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Princess_Leia
Senior Member
Registered: Jun 2003
Location:
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Obi the scapegoat
I was wondering if anyone else thinks that Obi Wan is always used as the scapegoat for everyone else's mistakes? I know he's not perfect but Obi's blamed for everything!
1. It's his fault Anakin went to the darkside.
How?Obi had his best interests at heart. He saw Anakin had anger issues and an ego problem so he didn't let him become a knight straight away until they could be fixed. I thinked he tried to treat Anakin like any other padawan cause he didn't give a crap about any prohesy he just wanted his padawan to be the best jedi he cud be but Anakin didn't like that. No matter what anyone says Obi Wan did or didn't do Anakin still had the choice to be good.He went evil and killed thousands cause his daddy was mean to him?that's a bit pathetic. He went evil cause Palpatine filled his head with stuff and made him think he was better than everyone. Obi tried his best and I'm just sicked of everyone saying it's ok Anakin u can b evil and kill people, we'll all just blame it all on Obi. I know they bickered in ep2 but I think before that they must have been good friends and then everything went wrong, we just only got to see the bad part and the fights.
2. It's his fault Qui Gon died.
Oh my god!Qui Gon was the JEDI MASTER! Obi was just an apprentice at the time and fought the best he cud. Did anyone ever thing it was Qui Gon's fault he got a lightsaber through him?He was suppose to be the master and he made the mistake. If he had of waited for Obi during the fight they cud of tackled him together but Obi got stuck behind the force shield so who knows, maybe Qui wud be alive......
3. He lied to Luke.
Yeh but wud u believe a man who ppl say is crazy when he tells u ur dad is the most evil dude in the galaxy?No, thought not.........
I know he isn't prefect but he is used as the scapegoat all the time and I'm pretty sick of it. Does anyone agree?
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Jul 6th, 2003 07:56 PM |
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yerssot
Senior Member
Registered: Jul 2001
Location:
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to all three of the points: no
1. Imho, Anakin was needed to go dark to fulfil the prophecy
2. QG was alone in the fight when he died, so it's his fault
3. everyone has his point of view
so, no, for me he isn't to blaim everything
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Jul 6th, 2003 08:10 PM |
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Rogue Jedi
ladiesman217
Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Dancin' with myself, oh oh oh oh
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leia, you and i see a lot of things eye to eye. were gonna get along just fine. 
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I must be crazy to be in a loony bin like this....
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Jul 7th, 2003 06:25 AM |
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Rogue Jedi
ladiesman217
Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Dancin' with myself, oh oh oh oh
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anakin needed to go to the dark side to fulfill the prophecy? he went by choice, man. when he went to the dark side, it fell upon the shoulders of luke and or leia to fulfill the prophecy.
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I must be crazy to be in a loony bin like this....
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Jul 7th, 2003 06:27 AM |
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yerssot
Senior Member
Registered: Jul 2001
Location:
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no, GL said a few times that it was Anakin who fulfilled the phrophecy and not Luke nor Leia...
he went dark, killed every knight except OB1 and Yoda (non-canon sources not counted), so there were 2 sith and 2 Jedi, in the end there's only 1 jedi left, so there is balance, and he got that by joining the dark side
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Jul 7th, 2003 09:10 AM |
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Ushgarak
Paladin
Registered: Sep 2000
Location: Chelmsford, Essex, UKModerator
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Well, I do not think it was in any way necessary for Anakin to go to the Dark Side and that is a ridiculous notion of balance, yerss. Killing the Jedi is in NO way necessary for balance, ONLY eliminating the Sith. The Light Side BRINGS balance; there could be a million Jedi and no Sith and things would be balanced. Unless your supposition is that the Jedi are fundamentally flawed and need re-creating (as, of course, Luke will most likely do)- but even then, I would imagine that some sort of prophet-style cause for a re-think in the Order would have been more what the Prophecy had in mind than a mass slaughter!
And Obi-Wan trained Anakin poorly, by his own admission. GL says Obi-Wan made mistakes. So, directly, many of these things are his fault. No-one is saying he was an idiot, just not infallible.
__________________
"We've got maybe seconds before Darth Rosenberg grinds everybody into Jawa burgers and not one of you buds has the midi-chlorians to stop her!"
"You've never had any TINY bit of sex, have you?"
BtVS
Last edited by Ushgarak on Jul 7th, 2003 at 10:49 AM
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Jul 7th, 2003 10:42 AM |
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Princess_Leia
Senior Member
Registered: Jun 2003
Location:
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I know Obi made mistakes and everyone does but I think when he said he trained him poorly he was being very hard on himself. I'm not trying to say he was perfect and made no mistakes I just think it's unfair that Obi seems to get the blame for everything and it's ok for Anakin to get off scot free, well with some ppl anyway.
And Rogue Jedi, I hope we can become gud friends 2.
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Jul 7th, 2003 07:46 PM |
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Rogue Jedi
ladiesman217
Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Dancin' with myself, oh oh oh oh
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me too, leia. however, i think that obi wan was a little strict on anakin in some parts of ep.2. maybe it was because he gave qui gon his word he would train him, and he figured that if he were very strict with him, there would less a of a chance that anakin would end up bad. i think that obi wan was under a lot of pressure.
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I must be crazy to be in a loony bin like this....
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Jul 8th, 2003 10:55 PM |
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Princess_Leia
Senior Member
Registered: Jun 2003
Location:
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yeh he was under pressure but we don't know that he was strict all the time, maybe he just saw how Anakin was become arrogant and had an ego problem and he thought that was the best way to deal with it. We did miss a whole 10 years of the training so I think maybe at ep2 time Obi was probably out of options so he had to be very strict. If he had of feed Anakin's ego I think Anakin wud have ended up worse off. I think Obi had the rite idea, he didn't give a crap if his padawan was the Chosen One or not, he was a jedi first and foremost and he wanted him to be a great jedi and I think Anakin got pissed off cause Obi tried to treat him like everyone else when Anakin clearly thought he was better.
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Jul 9th, 2003 07:06 PM |
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Rogue Jedi
ladiesman217
Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Dancin' with myself, oh oh oh oh
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yeah, like how he thought he rivaled yoda as a swordsman. as if...
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I must be crazy to be in a loony bin like this....
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Jul 10th, 2003 06:19 AM |
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yerssot
Senior Member
Registered: Jul 2001
Location:
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remember, he's still a padawan!
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Jul 10th, 2003 09:40 AM |
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Rogue Jedi
ladiesman217
Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Dancin' with myself, oh oh oh oh
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that too. good call yerssot.
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I must be crazy to be in a loony bin like this....
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Jul 10th, 2003 07:08 PM |
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Princess_Leia
Senior Member
Registered: Jun 2003
Location:
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I think if Anakin had of had Qui Gon as a master he wud of been worse off cause Anakin already has a big head by ep2 and seeing ep1 Qui Gon was all 'he's the chosen one, blah blah' and he'd probably of maybe fed Anakin's ego if u get what I mean, it seemed very important to Qui Gon the fact he was the chosen one, not just that he was a regular jedi, i mean obviously yeh that's a big deal but wud Qui Gon have taken quite the interest and made such a fuss if Anakin hadn't been different? I don't know if I'm saying this rite to describe exactly what I mean but Qui wud have made a big deal about the chosen one thing and that cud of made Anakin get arrogant quicker whereas Obi didn't care who he was, he just wanted him to be a great jedi in the same way others were which was a gud thing i think anyway. Sorry i'm not sure if i used the best wording in explaining it but hopefully u'll get what i mean.
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Jul 10th, 2003 08:32 PM |
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Ushgarak
Paladin
Registered: Sep 2000
Location: Chelmsford, Essex, UKModerator
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Mace and Yoda (having changed their minds since QGJ first presented Anakin) are likeiwse full of the Chosen One gumf. I think QGJ would have had NO patience for a big head in Anakin.
__________________
"We've got maybe seconds before Darth Rosenberg grinds everybody into Jawa burgers and not one of you buds has the midi-chlorians to stop her!"
"You've never had any TINY bit of sex, have you?"
BtVS
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Jul 10th, 2003 10:48 PM |
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Rogue Jedi
ladiesman217
Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Dancin' with myself, oh oh oh oh
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exactly. qui gon would have done a better job of training anakin. anakin might have still turned out bad, but not as easily.
__________________
I must be crazy to be in a loony bin like this....
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Jul 11th, 2003 06:11 AM |
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Princess_Leia
Senior Member
Registered: Jun 2003
Location:
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no i don't agree cause i think he wud of let Anakin off easier on things were as Obi displinced him when he was arrogant and Anakin didn't like it. I think if say someone warned Qui Gon that Anakin was becoming arrogant he wud have dismissed it thinking that they were just against Anakin. I mean look at the way he just completely dismissed the way everyone thought Anakin was a bad idea. I think he'd off sent Anakin off the deep end quicker. I know a lot of fans don't believed the EU things but if u do, look at Xanatos, he was exactly the same as Anakin, big headed and Qui Gon completely overlooked it til it was to late. I always got the feeling that Qui Gon liked the idea of being 'the master of the chosen one'. And I'm still mad at him for dismissing Obi in front of the whole council. I know that's a different story but i still think it was very mean.
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Jul 11th, 2003 08:10 PM |
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Rogue Jedi
ladiesman217
Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Dancin' with myself, oh oh oh oh
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perhaps qui gon would have employed different training methods, so that he wouldnt have had to be as strict on anakin.
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I must be crazy to be in a loony bin like this....
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Jul 12th, 2003 04:49 AM |
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