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Diana get her standard gear against Cain, will it help her win?

https://images.app.goo.gl/ayDYeRP3mJ9ijzst8

Random debris kills her.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Random debris kills her.

Let's not fall into sexism category. Debris have the same potential to kill him too.

Diana wins easily

Phantom Stranger is Abstract level and Diana isn't. We don't use showings like that as an average. She still win this though

Originally posted by carver9
Phantom Stranger is Abstract level and Diana isn't. We don't use showings like that as an average. She still win this though

Yes but Stoic was using Cain at his HIGHEST levels.

So......we use Diana at hers.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yes but Stoic was using Cain at his HIGHEST levels.

So......we use Diana at hers.

Highest normal levels.

Originally posted by Stoic
Highest normal levels.

She wasn't amped when she did it to Phantom Stranger. So was at normal levels.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
She wasn't amped when she did it to Phantom Stranger. So was at normal levels.

What would work on him, may not work on Cain though. Two entirely different characters.

Cain is physically superior, but it's a bad match up due his weakness to magic. Diana has plenty options to end this fight.

I don't understand something that Stoic said. If we ask how did the writer know the lasso could affect cain. How do we know it can't? That thing has been able to affect a lot of powerful characters. Also how do we know she can't hurt him physically? He is a powerhouse of course, but isn't she supposed to be a heavy hitter too? Then i wouldn't say she is not capable of damaging him. And if both are written to the best of their capabilities, then her speed, skills and unbreakable gear would be an even bigger issue for him than raw strength alone.

But i don't think we can claim WW to be Phantom Stranger level. She is not on that level consistently.

Also Cheetah isn't an equal to WW in strength. We can see in their battles(most of them) where Diana holds back against her since they had a friendship. Cheetah mostly gives Diana some level of trouble because of her super speed and the magic claws and fangs, strength wise she is not on par with WW. Similar to how Flash doesn't need much besides his amazing speed level to be a threat to most characters.

Originally posted by Stoic
What would work on him, may not work on Cain though. Two entirely different characters.

That's as stupid as saying that Cain's fists won't work on her. Who Cain's fists have worked on, are different characters from Diana.

I seem to recall that Juggernaut's enchantment was once disrupted by Thor creating a sort of magical barrier around him that cut him off from Cytorrak's power, so it's possible that Wonder Woman's lasso could do something similar.

Her lasso is good for one thing and one thing only:

https://i.ibb.co/D94XNLv/czy-lasso-prawdy-wonder-woman-kiedykolwiek-p-k-o-i-2.jpg

And if I see Phantom Stranger scans, I'm going to remind everyone of a tumbling bullet bouncing off Superman's chest almost killing her.

Well, actually it did its job, but the little **** made the deal with Thanatos to get back to the world of the living.

Juggernaut disintegrates her with a yawn attack uhuh

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Her lasso is good for one thing and one thing only:

https://i.ibb.co/D94XNLv/czy-lasso-prawdy-wonder-woman-kiedykolwiek-p-k-o-i-2.jpg

And if I see Phantom Stranger scans, I'm going to remind everyone of a tumbling bullet bouncing off Superman's chest almost killing her.

Well, actually it did its job, but the little **** made the deal with Thanatos to get back to the world of the living.

Juggernaut disintegrates her with a yawn attack uhuh

That comic is not even canon. And stronger beings than bizarro couldn't break the lasso.

It is canon, Nvr.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
It is canon, Nvr.

It isn't. That comic has contradictions to the Post-Crisis canon (Artemis, the Invisible Jet among others). trinity is far too strong contradicted by the accepted canon and the origins before flashpoint to be considered canon itself. And that comic has superman struggling with a plane in one of the issues. Then he took down bizarro by throwing him into a volcano. So i wouldn't use that comic as a credible source to rank power levels for the characters.

Originally posted by Booya_69
Cain is physically superior, but it's a bad match up due his weakness to magic. Diana has plenty options to end this fight.
He isn't stronger lol.

The crimson bands of Shittorak have been broken more often than the Lasso, just saying....

Again. A story that contradicts many things from Post Crisis canon to be considered canon. But even then. Stronger characters than Bizarro couldn't break the lasso. And the lasso isn't her only advantage here.

Originally posted by abhilegend
He isn't stronger lol.

He isn't stronger based on what?

If there being contradictions and inconsistencies with other comics was enough to render a comic non-canon, then no comic ever would be canon. Except maybe a 1-shot that was the only thing ever published by a company.

At the very minimum she ties him up with the lasso.
/thread

Originally posted by light889
He isn't stronger based on what?
Juggernaut has virtually no strength feats that measure up lol

Classic Abhi knew Diana was weaker than Jubilee.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Classic Abhi knew Diana was weaker than Jubilee.
Jubilee is strongest one there is.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Juggernaut has virtually no strength feats that measure up lol

His "lack of" doesn't necessarily mean he's weaker either tho imo. Him slapping around thor and busting up hulk shows you where he lies.

Originally posted by Booya_69
His "lack of" doesn't necessarily mean he's weaker either tho imo. Him slapping around thor and busting up hulk shows you where he lies.
He's never busted up Hulk except the professor hulk who wasn't trying to fight him. Diana is also stronger than Thor.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Diana is also stronger than Thor.

Lol

She doesn't need to he stronger than him.

The lasso needs to be. And I wager that it is.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
She doesn't need to he stronger than him.

The lasso needs to be. And I wager that it is. And I'm not convinced that she isn't stronger than him ot at least just as strong.

Originally posted by Booya_69
Lol
When Thor can physically move the sun or close/enlarge tears in the space time by his bare hands, do let me know.

Originally posted by abhilegend
When Thor can physically move the sun or close/enlarge tears in the space time by his bare hands, do let me know.

Not sure about the sun, but I've seen him do the latter thing:

https://i.imgur.com/lWt7CCV.jpg

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Not sure about the sun, but I've seen him do the latter thing:

https://i.imgur.com/lWt7CCV.jpg
He found a weak spot in the dimensional structure. He can't do stuff like this.

https://i.postimg.cc/nM4TbWLz/image.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/Czw7F4Z4/image.jpg

Originally posted by abhilegend
He found a weak spot in the dimensional structure. He can't do stuff like this.

https://i.postimg.cc/nM4TbWLz/image.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/Czw7F4Z4/image.jpg

Well in those scans she just held open a portal that had already been created and was shrinking. Thor opened a portal from scratch. It's hard to say which feat is more impressive.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Well in those scans she just held open a portal that had already been created and was shrinking. Thor opened a portal from scratch. It's hard to say which feat is more impressive.
Thor had opened a portal there because the dimensional structure was weakened there due to seams and junctures in the tesseract.

Its not at all comparable.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
It is canon, Nvr.
Yep, this series( Batman/Superman/Wonder Woman: Trinity 2003) was referred in The Essential Superman Encyclopedia
https://i.ibb.co/hDbRfyZ/1.jpg

Well I'd say it is because Diana just manipulated a portal that someone else created, so you could say the same thing (the spacetime fabric was already weakened too, because the act of creating the portal weakened it).

But of course this dimensional barrier stuff isn't exactly quantifiable. I was just pointing out that I knew of Thor performing a similar feat to what you asked for.

Agreed, both feats are nice and impressive but hardly quantifiable feats.

I haven't read much of modern juggs stuff. What powerlevel/percentage of cytotrraks power is he operating on these days?

Fragments, iirc

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Fragments, iirc

Diana wins then.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Well I'd say it is because Diana just manipulated a portal that someone else created, so you could say the same thing (the spacetime fabric was already weakened too, because the act of creating the portal weakened it).

But of course this dimensional barrier stuff isn't exactly quantifiable. I was just pointing out that I knew of Thor performing a similar feat to what you asked for.
Not really, cutting through space/time does not makes the fabric of reality weaker.

But she has also closed fissures in reality with her bare hands too.

https://imgur.com/a/t89rE6X

I think if there is a hole ripped in spacetime, that definitely is a pre-existing weak point.

Yeah, Juggernaut has zero chance here. We'd have to engage in all manner of biased thinking to let him win.

1. We use current versions. Current Juggernaut is (and has been for nearly 2 years) completely cut off from Cytorrak - his armour is forged from the Crimson Bands that are on Earth:
https://i.postimg.cc/L6FMR6Mh/RCO008-1648802873.jpg

2. She is much faster than him - always has been.

3. She has her gear. Which includes her sword - Shatterstar put his eye out, and whilst Juggey healed from it (no need to provide this context, guys, lol) there's nothing stopping her from doing it over and over and over again.

4. She also has her lasso. Which is unbreakable - certainly more unbreakable than the Crimson Bands. If she hogties him (using her speed, which we all agree on....) he can do nothing about it. Would likely break his armour before he breaks the lasso.

For Juggy to have a chance to win, this needs to be a face to face slugfest (so skill equalised), no weapons, speed equalised, classic Juggernaut, lol.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
I think if there is a hole ripped in spacetime, that definitely is a pre-existing weak point.
Not really. Also it took Thor and Hercules combined to close a portal in reality.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Not really. Also it took Thor and Hercules combined to close a portal in reality.

Manipulating a portal that was already there doesn't necessarily imply the ability to create one yourself. But it's like I said, this stuff can't really be quantified.

BTW, have you seen my Zha-Vam thread?

Yeah, nice respect thread.

Agree to disagree. Also she can move the sun, Thor can't.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
She doesn't need to he

This one goes to "Best KMC Quotes of All Time".

Originally posted by abhilegend
Wonder Woman moves the sun to restore Earth's orbit (and mentions that she has done it before which was done in golden age).

https://i.postimg.cc/yD1qTP3H/image.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/1fyYxzm0/image.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/DSZjZYb8/image.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/wyK0wq4m/image.jpg https://i.postimg.cc/YLM8wXH2/image.jpg

Apollo casually moves the Earth back into the orbit.



This is better than probably all of Thor's strength feats combined.

I believe Wonder Woman moving the sun in the Golden Age is just a myth perpertrated by fanboys, if we're talking about the same instance.

Doesn't change this thread, but still.

I'm pretty sure I saw a scan of it once.

Yeah, but there's a reason you only see the scan. The actual issue is never referenced and you'll be surprised when you find it.

Go to Wonder Woman (1942) issue #58. The 'sun pulling feat' doesn't happen in the actual story, it's just an introduction hook page.

It's just that nobody cares about Wonder Woman to mythbust her feats.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
If there being contradictions and inconsistencies with other comics was enough to render a comic non-canon, then no comic ever would be canon. Except maybe a 1-shot that was the only thing ever published by a company.

But i'm talking about contradicting major stuff from already established canon. Also bizarro breaking the lasso is not consistent, because the lasso hasn't been broken in a lot of other appearances by characters just as strong and even stronger than him.

Another question, are we assuming that she can't hurt Jugg physically? I think she should have the raw strength to do so. And which versions are being used? Current i guess. Because if it is Classic Jugg vs Post Crisis WW. Post Crisis WW already beat him in unlimited accesss crossover that is canon.

Nobody cares about WW to check her feats? With the amount of out of context feats that i have seen posted on the internet for so many characters, i say this is hardly a WW case only.

I'm trying to catalogue a lot of feats for a lot of characters, but I can only do so much at a time.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
I'm trying to catalogue a lot of feats for a lot of characters, but I can only do so much at a time.

It's hard to keep up, especially these days at my age.

https://i.ibb.co/TW81jfZ/10.jpg https://i.ibb.co/Tbj5rv7/11.jpg https://i.ibb.co/YDNRwGc/12.jpghttps://i.ibb.co/gSbZdN0/13.jpg

https://i.ibb.co/f1s10Fg/WWlol.png

You're right; CIS is still in effect. WW will stop tying his legs up, and the Juggernaut will run on.

OTOH, Cain is stupid enough to stop running, regardless. Such a conundrum.

If we say they are fighting to the best of their capabilities. Then WW would use her super speed and lasso to properly BFR him. I still think she has the physical stats to damage him too.

Also they already fought in Unlimited Access #1 and Diana beat him. And that crosssover is canon.