Gender: Male Location: between apathy and indifference
All or nothing
In this forum I have been accused of being a tree hugging, Bush hating liberal and a Bush loving, media influenced republican zombie. It seems if you disagree with a person's point, they see you as the antithesis of everything they hold dear.
I see people trying so hard to get their point across that they completely ignore when someone agrees with an element in what they say because that person did not believe in everything that that person says.
We seem to live in a time when it's all or nothing, and I fear that it's that element in communication that is becoming the norm more so than the exception both on this board, and in real life.
Anyone care to agree, disagree or comment?
__________________ "I made a typo bif deal" - JacopeX
Gender: Male Location: Losing at something, somewhere
It's far easier to assume than to learn.
It's easier to live ignorant than to know what was hidden.
Darkness covers the facts that should be gone.
But seriously, I get what you're saying, and it's true. However, it is easier to create an artificial idea of a person than to go through and learn all of their individual opinions. It's also easier to debate against someone who disagrees with you than who differs slightly off of your own ideals.
I have gotten into many arguments with both Liberals and Conservatives, simply because im more moderate and not on one side of the spectrum.
For example, in the Abortion Threads...that is like the only point of view I have that is rather Conservative, yet I doubt any of them even realize that I'm Liberal.
And on any thread where I DEFEND Homosexuality, religious conservatives are quick to make a rival out of me.
I remember, in one of the elective philosophy classes I did, Greek philosophy - in nature - compared to the nature of opinion and belief today. Now in the Greek terms it was admirable to have conviction, but it showed wisdom to have educated doubt - that is the understanding that one might be wrong, or more correctly that one could be right, but could always learn more and evolve.
Compare to today - doubt, of any sort is, by and large, and evil thing. A weakness. A person is encouraged to support their stance up to the hilt and to the death, and never listen to the other side. Why? Because people, many people, like to think they know best.
A shame really, and I agree there is to many "all or nothing" attitudes in the world today. To many "your either with us or against us." I have my own beliefs, all based upon fact that I see as the truth. But I still listen to all view points, and if I don't see them as right I will debate them. And throughout life I have changed certain views as I have learnt more. Thus I am often disappointed by those people who blindly and loudly rant their opinions and refuse to listen to any other view but their own, even more so when they demonstrate regretful ignorance, but refuse to learn.
I believe it would be far better if people could admit mistakes and grow. It is not weakness to learn. It is not weakness to outgrow a view point. It is, however, a weakness to hang on to one out of fear, or refusal to see sense, or due to a racist/bigoted stance that has no philosophical or scientific basis.
__________________
From even the greatest of horrors irony is seldom absent.
Gender: Unspecified Location: Aaah! A stalker! Trying to find out
Re: All or nothing
OMG you hate Bush too? Welcome to the club!
I think it is more so that peple believe in their own personal opinions so much, they come to believe that their opinion is the only opinion that really matters. That shits me.
My opinion, don't care what people have to say about you. Especially faceless nobodies who dwell in cyberspace, they aren't real people, they're robots. My philosophy is, in your eyes, you should be the best, and not praise anyone else as high/better/smarter then you. In your eyes, you should be the best. Selfish? Perhaps, that's up to you right?
You're totally correct. The personal freedom to agree with a line item veto seems to have gone by the wayside. There is nothing wrong with viewing issues as grey, rather than black and white or all or nothing. There are a number of posters who I agree with, based on a singular opinion. And others I know I don't based on their devotion to party lines. I have a number of views that don't correspond to the "ideal" gay liberal. The sad part is that when I express those views, people view me as a traitor the "the cause". Nothing could be further from the truth. But, nothing could be more self-serving than believing that any one person argues, uniformly, for one cause or perspective.
Folks like Whob are allowed to infest every potentially interesting argument, making a parody of everyone else that chooses to involve themselves in that argument or discussion. And while I know acknowledging that only adds fuel to his fire and his desperate behavior, I also know it's true. By parodying me, he thinks he's defeating my arguments. But, everyone else is responding accordingly. I don't dictate people's opinions. They do, themselves. And it just happens to irritate him that more people don't blindly follow his idea of the world and it's 6000 year timeframe.
So, you're right. It's hard to have a clear point of view when everyone wants you to follow one banner v. another. And even more difficult when everyone expects you to agree on certain issues.
Seems kind of unreasonable to me - remarkably arrogant and hubristic. It is not wrong, nor once again weak, to listen. Nor to praise someone who is "high/better/smarter" then you. Granted, it is foolish and over the top to base ones happiness and self esteem on how people on the net see you, but at the same time there is no reason to act like and oblivious moron caught up in their own self worth - and I am sure we have all encountered people like that.
After all, how is it enjoyable or informative to jump on line, spray ones oppinions about and ignore any counter argument or actual debate? What does it achieve?
And besides, I can say with complete acceptance and light heart that there are "higher/better/smarter" people out then them me. And you. And everyone on this forum - it is a fact of life.
__________________
From even the greatest of horrors irony is seldom absent.
Last time I checked the conspiracy crowd didn't have the right to an opinions, so, you are just a tree-hugging bush-hater.
A canadian one too.
Anyways, I think something similar applies to people who generaly agree with ones point of view. Like I usually agree with PVS, but sometimes when I do not and he is being a bush-sucking.supreme-fascist, I don't hate him (although he absolutely deserves it...)
KMC Community Forums
Jun 29th, 2006 02:31 AM
