Gender: Male Location: Planning to take over the WORLD!
Leo's Secret Wars!!1! Leo vs Borgson!
so, this is the semi final. all players know the rules. setting is MOGO, 50km starting distance, random locations.
MY OPENING POST:
Once more we play our dangerous game, a game of chess against my old, er, new, adversary… BORG!!
lol This otta be a good folks, so sit back, relax and enjoy. Thor/Sinister—or as I like to call him THINISTER!—the crème de la crème of both tiers. He is one tough mutha, no doubt. Whatever shall I do…?
For the curious, I am using the Jason Rusch/Prof Stein version of Firestorm. And of course, BP. That means I literally have a 2 of the SMARTEST PEOPLE IN TWO UNIVERSES in my head feeding me information. But not only is Stein brilliant, he was merged with Ronnie for years and has all of Ronnie’s experience as well as… ALL the knowledge of ALL the Firestorms in the past AND even his ALTERNATE LIVES:
To hit me, or even to try and drain me, he’d have to actually (a) FIND me, and (b) THROW his hammer and will it to strike me—but he can’t do so if he doesn’t know where I am and any AOE attack will/should pass through me. I have plenty of defenses I can show next post in the event he does something really unexpected.
My ghost form would give me a chance to ASSESS what his plan is and give me some time to adjust before I commit to any ONE plan 100%. A chance to PREP without Prep.
With that in mind, I’ll give a basic outline of what I’d like to see happen knowing I can change up on the fly if necessary.
So, I’m behind him, undetectable by him in any way (he can TRY and find me with TP...) As quickly as I can, once I am somewhere he can’t see me, I turn solid for a moment and transmute the air into the SONIC weapon BP incorporated in his HULKBUSTER ARMOR:
Nasty. The sound should do 2 things: (1) break his concentration causing his force field to fall, (2) stagger the living sh!t out of him. Sinister’s healing and Thor’s durability will allow him to stay conscious, but he WILL be hurting and momentarily disoriented. While he’s staggered, I again transmute the air around him, this time into the weapon BP created to NEUTRALIZE MUTANT POWERS:
Suffice to say—whatever is needed, I can make. I have about a million transmutation feats if needed.
IF I notice he still has a field up (like I said, he shouldn’t as he’d be too stunned to hold it) and you feel I can’t transmute the air THROUGH the shield, a couple DAGGERS will take the force field down and leave him wide open:
The daggers will disrupt or outright take down his force field IF you think it stays up through the sonic attack, and IF you think I can’t affect the air inside it.
NOTE: all of these actions happen EXTREMELY quickly, before THINISTER even knows what’s happening. My transmutations are instantaneous. I create the sonic weapons, and the next moment toss daggers (if the shield stays up) then transmute the air into the suppressant. BP is extremely fast:
Faster than Spidey, Logan and Sabretooth. Lots more speed and reaction feats if needed.
Now then, regarding Sinister: his ORIGINAL power came from APOCALYPSE, who MUTATED his DNA. Since then, he has increased his power dramatically by further mixing his DNA with mutant DNA (iow, by implanting X-GENES) as he did here, to gain his shape shifting power:
In effect, he was turned into, and has continued to turn himself into, a mutant with a wide range of powers—which, thanks to my suppressant, I have just TURNED OFF.
Force field or no, the suppressant would shut down his huge array of powers. If you still doubt I can shut down Sinister’s powers, here BP does that EXACT THING to the powerful VLAD—using materials from a LOCAL HARDWARE STORE! Lol As an added bonus, again using material from a hardware store, he casts out the spirit of HATE MONGER:
Given the extremely limited resources he was working with, in both cases, those feats are UBER as phukc and EASILY justify claims that BP is among the smartest men on Marvel Earth. Now though, he has QUANTUM VISION:
as well as an infinite supply of any material he can think of, INSTANTLY accessible to him. Imagine what he could do…especially with Stein’s chemical knowledge to support him. Recreating the suppressant to deal with Sinister’s mutations would be almost effortless.
Once it’s done, I teleport away from him and when I reappear, again, randomly and as a ghost, I solidify and wrap his body AND HAMMER, (not his head) tightly and several times over in ENERGY SIPHONING VIBRANIUM WRAPS:
Think that, times….10? Anyway, more than enough to hold him, for a while a least. The HARDNESS of vibranium has been questioned in the forum many times, but I’m not sure why. It is certainly one of the most durable metals in the universe:
Yeah, Alicia uses a VIBRANIUM KNIFE to sculpt ADAMANTIUM….
So yeah, it IS strong—very strong. Without the power to shapeshift or teleport, Thor will need to physically shatter the bands. That would leave me LOADS of time to recreate the final piece of the puzzle: the field generator that took down THANOS:
And that’s a wrap. No way he withstands that. Even if Sinister’s powers were at FULL, something capable of so easily and quickly taking down THANOS would end him.
I appear shielded, but will go GHOST and teleport to get behind him undetected. Then:
(1) I hit him with UBER SONICS to stun him
(2) immediately follow with the nanite-delivered power suppressor—I would turn the air in one lung into the suppressant, and the air in the other into…hydrochloric acid IF the judges deem that legal. The rules say no matter manip ON an opponent, so if they determine the AIR in the lungs to be fair game, I can just skip the nanites altogether.
Either way, while he’s reeling and Sinister’s power is gone, I (3) wrap him in vibranium power siphoning wraps then…
(4) hit him with the THANOS KILLING TECH.
And don’t forget—my stealth/ghost form, allows me the opportunity to REVISE these plans, on the fly, in the event something…unexpected is taking place. Can’t wait to see what he’s got up his sleeve…
Jonn could barely sense Jason’s thoughts and was standing right in front of him! That means—AT WORST—I’d be able to get VERY close to him before he had a realistic chance to sense me, let alone attack me. Also, RECALL I AM INVISIBLE AND INTANGIBLE, and intangibility would make sensing me even MORE challenging:
Emma has also locked out Sinister against the X-men, and was apparently keeping him from using any of his other powers against them too. Note how easily he dealt with them once she was distracted. Note too—she was in New York and they were in ANTARCTICA when she blocked his powers. In the second scan, we see pretty clearly they are depicted as relative equals.
BOTTOM LINE: he would fare no better against my psi defenses than Emma did.
IOW IF he manages to find me, as soon as he starts his assault he is stunned, making my own job so much easier.
Of course, this nullifies his follow up attacks: spirit drain and hammer throws are useless since he stunned himself with his first attack and has completely given away his chance to do…anything.
Once he screams in pain, I have the choice of attacks—I could pile on the sonics (SOMETHING THOR CANNOT ABSORB)—or I could just flood him with the power suppressor nanites.
I THINK I’LL OPT FOR THE SUPPRESSOR, IMMEDIATELY.
Why? Because that gives me a moment to make sure the suppressant will work by scanning him down to the QUANTUM LEVEL:
So, I will have no trouble seeing if the suppressant successfully inhibits his variety of x-genes. If it isn’t (no reason WHATSOEVER the suppressant wouldn’t work), I have several options still open to me that I will explore in my final post.
Now then, in the event anyone questions whether Jason can create that many nanites:
One more example of BP’s intelligence and ability to plan.
Borg’s not really in any position to CAUSE any harm to me, but still, he’s cast some doubt on my ability to take damage, so…here we see BP’s armor has allowed him to take shots from Phoenix-powered Namor and Stardust:
IOW: 50km ain’t SH!T! lol I’ll be on top of him, in ghost form, immediately. He’d still be looking for me at that point, and then…my plan proceeds in the exact way I already outlined. The ONLY change comes when/if you think he attacks me psionically. At that point, he stuns himself and I feed him the power suppressant, and scan him to see if it works. If it doesn’t I have options I’ll explore later. Assuming it works as it should, I follow up the suppressant with VIBRANIUM WRAPPING PAPER and the THANOS KILLER.
ONCE HE IS STUNNED, HE IS DONE.
Now, a few other details he raised, just in case…
ENERGY ABSORBING ATTACK
Thor is among the best drainers out there, no doubt, and it would normally be a threat to Firestorm. Problem is, I’m protected by VIBRANIUM armor. There is simply no chance he’s draining me through the armor. BTW, you never showed the REST of the KILLER FROST SCANS. Starting with the scan immediately following Borg’s:
So, Ronnie DID resist the first time she tried draining him. The second time he was in trouble, until…JASON SWITCHED SPOTS WITH HIM. When he did so, FIRESTORM WAS COMPLETELY HEALED. Like I said, STEIN has piloted the Firestorm entity in the past. IF I am ever in trouble, I could easily SWITCH DRIVERS, and be good as new, instantly.
Not an issue as I’m intangible and IMMUNE to lightning anyway:
My consciousnesses and body are fine, as he probably can’t even FIND me, and if he does he only hurts HIMSELF. No light speed hammer throws either I’m afraid since he still can’t find me. My abilities are fine and we’ve seen Jason handle pressure, low balls aside, just fine. (incidentally, here was the rematch with LASHINA: )
He should have been embarrassed but the rematch lasted about 4 panels. Lol
Note how much stock he’s placed in Sinister’s TP. Tsk-tsk. He really has no way to account for the feedback he takes when he tries it, thus utterly forfeiting his chance to do…anything else in this match. The ONE opening is all I need, and he did the EXACT WRONG THING WITH HIS OPENING MOVE! Notice he didn’t even BOTHER with a force field?! He couldn’t have made worse choices to start this thing.
I’m on him almost immediately, he stuns himself, I suppress his powers, hit him with sonics (if needed) then wrap him in vibranium and Thanos tech him to death.
The hammer can’t absorb a sonic attack, nor can it absorb the NANITE suppressant that robs Sinister of his power. It isn’t ‘energy’. It’s tiny MATTER that enters through his skin and mouth and nose and ears, and…you get the picture. No defense against it, ESPECIALLY because the nanites are so small that they are INVISIBLE (he wouldn’t even know they attacked him until his powers failed) and microscopic vision is one power Sinister has NOT given himself yet…He’s got a powerless Sinister, and a Thor who is essentially fighting blindly against a ghost.
Everything I could have hoped for happened in the opening. My plan works, perfectly, and was even AIDED by him in multiple ways. THINISTER (WAY better than SINISTHOR ) goes the way of Thanos.
Well my friend, you put together creative, well thought out attacks showing that you are definitely going for the win.
But the fantasy is over
(please log in to view the image)
Back to reality.
Fire Panther Defenses
You produced some defenses for what’s coming your way, not nearly enough though.
First off, Black Panther has indeed resisted some lightning…from his wife…who isn’t trying to kill him or hurt him in any particular way, but you’re not going to get tender hugs and kisses from me until after you’re unconscious. You’re dealing with Thor, God of Thunder.
to recap, that’s the storm you’re getting hit right from the get go. I can of course increase its intensity to such a degree that it can affect worlds in different dimensions. It would be literally impossible to move or think, it overpowered the Hulk until he increased his strength. That kind of struggle would have killed the planet as Thor increased the power of the storm. I don’t think Firestorm has the physicals strength to move his arms, let alone start casting transmutations as he’s pelted by the elements. Vibranium mesh helps, to an extent, but being struck by strong enough lightning can overload any insulator. My lightning:
Instantly blasts a hole through to Heven, separated and hidden by Odin himself. But I mean, Black Panthers vibranium mesh should save him right? Not likely.
You also posted that because Cable had a tough time finding Panther in time, which is good sure, even though Cable was recovering from NEAR DEATH that same comic: https://imgur.com/a/aYfk6FU
(and although Sinister has also easily hidden his presence from a HEALTHY Cable: https://imgur.com/v9sau91
But still… a good feat right? Might muddle the water a little, make it seem like you can come close without detection.
If it were only Panther. But you’ve got more than one voice in that now very muddled head of yours. And hiding thoughts does not allow for the complex processes you are attempting to use through Firestorm. Or are you shielding your thoughts while also giving commands to Jason? https://imgur.com/bgkulix
This is what happens the exact moment a command goes out, you begin to think and your thoughts give you away, instantly.
That scan of Martian Manhunter having some trouble reading his thoughts doesn’t help your case AT ALL. Because as states in the own scan, wherever he goes, MMH could tell. And that’s in a whole world. We’re on a battle field with 3 beings, you, me and Mogo. Leo forfeits the fight: You literally admit that you’ll be found
So your plan deviates from what you originally posted that you’d come at me with sonics to instead coming at me with mutant suppressor devices. But first, you will stun Mr. ****ing Sinister with your high end mental defenses.
An interesting proposition. So what scan did you post to prove your point?
You posted that: https://imgur.com/TjeeQJC
Come on man. You had to have known better. That’s a weakened Emma Frost, who is not attempting to attack T’Challa, she’s just casually reading the mind of her ally. She as actually forced to practice with her students, the Cuckoos after Original Sin to start getting back into mental shape.
This is that state in which Emma was left: https://imgur.com/TAGBrC3 https://imgur.com/KnlPJoQ https://imgur.com/6Y26omp
Being able to read BP’s mind at all, was a high note for her.
And although she’s since recovered more from that point, she’s still noticeably weakened and not in proper control of her powers, as stated in that same comic from Original Sin you posted: https://imgur.com/POnMb02
What Actually Happens to Panther and Firestorm when they suffer from a mental ATTACK
Here’s what happens to Panther when he’s being actually attacked mentally: https://imgur.com/a/j4ZWaMM
Even the panther god can’t protect him.
Even with all his mental fortitude, attacks his own wife with intent to kill.
Or Here: https://imgur.com/AB5v4cF
Attacks Daredevil completely against his will. Mind Master, an otherwise featless character, didn’t even have to fully subjugate him, he could still talk and whatnot and he still couldn’t break it.
Here’s what happens to Firestorm when attacked by a psychic:
So, with that, you essentially forfeit the battle sadly. As your plan hinges on me being stunned so you can unleash your mutant power suppressants on me, then the vibranium bands, sonic disruptors, thanos KO’er, etc. But you tried to test your mind against ours, and that…is game over.
We’ll address those plans though just for the heck of it.
Thor, being the God of Thunder, has a special connection to his storms.
So the battle field is actually one big trap for you.
And even if you could “hide” from me, hide from my storm, my TP, etc. You can’t hide from the hammer.
Thor and T’challa have interacted before, and that means you’ll be a recognized essence. And Mjolnir can seek you out: https://imgur.com/7IrUQnP
Tracks and breaks the illusions of hell lord Mephisto in his own realm no less.
But you’re intangible right? Dang, guess Mjolnir will pass right through you…
Let’s ask the intangible Vision what he thinks of intangibility as a defense: https://imgur.com/dZIHxJF
Mjolnir can incapacitate the intangible
And all this is light speed of course: https://imgur.com/XTyDaIq
I know you know Loki’s casting is insane, yet Thor can tag him before he can even affect his own person let alone someone else. Same with you. But it’s worse, because your mind will crushed beforehand, your souls will be absorbed and eaten, leaving you a writhing broken mess before anything physical happens to you.
The soul thing has also happened on panel before to you by the way: https://imgur.com/DhROabu
And Sinister eats essences: http://i.imgur.com/d7bjIgF.jpg
You whipped up a lot of impressive tech no doubt, good and solid plans but too many steps to them and far too many things that can go wrong with them. For instance, your mutant power suppressors: https://imgur.com/a/1FocTjl
They worked on Typhoid Mary, that means nothing to someone like Sinister who is not only a unique creation of Apocalypse, not your standard mutant: https://imgur.com/kLvgek1 https://imgur.com/SLOhX7l
And that was the upgraded OMEGA Betsy. This isn’t your daddy’s SK anymore. He’s completely dominated Charles and Betsy, imprisoned Charles, easily, and has a host of other feats that put him on a different level altogether. This isn’t an SK respect thread but judges know one thing: JUST BECAUSE SK DID SOMETHING SURE AS HELL DOESN’T MEAN SINISTER CAN!
And (2) WE HAVE NO CONTEXT FOR THE FEAT. His scans are from X-men WORLDS APART. Here is the very first scene with T’challa:
IOW when she arrives he is ALREADY possessed. How did it happen? Was BP asleep? Not wearing his armor? How long did it take? The feat is both a conflation fallacy (Sinister=/=SK) AND without context.
The DAREDEVIL scan: No vibranium, none of the last 3…decades of upgrades.
CABLE: Cable had the full day and night to recover with Wakandan healers tending him. It’s not like he doesn’t face that type of thing in every comic. He was also just fine when that same night be battled KLAW one on one. Cable 54, if anyone doubts it. He was at full strength when BP hid from him.
NATE GRAY: He touts Sinister’s win over Nate, but:
Sinister and Nate have convoluted history, and he’s PREPPED for Nate. BOTTOM LINE: We’ve seen, TWICE OVER, that Sinister and Emma are in the same ballpark in terms of power. There shouldn’t be any doubt about it.
ORIGINAL SIN: He’s right—Emma’s powers WERE erratic for a bit, especially RIGHT after AvX, but they’d improved significantly by OS. In fact, THIS scene took place WHILE the OS mini was happening:
Reading Nick’s mind is a feat for ANYONE, given his resistance levels are off the charts. And don’t give me that ‘he was old’ schtick. Lol In that same arc he prepped for Strange and went toe-to-toe with the AVENGERS for a bit, including THOR!
Her POWER had never actually left, but her ability to CONTROL it did, for a time. That’s why the Cuckoos had to help retrain her. By OS (as you can see from the above) she had certainly regained much of her control. IOW—blocking and hurting her is STILL a helluva feat.
THINKER: My friend Borg is making a critical error: he is looking at the characters as INDIVIDUALS. FS being mindraped doesn’t matter because…
I’M NOT USING FIRESTORM!
This is FS with ALL of BP’s defenses. Speaking of which:
Yet one more tool to protect me. If I get even a tiny headache, I can activate the aegis and that should end any debate—if there was one. Because let’s not forget I’m also INTANGIBLE and Kitty told us on panel, intangibility makes it even harder to read our thoughts.
JONN: well, here we have a straight up LOGICAL FALLACY. Jonn didn’t have to FIND FS to place the PSYCHIC TRACKER in him, he was standing in front of him—for an extended period of time. You are 50km away, and have NO time. The relevant info in that scan is this: an unshielded FS was standing right in front of Jonn, for a prolonged period, and he STILL had trouble reading his thoughts! Had he not had time to plant the tracker, he wouldn’t have been able to track his thoughts. That’s pretty solid BASE resistance, given some of Jonn’s feats. Now add in BP’s own natural mental resistance, intangibility, vibranium armor AND the AEGIS, and, well…. Sinister’s good, but he isn’t THAT good. Jonn had trouble with a base FS, Cable struggled with BP and Emma got slapped down. But Sinister is gonna walk through ALL these things? C’mon…
A final point on the TP issue: I was also had a FORCE FIELD up in the opening. Recall he INSTANTLY tried frying my brain. My force field would have prevented that at the outset! No way he finds me mentally with all my defenses AND my force field. Please keep that in my. And with that:
RECAP AND THE SUPPRESSANT ISSUE!
Things sounds complex. They aren’t.
IF THE SUPPRESSANT WORKS:
(1) FIGHT STARTS. I’ve a force field up which stops his initial TP attack. I GHOST and track him via SOUL. If he keeps trying tp as I get close my defenses stop him and he actually HURTS himself. OR, HE SIMPLY FAILS TO FIND ME ALTOGETHER—HE HAS ONLY SECONDS BEFORE I’M ON HIM AFTER ALL.
(2) If he’s hurt, or simply doesn’t find me, OR EVEN IF THERE IS SOME COMBO OF THESE THINGS, I INSTANTLY flood him with power suppressing nanotech, SCANNING him to make sure it works and teleport to a new location. Then,
(3) I wrap him and his hammer in POWER SIPHONING VIBRANIUM before
(4) THANOS WHOOPING TECH. (Did he really suggest he could TANK that…? )
It really is simple and FAST..
It doesn’t even matter if he’s harmed or not. It would be nice, and makes sense, but I hit him with the suppressant, regardless. And lol I’m not an illusion for the hammer to fly through—Thor isn’t doing anything to me when he can’t see or sense me. Storms, lightning, all go through me, and he sure isn’t stealing any souls! See how LONG that took??
On the suppressant: Sinister has been listed as an ALPHA MUTANT by the X-MEN and has had his DNA augmented by MUTANT DNA. I SHOWED him imbuing himself with mutant power, and as further support, he’s even turned OTHERS into mutants:
Very much UNLIKE him, I will ACTUALLY always know where he is. As soon as he reappears somewhere, I can hit him with the sonics I’ve mentioned. If he no sells them (hard to believe given what ONE did to CHULK…) I just stay ghosted and port around and try something new.
MY VERSATILITY IS KEY HERE. GHOST+TP PROTECTION+TELEPORT+KNOWLEDGE OF HIS WHEREABOUTS AT ALL TIME=MASSIVE OFFENSIVE ADVANTAGE!
Knowing where he is, maybe I greet him with ABSOLUTE COLD to hold him in place while I use the THANOS killer:
I don’t care about controlling it this time, and we know Thor’s recent history with the sun… lol If somehow absolute cold or a STAR aren’t enough, rinse and repeat, or drop in a series of KALIBAK KO’ing nukes:
ALL of these options are out there, and can be called upon instantly, and can’t be defended. I can just keep attack after attack coming until something takes him out.
WITH OR WITHOUT THE POWER SUPPRESSANT I HAVE A VARIETY OF WAYS TO END HIM.
With his psi power turned off or rendered meaningless by my defenses, Sinister is basically a defensive tool—healing, teleporting, shields. But I do enough damage to overcome the healing, can track his ports and the daggers make short work of his shields. That leaves Thor basically alone and he can’t match my instant versatility and attack speeds—especially since he can’t even FIND ME! The speed and instantaneous nature of my attack, combined with his simple strategic error of leading and leaning so heavily on tp is enough to make sure he doesn’t make it through this thing.
A very good game, my friend. You were a gentleman throughout.
Gender: Male Location: Planning to take over the WORLD!
QUICK HOST NOTE: bada, pr and celey will be judging this one. will send pm's tonight and let them know the match is ready to be ruled on as soon as borg finishes up. no rush dude, you got til saturday if needed. great match you put together, win or lose.
The End Part `
Sorry Leo but I can’t help but chuckle You did so much red highlighting and caps that I almost mistook it for an LOB style post.
So throughout this debate I feel confident that I’ve met nearly every single point brought up and how my plan is more likely to work than Leo’s but we’ll do a quick recap:
Why My Plan Will Work
So Leo says I’m riding the TP train, but, that’s just one of the early points I’ve brought up, of course it’s going to get a lot of attention. And I’ve proven that Sinister has TP capable of going toe to toe with Nate Grey. But as if more needed to be said on the subject, Sinister has also gone toe toe with Xavier: https://imgur.com/w9yIAqJ https://imgur.com/bKGaYvC
It took an outside distraction from Shaw for Xavier to seize the moment and gain the upper hand. So in direct confrontation, Sinister can duke it out with the best and:
Just like Xavier and Just like Nate Grey, no one could avoid keeping Sinister from giving them either an extreme beating, or the mental fight of their lives.
Then you have to factor in how hard it is to actually get Sinister to react to damage:
But I’m really supposed to believe that Sinister is going to feel pain from entering T’Challa’s mind? Someone who has been controlled by far lesser opponents than Sinister? Shadow King is about Psylocke level, let’s not kid ourselves there: https://imgur.com/51BSs7k
Psylocke was taking him to town.
So why wouldn’t it work? Because You posted a scan of Emma Frost trying to read the mind of her ally, a severely weakened Emma Frost? I dearly hope the judges read those Jean Grey scans, because absolutely nothing happened there. Jean Grey didn’t know how to use her powers properly. Of course even a basic ability like projecting an image into her head would work. She barely discovered her TP not long before.
Why else would TP not work? Because Leo posted a scan of T’Challa’s tech blocking out some unruly bugs with TP? You’re going against Mr. Sinister’s TP here: https://imgur.com/d4evMqy Nor does vibranium have any feats that help with TP resistance :]
One of the top 5 mentalists in all of Marvel. I’ve already posted the scans, I’ve made the points, posting more scans of the same would seem redundant. So I’ll end it with this: http://i.imgur.com/kAqKxX0.jpg
Sinister regularly controls the minds of characters far and away more used to dealing with TP than T’Challa or Firestorm.
Factor in then the multiple scans I’ve posted of multiple hard mind rapes to both of Leo’s characters making up his amalgam, and where is the argument here? There is none to be had. The fight was over the second Leo said this: “Finding me would NOT be easy. Now, if you STILL think he can find me, despite ALL that, well…. GOOD:”
And then Leo went on to describe how much of an integral part of his plan it is that SinisThor be stunned:
“IOW IF he manages to find me, as soon as he starts his assault he is stunned, making my own job so much easier. ”
“IF I notice he still has a field up (like I said, he shouldn’t as he’d be too stunned to hold it)”
“f course, this nullifies his follow up attacks: spirit drain and hammer throws are useless since he stunned himself with his first attack and has completely given away his chance to do…anything.”
I’d like it to be duly noted what an integral part of Leo’s plan was built on the basis that SinisThor would crumble in pain because of how weakened Emma Frost reacted to mind reading a friend she didn’t expected to booby trap his head.
This is simply…not going to happen to SinisThor, I don’t know how else to say it.
And just to reiterate, the second I’m in his head, which is pretty much instantaneous as no concrete evidence of any sort was provided, I’m going to hit him with the same fury that took out an entire prepped x-force team as well as arguably the greatest TP ever, Nate Grey.
Also not to be mean but lol at the Kitty scan being an integral part of his defense. Boi. He’s taking a feat from the lead and most well known phaser in Marvel and attributing it to Firestorm. How does that make any sense at all? Because he also knows how to “phase” ? I’m going to start giving Luke Cage Hulk’s feats because they both have super strength.
Here’s the real kicker, THAT’S JUST ONE PART OF MY POSSIBLE ATTACK AVENUES
There was no adequate response to Soul stealing, energy draining, hammer throws, etc.
ESPECIALLY the soul stealing, I saw next to no defenses for that besides “it wouldn’t work, your mind will be so stunned from Black Panther’s defenses”…. Lol
SO I don’t think it’s too far of me to say that I have proven that his essences can be eaten by the soul stealing combination of Sinister and Thor:
And it’s even made easy for me, as he’s flaunting his “ghost” mode around the whole fight.
I would need concrete evidence of FirePanther being able to even produce transmutations in such a form, because any offensive ability that I’ve seen so far has come from corporeal forms. Just by the by.
Then there’s the energy drain:
Oh that’s right there isn’t any Thor abrobs the infinite energies of the god bomb killing every god through time at once incredibly quickly.
And since we’re on the subject of Mjolnir: The hammer that can’t be stopped
It can absorb exotic energies even from a distance:
Mephisto no less, in his own realm. But yes, Fire Panther can hide from it, especially considering Thor would easily be able to track them by their essence alone, as he’s been exposed to Black Panther and therefore Mjolnir cant track him to the end of the universe should it have to:
These are all recaps of things I’ve said in prior posts though. One more quick note though:
MUTANT POWER SUPRESSORS
A HUGE amount of Leo’s plan was invested in him believing that T’challa’s supressors will work on a Sinister plus Thor combo.
And what scan does he post to prove it? : https://imgur.com/a/1FocTjl
A suppressor that works on typhoid Mary.
That’s not how this works. Otherwise we engage in a no limit fallacy. Where was Black Panther when Onslaught attacked? Geez.
There would need to be at least proof of a comparable level that this would work against a mutant who is now mixed with the most resilient god hero in comics. Not some raving lunatic who wouldn’t even phase Sinister or Thor. Much less SinisThor.
That just doesn’t make sense.
Last but not least as I am exhausted and need to get up early…
“That leaves Thor basically alone and he can’t match my instant versatility and attack speeds”
“don’t care about controlling it this time, and we know Thor’s recent history with the sun…”
Who…do you think you are? That’s Thor Odinson you’re talking about. Thor has a constant history of battling and defeating the most versatile opponents Marvel has to offer. From Magneto, to Silver Surfer, to Loki himself. They’ve all gone down to Thor.
Here’s your sun: https://imgur.com/x97YCS6 https://imgur.com/ebkNJBf
Thor openly challenges and resists the Phoenix Force
And here is your versatility: https://imgur.com/31W2C3W
AND HERE BE YOUR FRAGILE GOD THAT YE SO CRAVENLY SPEAK AGAINST !!! (please log in to view the image)
(Durok is in the trans tier by the way)
WHAT DID THY EXPECT? I AM A WARRIOR BORN ! SON OF ODIN, GOD OF THUNDER, LORD OF LIGHTNING !
And you? Paugh.
Sit down, mortal: https://imgur.com/6sC8BS9 https://imgur.com/wYzW9Kv
Thine fate is sealed.
Thanks for the match Leo, win or lose, whenever you want to go again I will be down my friend.
Solid posts and plans from both of you. But this vote will be shorter than my typical assessments.
At the open, Leo had shields up with invisibility and intangibility, while initially planning to make sonic weapons, energy daggers and mutant suppression. Damborg went for a large scale mental/spirit attack, a large lightening storm attack and hammer throw which will absorb energy and cause damage if it hits Fire Panther..
Damborg and Leo backed their claims for the most part, with some of the usual hyperbole. I pretty much ignored any counters which seems to be lowballing, PIS, CIS, etc.
So we have Thinister making large scale attacks while Fire Panther is playing defensive and waiting for the counter punch. I believe that Fire Panther would have stayed undetected for several moments. I believe Thinister would have eventually worn down Fire Panther's defenses.
The fatal flaw. Thinister had no shields up. I had to read his OP several times to make sure I didn't miss him raising shields. This gave Fire Panther an almost instant attack which would have left Thinister vulnerable to Fire Panther's "finishing move". As I said earlier, I believe Fire Panther would be undetectable for several moments. No shields for Thinister and he'd only need a single moment. Had Thinister's shields been raised at the go, Fire Panther likely would have had to materialize to break the shields and the match would have gone down a lot differently.
My vote goes to Leo.
Here's Mudd in your eye.
Official pimp of Steverules
Sig by Steve Rules
Last edited by Badabing on Aug 5th, 2018 at 07:25 PM
A lot of points and counterpoints from both. It seemed each combatant could throw a lot at the wall to see which one would stick(Dambo's style mainly). He threw a lot pretty much nigh simultaneously at the onset. Leo's opening seemed a bit more well thought out mainly because of shields and read more like a step by step plan. I saw some really downright interesting stuff like Fire Panther creating some of BP's array of sweet tech and Thinister using Mew Mew as a "heat seeking missle/vacuum".
It would take a dozen page essay to break down each and everything that each combatant had proposed so I'll stick to the ones I thought were the most important...
At 50k I think Fire Panther can get shields up even with Mjolnir flying at light speed. Dambo did have Mew Mew at a "heat seeking" and energy draining state, but it still has to find its target. That small moment I think gives Fire Panther the time to shield up then go intangible. This should give Fire Panther the time to reach Thinister's vicinity and possibly launch an attack. I said possibly because even though Thinister seemed to throw a lot out there to see which one sticks, a few things seem to be sticking. More on that later...
Ok now on to the issue of Thinister's tp capabilities versus Fire Panther's tp defenses... I think it's a wash. Though Dambo showed Thinister as a quite uber telepath, Leo showed enough for me to muddy up the waters for this avenue of attack. I don't think Thinister's mind is so weak that he would "hurt himself" trying the tp route, but Fire Panther I think has enough roadblocks to fend off outright mind whammies. This also goes for Thinister getting an exact bead on him early. And all this even though Dambo brought up the multiple minds issue. I especially liked the "psionic aegis" at the end. Tricksy... Though I said "it's a wash", wash generally favors Fire Panther here.
So back to the opening. We have Fire Panther shielding up, then going intangible. I said earlier both used many points and counterpoints. Dambo mentioned one thing that seemed to really stick... Fire Panther's ghost/intangible form and item creation. He would have to go tangible to create his main set up for his finishers as well as some of the finishers themselves(Leo himself seemed to acknowledged that fact). That is the mutant supressor. For the record I think Thinister's make up will not be easily erased just like that based on Dambo's explanation. It could probably work, but over time. The main obstacle would be the storm. The storm is another one of Thinister's throw a lot out and one may stick opening that seems to be sticking. That storm based on Dambo's scans would overwhelm almost anything tangible including a needle with nanites. It looks to me it would be extremely difficult for Fire Panther to launch an effective counter attack with such storms buffetting him the moment he goes tangible. I can see Fire Panther going back to defensive mode when the storms starts to overwhelm him, but then this would end up being an attrition battle(albeit short one).
In a battle of attrition even a mini one, I see things going in Thinister's favor. At light speed, Mew Mew would end up "finding" him soon enough and then energy drain would be more of a factor as moments pass. Maybe even the tp route would open. Leo's tight opening was good, but I think he didn't quite have the finish to finish off Thinister. Having to go tangible to create the much needed tech may have been an oversight? I'm not sure whether this was Dambo's plan all along, but this time the "throw everything out there fast method" actually worked.
Thinister accidently wins.
Posted here because sending phildo a pm is not working. Not sure if I was or wasn't supposed to. Oh well, too late now.
Last edited by celeyhyga17 on Aug 6th, 2018 at 08:05 AM
I liked the posts for the most part, and I did my utmost to only go by what you'd shown me rather than trying to mentally argue for or against either of your arguments (as there were some things I would agree with, and some things I wouldn't), and I was actually undecided even after I read the final posts, so I had to think about it some more.
As far as the fight goes, I feel like Damborg's main attack has more "oomph" to it. Like it's going to hit harder than what Leo has planned for his attack. That said, Damborgson's argument felt a little like he had more eggs in one basket, and if his primary attack didn't get the job done, his lack of defences when compared to Leo would end up biting him in the ass. I felt like Leo's argument allowed a bit more flexibility (and I liked the acid attack, even if I wasn't sold on it's effectiveness).
I feel like it would have ended up being a more drawn out fight as I wasn't sure either initial attack would get the job done, and that meant I had to go back and read the whole thing again as I just wasn't sure who would edge it. The arguments by both guys were strong, and I liked that everything was at least reasonably backed up. Whether the scan was something I agreed with or not, it was still nice to see where you guys were coming from without just posting a wall of them in lieu of an actual argument.
You both had me on your side at one point, but when it comes down to it, I have to give the edge to Thinister. Sorry Leo. I just felt like I wasn't seeing enough from your side to put down Damborg's combination, and if I'm being brutally honest, I think Mjolnir even in this thread was shown to be broken enough that it would eventually break the tie.