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The morals off Vision

Who wins

Honestly, Vision should win.

Yeah, and Bane dies.

bane dies while watching hentai porn

Not sure White Vision has shown what it takes to defeat Doomsday (which is basically BFR).

Remember White Vision doesn't have the Mind Stone. So his blasts won't have Planetary destruction potential (not that even movie Vision ever showcased that kind of power).

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Not sure White Vision has shown what it takes to defeat Doomsday (which is basically BFR).

Remember White Vision doesn't have the Mind Stone. So his blasts won't have Planetary destruction potential (not that even movie Vision ever showcased that kind of power). Agreed Doomsday is far more destructive.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Not sure White Vision has shown what it takes to defeat Doomsday (which is basically BFR).

Remember White Vision doesn't have the Mind Stone. So his blasts won't have Planetary destruction potential (not that even movie Vision ever showcased that kind of power).

Blasts werent what I had in mind. White Vision still has the ability to phase and crush Doomsdays heart or brain. That should work.

Doomsday Stomps.

Originally posted by 9jaboy
Doomsday Stomps.

How exactly?

Originally posted by tkitna
How exactly?
Vision can't hurt DD . Vision can't take multiple punches from DD, he's no Superman. He's also not strong nor Fast enough to BFR DD.
Also DD evolves on the fly.
DD will tear him apart.

Originally posted by 9jaboy
Vision can't hurt DD . Vision can't take multiple punches from DD, he's no Superman. He's also not strong nor Fast enough to BFR DD.
Also DD evolves on the fly.
DD will tear him apart.

How exactly is DD going to punch an intangible being? Also, how is DD going to stop him from reaching in and crushing his heart or brain?

Its not going to be a H2H ordeal.

Originally posted by tkitna
How exactly is DD going to punch an intangible being?
So White Vision was not hit with any physical attack?
Originally posted by tkitna
Also, how is DD going to stop him from reaching in and crushing his heart or brain?

Because White Vision reached the warped Vision's heart without crushing it?
He's not that durable. DD crushes him.

Originally posted by 9jaboy
So White Vision was not hit with any physical attack?

He didnt have to be. He chose to do so. He wont try to go hand to hand with DD in a forum fight.



It was an option he didnt approach. He doesnt have to be durable when he's intangible. DD cant harm him if he chooses him not to. There's really no way DD can win if the Vision fights to the best of his ability. Quit being so hung up on the physical differences when they dont apply here.

Originally posted by tkitna
He didnt have to be. He chose to do so. He wont try to go hand to hand with DD in a forum fight.
Lol Really? He chose to be hit?

Originally posted by tkitna
He wont try to go hand to hand with DD in a forum fight.
Why won't he? Even in bloodlust he was hit physically.
Are you debating Powerset? This isn't tkitna with Vision's powers.


It was an option he didnt approach.
Oh but he did.You need to rewatch it.
But If you think he didn't, why would he here?

He doesnt have to be durable when he's intangible. DD cant harm him if he chooses him not to. There's really no way DD can win if the Vision fights to the best of his ability. Quit being so hung up on the physical differences when they dont apply here. You're making up stuff at this point. Can you prove Vision can stay intangible for the rest of the fight without being tangible? Again even while bloodlusted he didn't do this.
DD is stomping this.

LOL what malarkey, Vision stomps

Vision wins

Originally posted by 9jaboy
Lol Really? He chose to be hit?

Why won't he? Even in bloodlust he was hit physically.
Are you debating Powerset? This isn't tkitna with Vision's powers.


Oh but he did.You need to rewatch it.
But If you think he didn't, why would he here?
You're making up stuff at this point. Can you prove Vision can stay intangible for the rest of the fight without being tangible? Again even while bloodlusted he didn't do this.
DD is stomping this.

Come on man. He went tangible fighting a character that was his physical equal. Not somebody that was his superior.

Again, he went toe to toe with a physical equal.

I dont recall what instance your talking about. WandaVision isnt fresh in my mind. I'm basing my argument on the Visions feats in AoU. Can you post the feat or refresh my memory? Can you prove there is measurable amount of time in which the Vision can stay intangible? Remember, the Vision has never fought an opponent his physical superior like the Hulk before. Again, bloodlusted or not, he was fighting a physical equal, not somebody that was physically superior.

DD has no way if truly winning if Vision fights to the best of his abilities as forum fights indicate.

I just watched the entire fight and the White Vision never tried to reach for the Visions heart so I dont know what your getting at? He tried to rip the gem out of his head and the Vision phased and thats the only time I could see him trying anything like that.

2npjdCSvJUk

(Nevermind, I see when it happened but the Vision was already somewhat intangible. That was never going to work.)

Come on man. He went tangible fighting a character that was his physical equal. Not somebody that was his superior.


You and I both know you're making that up.
Clint is far below him, but he used intangibility.

The thing is he does use it in a fight but just not that much as you're making it out to be. He's more physical than intangible when fighting.


Again, he went toe to toe with a physical equal.
And Clint. That's just how he fights.


Can you prove there is measurable amount of time in which the Vision can stay intangible?
Remember, the Vision has never fought an opponent his physical superior like the Hulk before. Again, bloodlusted or not, he was fighting a physical equal, not somebody that was physically superior. I'm going by what was shown while you're assuming he will stay intangible for an entire fight which was never shown.

Again It's not about the physicality of the opponent as seen with Clint. I don't know where you're getting that from.

You really want Vision to win by all means don't you?

Originally posted by tkitna

2npjdCSvJUk

(Nevermind, I see when it happened but the Vision was already somewhat intangible. That was never going to work.)
Not really, he phased his hand into his heart while the rest of his body was tangible as they both dragged themselves into the ground.
That wouldn't have been possible if they were both intangible.

DD will definitely connect and when he does, Vision will wish he was fighting Hulk.

Originally posted by 9jaboy
You and I both know you're making that up.
Clint is far below him, but he used intangibility.

The thing is he does use it in a fight but just not that much as you're making it out to be. He's more physical than intangible when fighting.
And Clint. That's just how he fights.
I'm going by what was shown while you're assuming he will stay intangible for an entire fight which was never shown.

Again It's not about the physicality of the opponent as seen with Clint. I don't know where you're getting that from.

You really want Vision to win by all means don't you?

What are you talking about with Clint? When he was trying to escape with Wanda? Not sure what that has to do with anything. Clint is no threat what so ever. I'm talking about the White Vision fighting the original Vision. Physical equals.

The reason the Vision is more tangible during fights is because he never fought anybody in H2H that was physically superior to him to the extent that the Hulk or DD would be. Why would he?

Your assuming the Vision would fight a far physical superior the same as he has fought everybody else and thats just not the case in a forum battle.

DD cant win

Originally posted by 9jaboy
Not really, he phased his hand into his heart while the rest of his body was tangible as they both dragged themselves into the ground.
That wouldn't have been possible if they were both intangible.

DD will definitely connect and when he does, Vision will wish he was fighting Hulk.

His hand was phased into the original Visions arm also. The original Vision matched his density or wouldnt have been able to drag him to the ground. Its simple to see that.

DD would never connect if the Vision didnt want him to. Its a terrible matchup for DD.

Originally posted by tkitna
What are you talking about with Clint? When he was trying to escape with Wanda? Not sure what that has to do with anything. Clint is no threat what so ever. I'm talking about the White Vision fighting the original Vision. Physical equals.
I don't wanna go in circles,So try to comprehend and keep up. Clint being a threat is besides the point, but Vision still used intangibility and physicals in and out as Clint was fighting him. Ergo he doesn't only go physical to only his equals like you're assuming.(Where did you even get that assumption from?)

Tell me How would White Vision had known they were physical equals? Until he fought him?


The reason the Vision is more tangible during fights is because he never fought anybody in H2H that was physically superior to him to the extent that the Hulk or DD would be. Why would he?

Lol No That's an assumption right there, No Proof of that. We saw him bloodlusted yet he didn't resort to complete intangibility to try and destroy the opponent inside out. He resorted to physical and actually mixes it and intangibility. That's Vision otherwise you're referring to someone else like tkina.


Your assuming the Vision would fight a far physical superior the same as he has fought everybody else and thats just not the case in a forum battle.

DD cant win
I'm not assuming anything,I'm saying he does what he's shown to be capable of, Period! You're the one assuming he can stay intangible throughout an entire fight without ever becoming tangible because he thinks DD is his Superior.
Lemme give you an example; Thor will always try to hit you with Stormbreaker/Mjolnir , he will definitely use lightning as well but No way is he going to fight with only lightning from a distance no matter the Threat that's not HOW he is shown. Hopefully you'll get it.

Originally posted by tkitna
His hand was phased into the original Visions arm also. The original Vision matched his density or wouldnt have been able to drag him to the ground. Its simple to see that.

DD would never connect if the Vision didnt want him to. Its a terrible matchup for DD. Yeah but White Vision's hand phased first and nothing happened.

DD will connect.

Originally posted by 9jaboy
I don't wanna go in circles,So try to comprehend and keep up. Clint being a threat is besides the point, but Vision still used intangibility and physicals in and out as Clint was fighting him. Ergo he doesn't only go physical to only his equals like you're assuming.(Where did you even get that assumption from?)

Your being obtuse now. The Vision wasnt fighting Clint. He was just trying to detain him He pretty much showed an example of how useless it was for Clint to even try and fight him. If Vision was serious, Clint would have been dead in seconds. Wanda is the one who had to step in. I dont know why your hell bent on bringing Clint up.



What? They were exact copies of each other.



Again, what are you talking about? You are basically saying that if the Vision was being physically pummeled, he wouldnt turn intangible because he turned tangible in fights in which he was not being physically pummeled. Your being silly.



Your basing your entire argument on the Visions performances during his battles where he's never encountered anybody physically superior to him. And why would you think he wouldnt or couldnt stay intangible during an entire fight? As long as he has power, he should be able to stay intangible. Show me proof he has a limit with his intangibility.

Lol. Thor fights the way he does because he's always on par with the strongest character on the field. Why wouldnt he?

Originally posted by 9jaboy
Yeah but White Vision's hand phased first and nothing happened.

And your point? He didnt try to do anything with that hand.



Not if Vision doesnt want him to.

Originally posted by tkitna
Your being obtuse now. The Vision wasnt fighting Clint. He was just trying to detain him He pretty much showed an example of how useless it was for Clint to even try and fight him. If Vision was serious, Clint would have been dead in seconds. Wanda is the one who had to step in. I dont know why your hell bent on bringing Clint up.



What? They were exact copies of each other.
Did you miss the part where that's besides the point?
Clint was outclassed granted, but Vision didn't just stand there, he defended himself a bit both physically and phasing as well, showing that's how he uses his ability. Not that he couldn't just stand there though.

That should be the reason right? Yet another assumption.




Again, what are you talking about? You are basically saying that if the Vision was being physically pummeled There, that wasn't so hard was it? Now you get it. tkitna we just made progress.
This is what I've been saying for 2pages, You finally get.


Lol. Thor fights the way he does because he's always on par with the strongest character on the field. Why wouldnt he?
Wrong ,he's not on par with Thanos strengthwise, Thanos is clearly stronger. But still he fights like that. How do you explain that?

Originally posted by tkitna
And your point? He didnt try to do anything with that hand.

He didn't? So he just phased his hand into Warped Vision's chest for nothing? He was bloodlusted and he did nothing Man that's funny. You're better than this.
He clearly wanted to phase Vision's heart out but he failed.

White Vision stomps

Yes by being vastly weaker WV sure stomps.

Originally posted by 9jaboy
Did you miss the part where that's besides the point?
Clint was outclassed granted, but Vision didn't just stand there, he defended himself a bit both physically and phasing as well, showing that's how he uses his ability. Not that he couldn't just stand there though.

Lol. Why do you think the Vision did that? He was just showing Clint how fruitless it was in even trying to fight him. You are pulling a H1 here. You think because he did those things, thats the only way he can and thats stupid. Once again, he's never had to show any differently and thats whats confusing you.

Vision toying with Clint.
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No I dont get it. You've made no point.



Come on. Thors an arrogant God. He thinks he's on par with everybody strength wise. He basically killed Thanos without the Infinity gems. Also, he doesnt have the option of intangibility so what other choice does he have? I'm sure if Thor had intangibility and was losing a fight, he would use that option just like any character would.

Even with the gems Thor was still shown to be damn near as strong as Thanos.

TYH5AKmZVzE

Originally posted by 9jaboy
He didn't? So he just phased his hand into Warped Vision's chest for nothing? He was bloodlusted and he did nothing Man that's funny. You're better than this.
He clearly wanted to phase Vision's heart out but he failed.

We are talking about the phased hand in the original Visions arm here. Do try to keep up.

Originally posted by playa1258
Yes by being vastly weaker WV sure stomps.

Luckily the Vision doesnt have to depend on pure physical strength. Thats the whole purpose of this debate.

Originally posted by tkitna
Lol. Why do you think the Vision did that? He was just showing Clint how fruitless it was in even trying to fight him. You are pulling a H1 here. You think because he did those things, thats the only way he can and thats stupid. Once again, he's never had to show any differently and thats whats confusing you.
I think I may have overestimated your comprehensive ability. My bad.
I just showed you his go-to move and character and that's difficult to understand? Smh.

No I dont get it. You've made no point.
Before you said Vision won't be hit and would be intangible for the entire fight, Now you say he would go intangible when he gets pummeled. What don't you get tkitna?


Come on. Thors an arrogant God. He thinks he's on par with everybody strength wise.
What are you talking about man? When did he think that? That's how he fights !!! Doesn't matter what he thinks. Kurse, Thanos etc




He basically killed Thanos without the Infinity gems. Also, he doesnt have the option of intangibility so what other choice does he have? I'm sure if Thor had intangibility and was losing a fight, he would use that option just like any character would.
Intangibility?I literally stated he could blast With Lightning from a distance. He could easily beat hulk with it. And his fight with Endgame Thanos would have gone differently. But Even Bloodlusted Thor wouldn't do that as shown in Endgame.
Originally posted by tkitna

Even with the gems Thor was still shown to be damn near as strong as Thanos.

Are you being willfully obtuse? Thor is not as strong as Thanos PERIOD!
I'm done with you.

Originally posted by playa1258
Yes by being vastly weaker WV sure stomps.
Vision wouldn't be able to hurt DD.
DD is on a whole other level.

Originally posted by 9jaboy
I think I may have overestimated your comprehensive ability. My bad.
I just showed you his go-to move and character and that's difficult to understand?

Lol. Against inferior or equal to opponents. Congratulations.

The concept of your argument is like this - if you punched somebody in the arm and hurt them and then punched somebody else in the arm that had no affect, you would continue to try and punch them in the arm because it worked on the first person. No deviation based on opponents right?



I see i'm dealing with a mental midget here. Sit down and try to grasp this. I said if the Vision were to start getting physically pummeled by an opponent, he would revert to intangibility. With an opponent like the Hulk or DD, he would not try to physically overpower them because it would be useless. In that case he could just stay intangible and win by other means. Now was that so hard?



I said what other choice does he have? He has lightning and physical strength. Thats it. If the lightning is ineffective (as in Thanos case) what other option does he have? Process of elimination. Can you figure it out?



He's physical peers with Hulk as proven throughout the entire MCUs run. In Endgame remember when he blasted Thanos with an amplified blast through Iron Mans armor? How did that turn out? Sometimes the lightning isnt the best option.



Thor had already killed Thanos without the gems and then take a look at the 1:57 mark. Thanos is shown to be stronger but not by much. Then take a look at the 2:31 mark. You act as though difference is so much that it shouldnt even be in the realm of possibility.

TYH5AKmZVzE

It is stupid that both Iron Man and Thor dont just keep their distance and fire at Thanos the whole time.

But that comes from the issue of not giving Thanos energy blasts like he does in the comics, but still somehow having to show that hes more powerful than Thor and IM combined.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
It is stupid that both Iron Man and Thor dont just keep their distance and fire at Thanos the whole time.

But that comes from the issue of not giving Thanos energy blasts like he does in the comics, but still somehow having to show that hes more powerful than Thor and IM combined.

Well, to be fair, that's just how they fight onscreen. There have been other instances where keeping their distance would have worked better as well but they both closed into melee range regardless. Though in Endgame Thor's defense, if you actually watch the fight closely you'll notice that he repeatedly aimed at Thanos' head whenever he took a swing with Stormbreaker, which is actually a good strategy on the whole. He's already hit Thanos with his lightning and Stormbreaker before, and he knows which one will cause the most damage with a hit. So, Endgame Thor isn't as dumb or incompetent as some people make him out to be.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Well, to be fair, that's just how they fight onscreen. There have been other instances where keeping their distance would have worked better as well but they both closed into melee range regardless. Though in Endgame Thor's defense, if you actually watch the fight closely you'll notice that he repeatedly aimed at Thanos' head whenever he took a swing with Stormbreaker, which is actually a good strategy on the whole. He's already hit Thanos with his lightning and Stormbreaker before, and he knows which one will cause the most damage with a hit. So, Endgame Thor isn't as dumb or incompetent as some people make him out to be.
Exactly That's how they fight onscreen.
Not as dumb? He didn't hit Thanos even once in Endgame. The smart thing to do next is to rain down Lightning all day. But no he'd rather keep going for the head.


Originally posted by Darth Thor
It is stupid that both Iron Man and Thor dont just keep their distance and fire at Thanos the whole time.

But that comes from the issue of not giving Thanos energy blasts like he does in the comics, but still somehow having to show that hes more powerful than Thor and IM combined.
True, Keeping their distance would have been more effective by far. Thats exactly what I was saying. If they blasted Thanos simultaneously from different angles, the fight would have turned out differently. But Thor doesn't really fight like that.

I actually think IW Thor alone is more powerful than Thanos. Endgame Thor wasn't quick enough though. And he didn't even blast Thanos once.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Well, to be fair, that's just how they fight onscreen. There have been other instances where keeping their distance would have worked better as well but they both closed into melee range regardless. Though in Endgame Thor's defense, if you actually watch the fight closely you'll notice that he repeatedly aimed at Thanos' head whenever he took a swing with Stormbreaker, which is actually a good strategy on the whole. He's already hit Thanos with his lightning and Stormbreaker before, and he knows which one will cause the most damage with a hit. So, Endgame Thor isn't as dumb or incompetent as some people make him out to be.


Huh? He literally overpowered and defeated Thanos in IW by firing at him and throwing StormBreaker from a distance.

Theres literally no logic in fighting someone whose his physical superior up close. Even less so for Iron Man.

Lets not forget Steve almost got the better of Thanos by firing repeated lightning shots at him.

If they had a scene where Thanos leaped up and grabbed Thor when he was in the air, then thatd make much more sense out of the rest of the fight. As it is though makes them look kinda silly.

And he has kept his distance before in fights. Its rare, but this was a fight to save the Universe. There was no room for CIS.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Huh? He literally overpowered and defeated Thanos in IW by firing at him and throwing StormBreaker from a distance.

Theres literally no logic in fighting someone whose his physical superior up close. Even less so for Iron Man.

Lets not forget Steve almost got the better of Thanos by firing repeated lightning shots at him.

If they had a scene where Thanos leaped up and grabbed Thor when he was in the air, then thatd make much more sense out of the rest of the fight. As it is though makes them look kinda silly.

And he has kept his distance before in fights. Its rare, but this was a fight to save the Universe. There was no room for CIS.

The Russos have stated the reason Thor was successful in Infinity War was because he caught Thanos off guard. Plus, Thanos didn't have his sword there either, which he's shown to be very proficient at blocking incoming attacks with.

And Steve really didn't. He managed to knock Thanos on his ass briefly but got wrecked the moment Thanos got more serious. Hell, Thanos was almost immediately back on his feet after the second lightning strike.

And you could say the same about a bunch of other characters as well. Dr Strange could have shunted his ass into the Mirror Dimension, as Thanos had no Stones to counter this time around. Wanda could have used him as a big, purple meat shield when Thanos called down the bombardment or TK skewered him with his own sword after disarming him. I'm pretty sure I could think of more examples if I could be bothered. In the context of what was, as a whole, a really stupid final battle, Thor didn't act any dumber than any of the other heroes.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
1)The Russos have stated the reason Thor was successful in Infinity War was because he caught Thanos off guard. Plus, Thanos didn't have his sword there either, which he's shown to be very proficient at blocking incoming attacks with.

2)And Steve really didn't. He managed to knock Thanos on his ass briefly but got wrecked the moment Thanos got more serious. Hell, Thanos was almost immediately back on his feet after the second lightning strike.

3)And you could say the same about a bunch of other characters as well. Dr Strange could have shunted his ass into the Mirror Dimension, as Thanos had no Stones to counter this time around. Wanda could have used him as a big, purple meat shield when Thanos called down the bombardment or TK skewered him with his own sword after disarming him. I'm pretty sure I could think of more examples if I could be bothered. In the context of what was, as a whole, a really stupid final battle, Thor didn't act any dumber than any of the other heroes.


1)Yeah because that was a Thanos with the full IG.

2) Cap cant fly and keep his distance though.

3) Not sure what youre getting at with this one. My argument isnt on which Avengers can beat Thanos. Its how silly Thor and IM seem not simply keeping their distance when attacking a being whose clearly more physically powerful and a superior combatant to both. But who has no long ranged attacks (that weve seen).

I don't see how Vision can win this.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
1)Yeah because that was a Thanos with the full IG.

2) Cap cant fly and keep his distance though.

3) Not sure what youre getting at with this one. My argument isnt on which Avengers can beat Thanos. Its how silly Thor and IM seem not simply keeping their distance when attacking a being whose clearly more physically powerful and a superior combatant to both. But who has no long ranged attacks (that weve seen).

Yes, Thor took advantage of Thanos being distracted by the IG to blindside him with a lightning bolt and then throwing Stormbreaker at him, a weapon Thanos had no knowledge of at the time (which is, as the Russos explained, why he didn't provide a better counter to it; he didn't know how powerful the weapon was and barely had time to process what was happening). The only person who managed to attack him when he was in a similar vulnerable state in EG was Captain Marvel.

That's not really relevant to how effective the lightning attacks themselves were, which was the initial point.

My point is that Thor's strategy of trying to decapitate Thanos (which he knew would be fatal if successful) wasn't a bad one in the context of a final battle that was terribly written and had a bunch of heroes under-utilising their powers (like Wanda, Dr Strange etc.). And Iron Man often under-uses his ranged attacks, so that's nothing new. Take IM3, for example. Even after Killian had literally torn multiple suits apart like wet tissue paper, Tony still tried fighting him H2H. Though it is worth noting that his only effective attack against Thanos in IW was, in fact, a melee attack.

Anyway, I feel like I'm kind of derailing things here. None of the characters we're discussing are even in this match.