...For religious reasons.
I'm always on the fence in these cases.
There are things i wont do due to certain reasons, so, i've never actively sought out a job where the issue would come up for me. Why would i? Why would anyone?
Life is wacky that way, before we had the muslim woman upset they wouldn't serve her a certain thing on a plane, and now we have a muslim woman upset they wouldn't let her not serve a certain thing on a plane.
But anyways, this really should be an open and shut case..she either does her job or is fired, but why do I get the feeling because she did it over religious reasons..it won't be so open and shut?
__________________ Chicken Boo, what's the matter with you? You don't act like the other chickens do. You wear a disguise to look like human guys, but you're not a man you're a Chicken Boo.
Yup fire her. Don't take a job that may ask you to go against your religious beliefs.
__________________ There's a man goin' 'round takin' names.
An' he decides who to free and who to blame.
Everybody won't be treated all the same.
There'll be a golden ladder reaching down.
When the man comes around.
I'm on the "fire her" bandwagon. Or at least a warning. Maybe a suspension? It doesn't seem too bad a violation, so I'd likely err on the side of less punishment, but a job is a job. As with the marriage story recently, it's not someone being barred from practicing their religion, it's someone imposing their religious beliefs on others in a non-religious setting. Any of these people are free to hold their convictions, just not to illegally impose them.
Btw, marriage lady was jailed for contempt of court, not strictly because of the initial refusal. A subtle, but legally and, imo, ethically important distinction.
...yea... i'm not on that fence. call me an *******. but i think discriminating against people who can't perform the job description they're hired on for should be allowed.
example: the broad that won't give out same sex marriage licenses based on her religion... fire her ass. you have every right to be as religious as you want. it just might mean you can't do certain jobs. just like if i decide to become a vegan and go try to work at a restaurant, and say oh but i won't serve meat... they would be smart to either not hire or fire me.
another example... the muslim broad that sued abercrombie... she should have lost. they're a fashion based business... if you can't conform to the fashion, then you have no business working there. **** outta here with that bullshit.
edit- just realized the clerk is in jail.... that's pretty funny lol. serves her right imo... maybe next time that cow will think twice before making so much noise
__________________
Last edited by red g jacks on Sep 5th, 2015 at 04:24 AM
Or arrange a compromise. Set up to pass orders to someone else, transfer to other tasks like handling border passes maybe... not staying in that position.
But if they can't? Well, it *is* the job.
I am for religious exemptions on a number of things, like dress code, but if the job description is drink server of drinks you won't serve, then they should not be in that job.
The problem with that one is County Clerk is elected (which is why she's in jail for contempt of court after the court ordered her, rather than fired like someone in a fire-able job might be). The other problem is she's disallowing anyone else in the office to give 'em out either....
So I'm going to somewhat play devil's advocate here. I say somewhat because I do wish everyone would just be able to follow the same set of rules. Yet there is precedence in our country for allowing accommodations based on religious or culture differences. I also understand there are so many diverse cultures out there that finding one specific set of rules that is fair to everyone is hard. So REASONABLE cultural allowances are something that is okay with me.
For instance allowing Native American kids to keep their hair long in schools that require long hair be cut. Or allowing certain men to not have to shave their beards in work places.
I'm okay with this stuff as long as it doesn't pose or hurt other people. So to some degree if this story is correct than this lady has a case to make. And if her claim is correct that she got suspended over a complaint about a head scarf for 12 months then that is probably a case she will win. Of course getting suspended for just a head scarf is fishy so there could be more that comes to light which shows the muslim women was expecting unreasonable accommodations to her faith.
Now I'm sure some people here are going to want to jump on me and call me a hypocrite. Like how can you defend this Muslim Woman but be against the Kentucky woman. Simple they aren't the same to me.
According to this article the muslim flight attendant said she was doing things so that customers were still receiving their alcoholic beverages. She also wasn't only serving the beverages to certain people while refusing service to others. I'll be honest if the Kentucky lady simply said that she refused to issue the marriage licenses personally but still allowed her deputies to issues the licenses I doubt anyone here would have cared much. I mean Kim Davis is still a bigoted person against same sex couples but if her office was still issuing the certificates no one would have complained or filed suit against her.
Once again my defense of the muslim woman hinges on her making reasonable accommodations for her faith. If it turns what she was asking for was unreasonable in the context of her job by all means she needs to be terminated from her position. Personally I don't have enough information on how a flight attendants job works to know if her demands are reasonable. Although I'm sure some people here will tell me.
Also according to the article the woman didn't become a muslin until a month after she joined.
__________________ sig by Rao Kal El
Last edited by Newjak on Sep 5th, 2015 at 12:35 PM
Hm, if she was taking orders and then having her fellow attendants actually deliver them and generally made arrangements so no-one is unduely inconvenienced, then, yea, that's *not* a problem.
Good distinction. I don't think this is playing devil's advocate so much as it is clarifying your response. Most who are for some punishment for her (warning, suspension, firing, etc.) would probably agree with this if pressed.
She needs to be fired if they intend to have her doing this again, since obviously she won't do it.
My question is why she even agreed to take a job in the first place that she thought would encroach on her religious beliefs? There are plenty of jobs out there.
Giving someone a special exemption for religion when it comes to school is one thing. School is a thing every child needs. Flight attendant jobs are not in the same category.
__________________ Chicken Boo, what's the matter with you? You don't act like the other chickens do. You wear a disguise to look like human guys, but you're not a man you're a Chicken Boo.
Last edited by Surtur on Sep 5th, 2015 at 03:08 PM
But then the second she converted should of set off a light bulb in her head...because she would of *had* to of served alcohol at this job at some point. She had to know it was a thing.
But what you just said makes it even worse to me and sets a weird precedent. Who wants an employee that *after* you hire them..a month later they suddenly up and decide "yeah I can't do certain things required of me because of religion".
You are kind of stuck because since it has to do with religion if you take any action...we are going to have to hear about it. In a normal job if a person refused to do their job they'd get fired, it's not news. But toss religion into the mix..
Biggest problem I see is if they did give her an exemption then..well, what about the clerk refusing to marry people due to religious reasons? She is in jail, she wasn't giving any exemption. I mean just like the whole "she wasn't muslim when she took the job" gay marriage was not legal when this clerk took the job.
__________________ Chicken Boo, what's the matter with you? You don't act like the other chickens do. You wear a disguise to look like human guys, but you're not a man you're a Chicken Boo.
Last edited by Surtur on Sep 5th, 2015 at 03:15 PM
KMC Community Forums
Sep 5th, 2015 12:05 AM
