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Round 1 - no prep
Round 2 - my team gets two days' prep.
Assume the team all work together in perfect harmony.

No one above Mid-Herald level.

1. Grodd with 10 apes from Gorilla City
2. Ultra Humanite
3. 10 Savage Land apes
4. Super-Apes (Red Ghost's; let's say the original, so Miklho, Peotor and Igor)
5. Detective Chimp (with Sword of Night)
6. Titano the Super-Ape
7. Congorilla

3 - they are called The Great Apes of the Temple and just one of them was enough to make the Hulk wish he was never born http://images.killermovies.com/forums/icons/v2/icon12.gif

Not sure what my team would be yet.

Wait, no Hit-Monkey? For shame...

He's not an ape

Ah, damn. You're right.

No Gorilla Man

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
No Gorilla Man

No Nagan, either.

Well I wanted Gorilla Man, but wondered what he brought (yes, I actually did put some thought into it). He has access to tech, but that was it.

Plus, 28 characters seem a lot

No Mallah, either, before people point it out lol.

He brings an extra gorilla with tech

True. Too many gorillas spoil the broth, as they say.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Well I wanted Gorilla Man, but wondered what he brought

Don't underestimate the power of a headbutt...


Logan needed Aaronforce just to stalemate him in the rematch.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
No Mallah, either, before people point it out lol.

Had to google him. Doom Patrol, huh? Nice

Yeah, he's also in love with a floating brain.

So typical Doom Patrol lol. Had a sad death in Salvation Run though (Grodd went apeshit and beat him to death with his lover).

Lol... no single person is beating that team that is mjd Herald or below.

Could you put a team of....5 characters together? If no one character can do it....

sounds like a night in detroit

Is bfr off?

Well the Sword of Night can open portals, and in round 2 Ultra Humanite could create tech.....so let's say no.

Gibbon, Gorilla Girl and Sun Wu Kong will be in any counter team... but who else? Detective chimp is weak sauce.

Gotcha...my team is Carnage, Multiple man, Invisible Woman, Max Lord, and Jesse Quick

Could Morlun and his siblings just feast?

Morlun doesn't have any TP resistant fts, right?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Round 1 - no prep
Round 2 - my team gets two days' prep.
Assume the team all work together in perfect harmony.

No one above Mid-Herald level.

1. Grodd with 10 apes from Gorilla City
2. Ultra Humanite
3. 10 Savage Land apes
4. Super-Apes (Red Ghost's; let's say the original, so Miklho, Peotor and Igor)
5. Detective Chimp (with Sword of Night)
6. Titano the Super-Ape
7. Congorilla Im not sure if this team will beat them round 1 or 2

Rhino
Luke Cage
Ares
Colossus
Thing

Originally posted by Smurph
Could Morlun and his siblings just feast?

There's Grodd and UH with their TP, Detective Chimp with his magic sword, and Titano with his Kryptonite vision (radiation, so a bit dubious, but hey).

Just so people are aware, the Super-Apes have the following powers - Miklho has superstrength, Peotor has magnetism control, and Igor can shapeshift (maybe a bit useless, this one lol).

Come to think of it, the Apes are actually pretty versatile, lol.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yeah, he's also in love with a floating brain.

So typical Doom Patrol lol. Had a sad death in Salvation Run though (Grodd went apeshit and beat him to death with his lover).

I did research him a bit today. Gotta say, that's some good stuff

And he had a cameo in the old Titans show?

https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/11112/111127507/4978338-0553654066-tumbl.gif

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
I did research him a bit today. Gotta say, that's some good stuff

And he had a cameo in the old Titans show?

https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/original/11112/111127507/4978338-0553654066-tumbl.gif

I wanna see something else between a gorilla and raven


if you catch my drift....

Originally posted by MrMind
I wanna see something else between a gorilla and raven


if you catch my drift....



https://i.ibb.co/Bj7G1hH/superheroines-wonder-woman-vs-gargantua-04-gif-by-fkltse-de8tomi-fullview.jpg

https://i.ibb.co/GpM79jx/tenor.png

^ DC at its absolute best.

gif version for those who are not afraid of jizzing in their boxers:

https://64.media.tumblr.com/65443c8376495ea3d3aff80ad4315389/tumblr_ng0v4bBsl61s2wio8o4_500.gifv

Killerpornmovies.com

I should've added the Gorilla Knights from WW's run, damnit....OK, the gorillas with Grodd are these guys:

https://www.writeups.org/wp-content/uploads/Gorilla-Knights-DC-Comics-Wonder-Woman-j.jpg

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Round 1 - no prep
Round 2 - my team gets two days' prep.
Assume the team all work together in perfect harmony.

No one above Mid-Herald level.

1. Grodd with 10 apes from Gorilla City
2. Ultra Humanite
3. 10 Savage Land apes
4. Super-Apes (Red Ghost's; let's say the original, so Miklho, Peotor and Igor)
5. Detective Chimp (with Sword of Night)
6. Titano the Super-Ape
7. Congorilla


1. Aquaman
2. Exodus
3. Manchester Black
4. Ironman
5. Psylocke
6. Professor Xavier
7. Godzilla? Can I use him?

Hope Summers
Loa
Forgetmenot

Hope absorbs the powers of the other two, then just walks about and disintegrates the apes one by one. Prep wouldn't help much since they wouldn't know who exactly they were supposed to prep against -- Loa, I guess?

Does ForgetMeNot work against animals like chimps and gorillas?

Dr nemesis was able to prep for ForgetMeNot ,btw

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Does ForgetMeNot work against animals like chimps and gorillas?
He works against anything except hyper-evolved dudes with multiple brains and external nervous systems, this includes machines, animals, electronic detectors, telepathy, etc.

Edit. I'm not aware of the Nemesis incident. What was the context? How was he aware of Forgetmenot?

Animal Man
Cheetah
Beast Boy
Shadow King
Malice

This guy is just so cool. Countless of times in the past, when it appeared that the X-Men won simply due to pure luck, it was actually ForgetMeNot walking amidst them and their enemies. Unseen. Working his magic.

I wonder if he can be resurrected at Krakoa, or if all of his records and data has been forgotten?

http://oyster.ignimgs.com/wordpress/stg.ign.com/2015/01/73-ForgetMeNot.jpg
http://pm1.narvii.com/6388/d79e2495f9c362da65297399b9b68dfad7c8e102_00.jpg

Originally posted by Magnon
He works against anything except hyper-evolved dudes with multiple brains and external nervous systems, this includes machines, animals, electronic detectors, telepathy, etc.

Edit. I'm not aware of the Nemesis incident. What was the context? How was he aware of Forgetmenot?

He brewed super coffee lol.

Got scans of him against animals? I wasn't aware of that.

Also ,the cleaning robots in xforce's lab all remembered him

Originally posted by Magnon
This guy is just so cool. Countless of times in the past, when it appeared that the X-Men won simply due to pure luck, it was actually ForgetMeNot walking amidst them and their enemies. Unseen. Working his magic.

I wonder if he can be resurrected at Krakoa, or if all of his records and data has been forgotten?

http://oyster.ignimgs.com/wordpress/stg.ign.com/2015/01/73-ForgetMeNot.jpg
http://pm1.narvii.com/6388/d79e2495f9c362da65297399b9b68dfad7c8e102_00.jpg

They resurrected him. He's still currently on the island.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
They resurrected him. He's still currently on the island.
Ohh, nice!

That scan of mine shows him being undetected by brood monsters. Since he's been undetectable by all kinds of lifeforms, alien and terrestrial, throughout the X-Men's various adventures, I'd say it's highly probable that he's undetectable by apes as well. (Apes are, genetically speaking, very close to humans after all.)

Edit. That scan of mine states that Sentinels cannot detect him. If mutant-hunting robots cannot see him, it seems like PIS that some cleaning droids can.

Ok, I was wondering if there was an appearance I was unaware of with him and animals; if there isn't, then ok.

As for the robots, maybe it was the other way round. But the reason why the robots could detect him was because they too were forgotten things.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Ok, I was wondering if there was an appearance I was unaware of with him and animals; if there isn't, then ok.

As for the robots, maybe it was the other way round. But the reason why the robots could detect him was because they too were forgotten things.
Ok, so there's some clause that "forgotten things" can be aware of him. It's got nothing to do with being mechanical/electronic, since e.g. the X-Mansion's security system and Sentinels are unaware of him.

With how his power is described, and how universally it has been shown to function, it would make no sense if non-human great apes were randomly an exception.

I can't recall an explicit encounter with non-human terrestrial animals that would confirm or refute this, though. I'll see if I can find anything, but he hasn't had that many appearances so I doubt it.

Yeah.

So arguably forgotten characters like Titano would be fully aware of him.

Also, with the battlefield being an open line of sight plain, would the apes not just see ForgetMeNot? Or constantly smell him? The way his powers work is, the instant you aren't aware of him, you forget him (so if you are looking at him, for example, and you suddenly turn your head to look at something else, you forget him).

How does that work with smell/hearing? As you'd be constantly reminded of his presence.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yeah.

So arguably forgotten characters like Titano would be fully aware of him.

Also, with the battlefield being an open line of sight plain, would the apes not just see ForgetMeNot? Or constantly smell him? The way his powers work is, the instant you aren't aware of him, you forget him (so if you are looking at him, for example, and you suddenly turn your head to look at something else, you forget him).

How does that work with smell/hearing? As you'd be constantly reminded of his presence.
Being an obscure character (from the readers' point of view) does not confer immunity to ForgetMeNot's power; the cleaning droids were by nature something that aren't seen or remembered.

ForgetMeNot is imperceptible to all senses and forms of detection. He can freely walk in the middle of Brood without them detecting him:

https://abload.de/img/46aj80.png

Wolverine with his extremely sensitive sense of smell and hearing is unable to detect his presence. Storm cannot detect him either, despite her ability to sense beings and objects around her from the displacement of air.

https://abload.de/img/635j61.png

In fact, the only way for others to perceive ForgetMeNot is if he on purpose presents himself to them, and then focuses as hard as he can on being perceivable:

https://i.imgur.com/jHoy2KZ.jpeg

And he only slides out of their knowledge if they look away.

Across a plain battlefield, 0.5km away, when they are focussed on each other? His powers don't work. All your other scans are of him sliding out when his opponents are distracted.

You also show that Xavier remembered him (until he died). UH is a pretty powerful telepath in his own right.

And that ignores Dr Nemesis prepping himself to remember him.

Moreover, your interpretation here:
Originally posted by Magnon
He works against anything except hyper-evolved dudes with multiple brains and external nervous systems, this includes machines, animals, electronic detectors, telepathy, etc.

Edit. I'm not aware of the Nemesis incident. What was the context? How was he aware of Forgetmenot?

Was a bit off. Your information is also a bit outdated.

Fantomex didn't detect him because his nervous system is out of his body or whatever.

He could literally hear him (and referencing the unwashed, means he could probably smell him, but that is speculation):
https://i.postimg.cc/3rBYNZQs/RCO006-2.jpg

Thanks to either his senses, or engineered brain - both of which, the Ultra Humanite has:
https://i.postimg.cc/jdSK7JsL/RCO020-5.jpg

Moreover, as I said (both here and in the Flash thread), his powers depend on sight:
https://i.postimg.cc/NFpcnQxs/RCO005-3.jpg

Clearly evidenced here:
https://i.postimg.cc/2SPfMcnZ/RCO003-1.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/VLZwBL64/RCO004-6.jpg

And here:
https://i.postimg.cc/YC4HXKL7/RCO010-3.jpg

Without anything to hide behind, his powers don't work.

His powers rely on sight alone - maybe when he first appeared that wasn't the case, but we have retcons that exist. Moreover, this just goes to show his powers, whilst interesting, aren't that great in a forum fight.

For example, Marrow can see him, and attacks:
https://i.postimg.cc/6q70k0r8/RCO005-4.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/nr6kpD20/RCO006-3.jpg

Nearly kills him, too.

Then later, when her back is turned, she still remembers him - because he is talking the entire time (i.e. she can hear him):
https://i.postimg.cc/y65nFMKc/RCO012-7.jpg

IF ForgetMeNot had someway of hiding and disguising his scent/sounds etc, then maybe his opponents will forget him. But without? No.

By the by - I actually really like ForgetMeNot, and I reckon he could do well here, if the team he is on was beefed up a bit.

Maybe have Invisible Woman on his team? Or someone capable of hiding him. Then I reckon Hope would need someone with a bit more oomph in the offensive powers section.

And give ForgetMeNot a weapon. Or have someone on the team capable of crafting a weapon for him.

You never said where this battle takes place, so why doesn't he have anything to hide behind

Originally posted by carver9
You never said where this battle takes place, so why doesn't he have anything to hide behind

Because of forum rules?

ForgetMeNot "slides out of their knowledge" if they look away, yes, but more crucially he does NOT automatically slide back into their knowledge if they look at him again. This happens only if he concentrates hard to become perceivable. In my Brood scan, you can see Storm and one of the Brood looking directly at him, without perceiving him.

Perhaps in the above, in place of "look" you can use any sense. You posted scans of Marrow attacking him, but even then he had to announce his presence beforehand in order for Marrow to become aware of him. Fantomex is one of the few exceptions, he even says it himself that he's the ONLY ONE that can detect ForgetMeNot. That doesn't mean that anyone with an evolved mind can automatically detect him; Fantomex's brains (multiple) and nervous system are quite unique in all comics. Even if Nemesis' coffee can make you perceive FMN the apes wouldn't know he exists in the first place so they wouldn't have any reason to try and create such a drink (or some other means of detection).

I wanted to keep my team as small as possible, so it would consist of Hope running around with FMN's and Loa's powers, dusting some apes. But yeah, we could give FMN, say, Forge's Hulk-killer-gun and have him participate in the slaughter as well.

Quantum superposition collapses upon observation of the quantum system into an eigenstate of the observable (in Copenhagen interpretation, at least), yes, but "observation" can be any kind of interaction between the system and the observer (or the environment, even) -- this doesn't have to be a visual observation. Which makes Fantomex's statement odd, and not entirely consistent with FMN's showings. Besides, I'd say even in MU the measurement problem of QM is still an open problem -- collapse of a superposition might simply be a wrong interpretation.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Measurement_problem
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copenhagen_interpretation

In case FMN's powers truly have been "retconned" then my team shall use "pre-retcon ForgetMeNot". :P

Originally posted by Magnon
ForgetMeNot "slides out of their knowledge" if they look away, yes, but more crucially he does NOT automatically slide back into their knowledge if they look at him again. This happens only if he concentrates hard to become perceivable. In my Brood scan, you can see Storm and one of the Brood looking directly at him, without perceiving him.

Perhaps in the above, in place of "look" you can use any sense. You posted scans of Marrow attacking him, but even then he had to announce his presence beforehand in order for Marrow to become aware of him. Fantomex is one of the few exceptions, he even says it himself that he's the ONLY ONE that can detect ForgetMeNot. That doesn't mean that anyone with an evolved mind can automatically detect him; Fantomex's brains (multiple) and nervous system are quite unique in all comics. Even if Nemesis' coffee can make you perceive FMN the apes wouldn't know he exists in the first place so they wouldn't have any reason to try and create such a drink (or some other means of detection).

I wanted to keep my team as small as possible, so it would consist of Hope running around with FMN's and Loa's powers, dusting some apes. But yeah, we could give FMN, say, Forge's Hulk-killer-gun and have him participate in the slaughter as well.

Quantum superposition collapses upon observation of the quantum system into an eigenstate of the observable (in Copenhagen interpretation, at least), yes, but "observation" can be any kind of interaction between the system and the observer (or the environment, even) -- this doesn't have to be a visual observation. Which makes Fantomex's statement odd, and not entirely consistent with FMN's showings. Besides, I'd say even in MU the measurement problem of QM is still an open problem -- collapse of a superposition might simply be a wrong interpretation.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Measurement_problem
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copenhagen_interpretation

Haha fair enough.

But his powers, whilst mentioning quantum superposition, may not actually be that.

All we know is that it relies purely on sight (so perhaps, a stripped down version of it).

In Rd1, they appear on an empty battlefield, and each side can see each other. Thus, his powers don't kick in.

What he needs, is something to completely hide behind, and pray he can't be heard/smelled - then he has a chance.

But the instance he pops out, they will see him, and attack. I mean, he doesn't need to announce his presence either (I can post more scans). They FORGET about him, but once they see him, they don't need to remember who he is to keep fighting.

And that assumes that as soon as they see the enemy, Grodd+UH doesn't just mindwipe them all.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Round 1 - no prep
Round 2 - my team gets two days' prep.
Assume the team all work together in perfect harmony.

No one above Mid-Herald level.

1. Grodd with 10 apes from Gorilla City
2. Ultra Humanite
3. 10 Savage Land apes
4. Super-Apes (Red Ghost's; let's say the original, so Miklho, Peotor and Igor)
5. Detective Chimp (with Sword of Night)
6. Titano the Super-Ape
7. Congorilla

The biggest obstacle I see with in the stipulations is having someone who can tell of has Eckley overcome both Grodd and ultra humanite, While also having someone he can physically match them.

Physically post crisis ultra has beaten up power girl, required the combined power of MMH and GuybGardner to restrain him, and been able to physically go tie to toe with Superman a few times. When you add in the fact that with his mental powers (that he says aren't TP but do exactly what TP does) he has matched Brainwave Snr (who has planetary TP feats) beaten Brainwave Jnr (this was however before his power was amped by his dying father so not the BW that Maxima said was too powerful for her in the astral plane) and controlled several heroes from within Limbo (a dimension that weakens the will power of those there which was why the crime syndicate trapped Hal Jordan and Allan Scot there). I dont see how a few Mid heralds can take him alone.

Then you have Grodd who in TP Captain Comet said was stronger than him (and Comet has several TP feats above MMH).

It just seems you'd need the TP chips of a high herald TPer to best both, otherwise several mid herald TPers or someone with a TP hax protection/counter

Nice team though

I'd probably solo my entire team with Fantomex ,tbh.

Seems like Fantomex misdirection is taxing on him. I can't see him taking out the Gorillas.

maybe have Invisible Woman there too.

Originally posted by Stoic
1. Aquaman
2. Exodus
3. Manchester Black
4. Ironman
5. Psylocke
6. Professor Xavier
7. Godzilla? Can I use him?

I think my team would win.

I wonder if Beastmaster (Boyd Wilson) from the Berserkers could simply dominate all the apes at once. Well, even 50% might be good enough yield if they were then turned against each other. The rest of the Berserkers could be there for support: the Master Builder's citadel was able to inhibit even Xavier's TP so he might be able to protect the Berserkers from the apes' TP (and they were naturally resistant to it as well).

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-dYDpCq83iM8/VE7ilyeYuVI/AAAAAAAADJI/OP1nX0XUWis/s1600/XaAF_2.jpg