"Quentin Tarantino Phenomenon" -- The Great White Hope
One question to all you Tarantino worshipers:
Scenario:
Kill Bill, same movie, frame by frame, but with all Asian cast and produced and directed by a Asian company and director.
Question:
Will you all still so be crazy about this movie? Will you all call the Asian director a genius? Will this movie still be the most fantastic movie you have ever seen. Be honest, guys.
I've finally figured it out. The very sources where QT steals from most have never received remotely the same celebration as QT himself. Recent great Asian flicks such as Hero and Crouching Tiger although well received have never been as celebrated and worshiped as QT's.
Yeah, QT is the Great White Hope. Finally, we have got ourselves somebody who can output action flicks on the Asian level but, behold, he's white.
Scenario #2:
2 great Asian flicks, Internal Affairs, Full Time Killer. all Asian cast, produced and directed by Asian companies and directors. Not good enough.
Solution:
But it's good enough that WE are going to remake them w/ white cast and white directors.
Scenario #3:
Jazz. Black music, no good.
Solution:
White people started playing Jazz and they make the most money and receive the most celebrity.
Need I say more.
Sorry, guys! I know I am gonna stir a nerve or two.
Scenario # 1 I don't care about, and Q.T., in the directoral sense is far from genius. That's factual.
Scenario # 2 has to do with distribution issues, and the fact that Foreign action films won't sell well here, due to the language barrier. Besides, re-casting popular foreign movies and adapting them to US standards is nothing new.
Scenario # 3 Jazz music is FAR from "black music". The roots of African American music is usually traced back to the blues, with which there is a difference. True American Jazz musicians are few and far between, much less white. Kenny G doesn't count, and Elvis being the only one that really capitalized on it.
What's the point of this? I think you should have boned up before presenting scenarios fishing for other people's input.
#1, You say you don't care. I guess that answered my question.
#2, Nothing to do w/ distribution. Have everything to do w/ the myopic and xenophobic culture of this country. See below:
#3, You say, "The roots of African American music is usually traced back to the blues, with which there is a difference." Totally agree. I know the difference between Blues and Jazz, fan of both, thank you. I did NOT say Jazz is THE black music. You are picking bone. When Jazz was first played, sorry to inform you, it was played by blacks only. It was considered lewd and uncivilized. It was "legitimized" by the racial majority, that was whites, when whites started playing Jazz. Now, that's a historic fact.
Back to #2 above using Jazz as example. In Europe, Jazz has long been celebrated ever since they first got a taste of it oh so long ago when it was only played by blacks. Jazz at that time was every bit foreign to them but they did not exhibit the same myopic and xenophobic attitude toward it as American whites did w/ anything foreign. Now, same goes for films. In Europe and most other countries, foreign movies are NOT such a hard sell. A good movie is a good movie. Nobody will be turned off simply b/c it's foreign. See my point?
p.s., You say, "I think you should have boned up before presenting scenarios fishing for other people's input." I guess you were referring to the Jazz bit. Now I've shown you that I indeed have "boned up before presenting scenarios " (to use your words) can you play nice so we can have a meaningful discussion instead of personal attacks?
Last edited by Black Ice on May 17th, 2005 at 07:36 AM
Gender: Male Location: Welfare Kingdom of California
Re: "Quentin Tarantino Phenomenon" -- The Great White Hope
What if the cast were all blacks? Would you still be thrill and hype? I sure would! because unlike you I don't care about race or ethnic background. I'm being honest what kind of bs is this?
That is the most moronic and ill informed comment I've ever seen! FYI QT helped bring Hero to the American audiences in the big screen. Out of his own pocket he help get the film promoted here in the states. And worship? friggin hilarious!
I don't know what all this blah, blah, blah is about and frankly I don't give shit. I saw and love Fulltime Killers indeed a typical Hong Kong action flick. And no! you're not stirring anything. Instead you're displaying your brilliant mind to all us.
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Last edited by WanderingDroid on May 17th, 2005 at 02:34 PM
I am not driven by people’ s praise and I am not slowed down by people’ s criticism.
You only live once. But if you live it right, once is enough. Wrong. We only die once, we live every day!
Make poverty history.
As for Tarantino, and his sources never being celebrated, that's because the true genius of his work is that he finds the diamonds in the rough, makes them his own, and throws it in a pot. The absolute worst films ever are the fabric of his films.
People xenophobia!?! You're off your ****ing rocker. You honestly think people have some fear of foreigners or foreign films? How about being creatures of habit, and the lack of exposure, resulting in subsequent overall disinterest? Nobody is "afraid", besides, plenty of Asian films have found mainstream distribution in the U.S. and enjoyed huge success, i.e. Iron Monkey, Hero, Crouching Tiger. U.S. isn't going to pull Asian action films over here, because the U.S. market is already too saturated with them as it is, regardless of how "good" the foreign counterpart is. And yes, distribution is an factor, because of what I had just said.
Inform me all you want, homeslice. You're the one being prissy and oh so "as a matter of fact"-ual with me. Not once did I insinuate that you DIDN'T know the difference, where as you did with me. I'm well aware that jazz is "black music". Regardless of the "legitimization", not one white jazz player has ever been more widely accepted or popular than Louis Armstrong, Duke Ellington, Count Basie, or John Coltraine. How many times you ever hear Zoot Sims name come up in conversation? Was HE the "great white hope", the one white jazz musician that ushered in the great acceptance. I hardly think so. Times change, historical fact or not, jazz was big before white people took it up, regardless of who was listening to it.
I see your point, but I think you're still failing to consider the levels of exposure to mediums, the incredible difference in culture, and tons of other factors that seperate countries views when it comes to entertainment. You can't speak for anyone other than yourself, either. A good movie ISN'T always a good movie, and people CAN be turned off because it's foreign. It's you not accounting for personal tastes, and presenting opinion as fact. Bad move.
Play nice? Personal attacks? It's your apparent Anti-American stance, and penchant for controversy that have already angered people. I haven't done the first thing. To avoid conflict next time, maybe you should have shown what you knew as supporting facts, instead of leaving them out? You didn't have much to base your opinions/questions on until I called you out.
Gender: Unspecified Location: With Cinderella and the 9 Dwarves
1# Kill Bill is not that great...Pulp Fiction and Reservoir Dogs were...and the director could have been black, asian, spanish or even.........german......and I wouldn't have minded
2# What are you talking aboot?
3# Depends I either like music or not...I highly doubt that I sudennly like music just cause someone of a different collor creates it.
I have average range in the things I enjoy in Film, Music, Tv...
I love blues from John Lee Hooker through to Stevie Ray Vaughn,
I love Horror movies from Alien through to the Grudge(Jap version)...
I love TV comedy from Blackadder through to Dave Chappell.....
I love....etc You get the point I'm sure...
The only criterea that I ask for is something actually be good....
Im sure that the Asian slant has nothing to do with it really.... Kill Bill was a revenge story pure and simple... Like Death Wish....
It could've been full of whoever directing the parts and it'd still be been
a great friggin movie if the films greatness was emulated to the same prowess as the version we all know and love....
...Which brings my post back home..... Its the works we revere first THEN we respect the director if he deserves it..... Which in my opinion, he does.... His works catalogue commands it...
When he starts bringing out shit movies... I'm sure you'll start to see the buzz going around him slack off...
But right now his fight record is 5-0-0 all by knockout....
THAT is what he is praised for....and rightly so....
If another producer had made Resevior Dogs, Pulp Fiction, Jackie Brown or Kill Bill to the same standard of QT's work or COURSE i'd love it......
'Cause quality work is what it is about....not who made it....
Shit... If Spike Lee had made SW exactly as it was, the boards'd still be as filled with fans, wouldn't it....?!!? As I say. The work, not the Artist.
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"Van Zan is the Pinocchio of feces." - Lestov16
Last edited by Sadako of Girth on May 17th, 2005 at 04:44 PM
Well, I will not reply to this threads anymore b/c I rather not to engage myself in personal attacks. I am being called moronic and such ... I have not call anyone names here no matter what I think about his or her opinion, have I? It's such a common tactic to attack the person when you can't argue on points. I also don't think many of you who has replied read my post clearly to begin with. Think what you might of me.
Last edited by Black Ice on May 17th, 2005 at 05:50 PM
Sorry, Sadako. That's why I edited my post ... I realize that not all of you have called me names ... my statement b4 the edit was too generalize to be fair ... well I was kinda pissed reading some of the replies and posted b4 reading all the replies thoroughly.
Bardock42,
You just did exactly what I am talking about. You have a point, say it. Don't be calling people names! Tell your argument!
Last edited by Black Ice on May 17th, 2005 at 05:58 PM
He doesn't have a point b/c he didn't say it. He simply called me pathetic. That's not the topic of this thread. Rather I am pathetic or not has no bearing. If he thinks I am "seeing Racism into things that have nothing to do with it" say it, but he didn't. He just call be a name. That's not a discussion. That's a attack. How can you have a meaningful exchange of opinion w/ anyone if ALL he says is "you're pathetic."
It seems to work for you though because you are now refusing to discuss the topic and our reply's and instead you are focusing on a few people that attacked you.
If you want a debate then debate and don't get hung on because of something like that