Thrawn vs Vader

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Eli Vanto
This is a battle of tacticians.

Both are given control of identical resources (lets say the 7th fleet), and have 3 hours to prepare before the battle begins.

Neither can directly partake in the conflict. They are basically standing back, commanding their resources like chess pieces.

Who would win?

Bergmar
Thrawn

ares834
Vader is a good tactician but this is Thrawn's bread and butter. It's what he does. And he is the best there is at it.

Thrawn wins handily.

NewGuy01
Originally posted by Eli Vanto
Neither can directly partake in the conflict.

This is spite, then.

Galan007
Yeah, it was made abundantly clear in Alliances that Thrawn was well above Vader as a strategist/tactician.

Thrawn will have engineered Vader's defeat before this battle even starts.

Eli Vanto
Originally posted by NewGuy01
This is spite, then. Do you think allowing Vader to enter the battle would help even things up?

NewGuy01
thumb up Filoni has said that his intention was to treat Thrawn as a Vader-class threat. If they're going against each other, and Vader's strongest asset, himself, is sealed off from him, how can he be expected to win?

Sheev
Couldn't Vader use his precog to help foresee how the battle would progress?

Or could he at least try to read Thrawn's mind to see what moves he was going to make next?

Just spitballing for options here.

NewGuy01
The force isn't quite that convenient of a tool.

Galan007
Originally posted by Eli Vanto
Do you think allowing Vader to enter the battle would help even things up? It certainly wouldn't hurt. Vader in his TIE can rape entire squadrons by himself. Would that be enough to give his side the win over Thrawn(especially if Thrawn knew beforehand that Vader would be participating in the battle)..? I have my doubts.

Originally posted by Sheev
Couldn't Vader use his precog to help foresee how the battle would progress?

Or could he at least try to read Thrawn's mind to see what moves he was going to make next?

Just spitballing for options here. If you're talking canon, then I've never seen Vader use his precog on that kind of scale -- he's mostly used it to foresee the outcomes of situations that he is personally/directly involved in, shortly before the event happens. But even IF Vader's precog were haxx enough to foresee the actions that each and every ship in Thrawn's fleet was going to take, he'd then have to relay that information to each and every ship in his own fleet, who would then have to mentally process the directions he was feeding them and try to act on said information accordingly... All before Vader's 'visions' came true.

tl;dr
Precog wouldn't be efficient enough to make a difference in the battle if Vader wasn't actively participating. If anything, it would probably hinder his own fleet by confusing the shit out of them.


As for using telepathy: it wouldn't work. Thrawn's mind is too complex for Vader to read.

Eli Vanto
Originally posted by NewGuy01
thumb up Filoni has said that his intention was to treat Thrawn as a Vader-class threat. When did Filoni say that?

Originally posted by Galan007
It certainly wouldn't hurt. Vader in his TIE can rape entire squadrons by himself. Would that be enough to give his side the win over Thrawn(especially if Thrawn knew beforehand that Vader would be participating in the battle)..? I have my doubts. fair enough.

Sheev
Originally posted by Galan007
Ya, makes sense.

I am curious though- why wouldn't Vader's tp work on Thrawn? Do the Chiss have some kind of blanked immunity to tp?

Total Warrior
Man i'd love to see this battle. Thrawn wins

relentless1
a better matchup would be Tarkin or Sidious vs Thrawn in a battle of tacticians

Scizard
Is Tarkin really on Thrawns sort of level? I assumed Tarkin was more Vader level in terms of tactics.

ares834
I doubt that either Tarkin or Sidious or Vader's level let alone Thrawn's as a tactician. Neither of them have displayed anything impressive in that regard.

Zenwolf
Originally posted by ares834
I doubt that either Tarkin or Sidious or Vader's level let alone Thrawn's as a tactician. Neither of them have displayed anything impressive in that regard.

They aren't....Tarkin is overrated as is Sidious in terms of tactics, why people think they are I just don't understand. That's not what they do, I mean Tarkin can but there are far, far better ones than him.

Darth Thor
Well for Sidious he did manipulate the senate, the Jedi and the entire Galaxy, and he did lure the Rebels into a trap to be destroyed at Endor.

I guess with Tarkin we assume that he must that good given he outranks Vader. And his back story seems to suggest he would be a tactical expert.

But his arrogance at not leaving the Death Star would be the end of him here. Thrawn doesnt have that arrogance.

ares834
Originally posted by Darth Thor
Well for Sidious he did manipulate the senate, the Jedi and the entire Galaxy, and he did lure the Rebels into a trap to be destroyed at Endor.

The former shows his political skill but has nothing to do with tactics. The later is more strategic and it wasn't exactly brilliant.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
I guess with Tarkin we assume that he must that good given he outranks Vader. And his back story seems to suggest he would be a tactical expert.

Which likely has more to do with political skill rather than tactical. Tarkin was a Grand Moff which was a political position not a military one.

Scizard
IIRC Tarkin was put over Vader because he tried to sneak on Project Stardust w/o permission?

The_Tempest
Strategy isn't a military term; it's a generic one that can be applied to multiple contexts.

Military and political strategy are two legitimate but vastly different disciplines.

Given the scope, scale, and intricacies of Palpatine's decades+ long manipulation of the Republic, the Separatists, and the Clone Wars, it's perfectly legitimate to say Palpatine is vastly better strategist than Thrawn unless you're referring to military strategy specifically, in which case he's not close at all.

Darth Thor
Originally posted by ares834
The later is more strategic and it wasn't exactly brilliant.




Well was thwarted by Ewoks which was completely unforseeable factor.

Although granted arrogance did play into his defeat as well.

Galan007
Originally posted by Sheev
Ya, makes sense.

I am curious though- why wouldn't Vader's tp work on Thrawn? Do the Chiss have some kind of blanked immunity to tp? Vader was able to peer into Thrawn's mind -- he just couldn't decipher it:

But I don't know if all Chiss have that kind of 'resistance' to TP, or if it's just a Thrawn thing.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
I guess with Tarkin we assume that he must that good given he outranks Vader. And his back story seems to suggest he would be a tactical expert. Tarkin was a decent military tactician, but he was a better politician.

As for why Tarkin outranked Vader: that had less to do with Tarkin being a tactical genius, and more to do with him being loyal to Sheev ever since his Senatorial days on Naboo. Palpatine rewarded Tarkin by giving him more power/authority than anyone in the Empire(barring himself, and Vader later on) ever had.

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