthur at the end) would shit stomp Steve in h2h and with the knife.

Steve owns in the third scenario even though Joker was a great shot and fast at the draw.

I am solidly on Joker's side for this one now. No amount of heart will help you when your that sickly and weak.