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1st battle
Asgard got Odin, Thor, Loki, Hela, Fenris Wolf, Surtur all the artifacts and asgardians etc

Annihilation Wave got Annihilus, Thanos, Tenebrous & Aegis, centeurions, Ravenous, Fallen One

2nd battle
Asgard get to call upon the entire 9 realms for help and bring in the armies from war of the realms

annihilus get additional help from all his bugs army and Galactus and his heralds

1st battle is basically Odin and Surtur vs Tenebrous and Aegis. It could go either way depending on how powerful T and A really are (they have so few showings). Asgardian artifacts tip the scale in their favor.

2nd battle is a stomp in Asgard's favor.

I am several beers in but having Tenebrous & Aegis on Team 2 seems lopsided.

Like I totally get that Odin & Asgard fended off Galactus & Silver Surfer during Fraction's Worldseed arc but Tenebrous & Aegis stomped the Galactus & Silver Surfer duo during Annihilation. So the 1st battle seems to be decisively in favor of the stipulated Annihilation Wave's team 1. Am I missing something?

And so long as the 2nd battle's inclusion of "the entire 9 realms for help and bring in the armies from war of the realms" doesn't involve all of Midgard's heroes... then I'd still give the the stipulated Annihilation Wave a majority?

@ODG
Surtur is there on Team Asgard too (plus Asgard gets their artifacts : Casket of Ancient Winters, Surtur's Sword, the Destroyer armor, etc...)

^ Well the Destroyer Armor was already involved in the Worldseed arc but you're correct that Surtur would get Twilight Sword in either scenario, right? And Surtur w/ Twilight Sword is on par with Odin, after all.

I'm too many beers in to parse such considerations and make new conclusions. But I appreciate that you called me out on same.

I will re-evaluate.

Asgardians would also have Jarnbjorn, which is perfectly capable of cleaving up Tenebrous and Aegis by itself.

^ Jarnbjorn is certainly a plot-device weapon that threatens any Celestial and any Celestial-related character, such as Apocalypse. But I am unaware of Jarnbjorn being similarly effective against Abstracts like Galactus, Aegis or Tenebrous?

Isn't that what he used to chop through the Beyonders alongside Hyperion, or am I not remembering right?

^ Unworthy Thor used the alternate universe Thorr's Mjolnir to fight the Beyonders for the entirety of his struggle up until he ultimately couldn't lift it anymore. Apparently because he was no longer unworthy.

IIRC, only then did he resort to wielding Jarnbjorn in the very last panels. If you interpret those final panels as him "chop through the Beyonders", to each their own.

Originally posted by ODG
If you interpret those final panels as him "chop through the Beyonders", to each their own. that's..... exactly what it did though?

but yes i agree that if the axe can slice through celestials and beyonders, it can slice through these bargain bin galactuses.

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
that's..... exactly what it did though? Hyperion and Thor's gallant last stand was indeed gallant. But pretending they managed to take down a horde of Beyonders when they were utterly ineffectual against the initial two Beyonders while assisted by Starbrand, Abyss, and Ex Nihilo(s) is simply stupid.

No reasonable poster thinks Hyperion and Thor chopped/wrecked/destroyed Beyonders at their end.

In fact, the only posters who might peddle such a notion are those morons who are butthurt and want to denigrate the Beyonders' power-level by insisting Hyperion and Thor did so.

Which begs the question...

pointing out facts does not make me butthurt lol.

and it is a fact that thor used the axe to slice through those beyonders. did it like permanently kill them or anything? probably not, but it still damaged them physically. we also know it can slice through celestials.

basically the axe is just a giant plot device like you said, and was made specifically to cut through cosmic beings. no reason at all to think it couldn't also slice through t&a.

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
pointing out facts does not make me butthurt lol.

and it is a fact that thor used the axe to slice through those beyonders. Let's deconstruct your butthurt step by step then.

First: post the panels where Thor "slice through those eyonders".

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
pointing out facts does not make me butthurt lol.




odg is not capable of having normal conversations

Originally posted by MrMind

odg is not capable of having normal conversations
He just likes "spirited debates"

But seriously, wasn't Mjolnir considered superior to Jarnbjorn but Thor only used Jarnbjorn because he became unworthy? Wasn't Mjolnir > Jarnbjorn? I honestly don't remember.

Jarnbjorn would get utterly crushed by Mjolnir in a feat war.

Also, I recall Power Man (not Luke) getting hit by Jarnbjorn.

strangest weapon ever. utter plot device. i wouldn't at all be surprised if it were able to cleave those 2. i also recall surfer ultimately doing pretty well solo against them? i feel like they were the classic 'villain makes a big splash' types who reverted to less than later. at least that's my (faulty?) memory of them. /shrug

Surfer did, but via surfing on the crunch energies or w/e

So just as much through a plot device weapon

Surfer was literally swatted aside like a fly and was dying when he went against **** and Asses.

Originally posted by ODG
Let's deconstruct your butthurt step by step then.

First: post the panels where Thor "slice through those eyonders". this topic has been debated to death in soooo many threads. you can literally see pieces of the beyonders flying off as thor and hyperion are bashing them. indicating physical damage of some kind.

but even if you don't want to count that, the axe can still slice through celestials. burden is on you to prove it -can't- cut galactus tier beings for some reason.

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
this topic has been debated to death in soooo many threads. you can literally see pieces of the beyonders flying off as thor and hyperion are bashing them. indicating physical damage of some kind.

but even if you don't want to count that, the axe can still slice through celestials. burden is on you to prove it -can't- cut galactus tier beings for some reason.

The axe can cut Celestials due to an enchantment placed on it.
Galactus isn't a Celestial, so there's no guarantee it would work on him.

Additionally, the Odin Sword was able to cut through Celestials, but it proved ineffective as they instantly regenerated limbs. One even let it pass through its chest for inspection - classic fiction inconsistency.

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
this topic has been debated to death in soooo many threads. you can literally see pieces of the beyonders flying off as thor and hyperion are bashing them. indicating physical damage of some kind.

but even if you don't want to count that, the axe can still slice through celestials. burden is on you to prove it -can't- cut galactus tier beings for some reason.
Jarnjborn did cut Galactus from the future of King Thor.

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
this topic has been debated to death in soooo many threads. I remain unconvinced by you hiding behind vague allusions to some past KMC threads. I mean, go ahead and post links to those threads if you think them determinative. Otherwise, stand behind your argument or don't. Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
you can literally see pieces of the beyonders flying off as thor and hyperion are bashing them. indicating physical damage of some kind. The Beyonders being "bashed" was utterly fruitless if you actually read the comics. Unworthy Thor opened their dialogue by "bashing" a Beyonder with Thorr's hammer.

https://hosting.photobucket.com/c2ff727d-f6c8-4ae8-b3f1-2b73f185b92b/a05b64dd-8674-4d12-a07a-0639e0294311.jpg

That Beyonder reformed nonchalantly and proceeded to wreck Thor something fierce. It's supremely ironic that in the wake of Time Runs Out, I can't recall any Thor fanboy creaming their pants over Thor being brutalized by the Beyonders. Sure, it was inspirational to see him overcome his unworthiness and rush towards his death alongside Hyperion. But was there any notion that Thor was actually beating up on the Beyonders?

To be brutally honest, I recall that the only KMC posters peddling such a notion were butthurt haters trying to denigrate the on-panel universal scope of power held by the Beyonders by pretending Thor managed any meaningful resistance against them.

That you, pal? kinda

Originally posted by abhilegend
Jarnjborn did cut Galactus from the future of King Thor.

I believe any sharp, highly durable weapon can cut Galactus, whether it's an alternate future version or not. However, Galactus can regenerate from the cuts.

I also believe Jarnbjorn's enchantment prevents the Celestials from regenerating from its damage.

Originally posted by h1a8
I believe any sharp, highly durable weapon can cut Galactus, whether it's an alternate future version or not. However, Galactus can regenerate from the cuts. Agreed. Originally posted by h1a8
I also believe Jarnbjorn's enchantment prevents the Celestials from regenerating from its damage. Maybe preventing regeneration is how Jarnbjorn's enchantment works. But the exact mechanics of it are ultimately irrelevant. Jarnbjorn was enchanted to kill Celestials. This was shown on-panel in Uncanny Avengers #6.

And it was further proven on-panel when the Apocalypse Twins later used Jarnbjorn to kill multiple Celestials off-panel to collect their Death Seeds. Moreover, the Celestial-specific enchantment was incontrovertibly demonstrated when Thor literally one-shot Exitar.

Thor has not similarly one-shot other Abstracts with Jarnbjorn. The sheer gap in results, only underscores how Jarnbjorn is a Celestial-specific bane/plot device.

Anybody trying to conflate other Marvel Abstracts or the Beyonders with the Celestials in a hypothetical vs thread? That only represents a transparently facile attempt to muddy the waters and drag down the Beyonders to Thor's level.

Seriously, such shallow motives are so painfully obvious that even h1a8 is calling you out on it.

Originally posted by ODG
I remain unconvinced by you hiding behind vague allusions to some past KMC threads. says the guy who's been trolling abhi non stop for weeks about past kmc threads.

now that's funny.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
But acting like it's Destroyer/Fed Galactus/Exitar level, when it was straight up tanked by Power Man, parried by Cho with a random sword, and he had to rage himself up to hurt the Destroyer, is misleading.

Moreover, even when it IS Celstial kryptonite...

http://i.imgur.com/3zL5gMn.jpg

It's basically Celestial Kryptonite. I don't think we can just apply it's effects to ALL characters.

Indeed.

eg. Superman can be shot/killed by a Kryptonite bullet, yet that same bullet would be no-sold by the likes of Luke Cage.

okay fair enough.

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
says the guy who's been trolling abhi non stop for weeks about past kmc threads.

now that's funny. How "funny" is it that abihilegend trolled me for 200+ posts across 10+ years while he was ignored?

By all means, elaborate. Hell... go ahead and compare my actions with abhilegend's, you incomparable cuck.