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superman vs trans tier
we've been working on revising the trans tier. here is the old list:
Amazo, Appolyon, The Asgardian Destroyer, Black Racer, Blackheart, Blaze, Count Abyss, Death Urge, Despero, The Doctor, Doomsday (H/P), Dr. Fate, Eclipso, Elders of the Universe (minus Ego), Fernus, Gog, Gray Man, High Evolutionary, Ion (current), Jenny Quantum, The Keeper, King Thor, Magus (original), Mangog, Mongul I (Pre Crisis), Nightmare, Onimar Synn, Onslaught, Queen of Fables, Resurrection Man 1 Million, Sentinel (Alan Scott), Silver Age Kryptonians/Daxamites, Solusandra, Stayne, Strange Visitor, Sun Eater, Superboy Prime, Superman 1 Million, Takion, Thanos, Tyrant (powered down), Validus
who in that thread can current superman beat for a majority do you think? should superman be boosted to the trans tier? this is a discussion we were going to open at some point anyway, so this is as good a time and place as any i thought....
Oh, and Superman was presented as Skyfather level in innate potential power/combat formidability since at least 1991, culminating in OWAW where he's one-shotting destroying at least Trans tier level Probes.
He tears apart at least trans tier character at 1/2 his current levels while being weakened.
He's outperformed at least 3 Galactus level beings in relative durability showings post Rebirth.
He's firmly Skyfather level on average in innate raw relative power at this point, Even though He's tapping into solidly trans tier levels of power typically.
No, It's not debatable without purposely lying.
Last edited by panthergod on Jan 20th, 2019 at 08:55 PM
Hmm. While Superman has racked up a lot of impressive feats over the years, a fair few from that list have defeated him before, or at least been portrayed as superior. H/P Doomsday was well beyond him, as were Fernus and Superboy Prime. Despero outclasses him generally (bar that one heat vision showing), as do Amazo and Gog.
Personally, I'd say Superman is the tipping point. If you can beat him for a majority, that nets you a position in the Trans-tier. I mean, as I said earlier, he has had *very* impressive feats since many of those fights, yet that doesn't mean we can just disregard them, especially since the characters in the Trans-tier generally have far fewer appearances to operate with.
The question isn't "where does early 2000s Superman rank?" though.
We're talking about current Superman. After Final Crisis, with all of the New 52 showings, and both of the versions merged into one being.
Even so, during that period, Despero has 1 win over Superman (V&V), 1 loss (S/B) and one showing where Superman is the last one standing against him before Zatanna intervenes (JLA: A League no More).
OWAW Superman, in that mindset, specifically said that he could beat H/P DD out in space, when they were facing the probes. In the meantime, New 52 Superman ripped in half Doomsday who was punching out the Phantom Zone dimension, and who nobody on Earth could last 10 minutes against.
The last time Superman and Prime met, they went into a slugfest while Prime was Time Trapper [abstract-level power]. In the same story, Superman was punching Mordru's teeth out [also abstract].
Somewhere around there, he was also going around in punch-outs with Infinity Man [who killed Black Racer and the entire New Gods race]......and then Superman got hit with the Source Wall exploding in his face, got up, and shattered Soulfire Darkseid. Then got sandwiched between New Genesis and Apokolips, too.
The list itself has like half of it magical characters, so that's already like asking "How many fire beings can Martian Manhunter beat?". Then there's some characters I know nothing about - Solusandra? Appolyon? I also forgot to say, we should take Black Racer off the list..which Eclipso, the one who fights Spectre?...Is Strange Visitor the Kismet version? Does Nightmare start in his dimension? Does Ressurection Man get prep, otherwise he's one-shotted? etc.
Furthermore, this isn't a 'comic book story' ranking, but a forum/tourney ranking. Just to give a few examples, imo, he'd break even/take a majority against:
Elders of the Universe [many of them]
High Evolutionary
Kyle Rayner [Ion - depowered]
Asgardian Destroyer
Blaze
Blackheart
Deathurge
Despero
Doomsday [H/P]
Mangog
Sentinel
Thanos
Hell, you can argue he speed-KOs most of the dangerous ones [magic and shit] on the list - Queen of Fables, The Doctor etc.
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Last edited by Philosophía on Jan 21st, 2019 at 01:09 AM
Lately I feel like Superman is beyond high herald tier but doesn’t warrant being placed in Trans Tier just yet.
At first glance I’d say most heroes/villains on that list would probably defeat Superman. But I’d also wager Superman can probably beat a high majority of the people on high herald list
Elders of the Universe
High Evolutionary
Asgardian Destroyer
Blaze (da fuk is he doing in trans tier)
Blackheart
Deathurge
Despero
Doomsday [H/P]
Mangog
Sentinel
Thanos
he can take some wins against these guys, not the majority imo, but some wins
also I feel like the trans tier list is severely missing more than half of roster
there are way more trans tier comic characters than this, way way more
dafuk is kal kent and sbp doing on the list they should be skyfather at least
add in characters like lord mar-vell, lord satanus, invictus, sentry etc on trans list
Superman one shots Despero, two Shots Earth Man w. Combined power of the Legion, , outperform s the JSA again Gog II and Black Lantern Kal_ L.. tears apart trans tiers like Doomsday,physically dominates Skyfather level beings like Darkseid, s, withstooc the combined power of Multiple Galactus class peer sources(CPB, entire Olympian Pantheon, all Earth Magic, Speed Force, etc) . Finger flicks KOs top tiers like Major Force, tanks attacks from Hal Krona Killer Jordan..
I’m just not into pushing a certain hero into another tier so easily
No doubt Superman has TT feats but if we are going to be putting Superman there, I’d wager we can put a a few other HHT characters into the TT as well
Right now if we put Superman into TT, he’d be in the lower bracket of the tier. Unless of course you think he can defeat Amazo, Prime Superman 1 million, SA kryptonians etc. My opinion is that I do not want to push a character to the new tier if he will be at the lower bracket (of the tier). Eventually you’re going to run into the problem of the tier being downgraded.
So keep Superman on the HHT. If he continues to perform, I guess put him in TT.
Amazo: No
Appolyon: Who?
Destroyer: Probably, depends on the wielder
Black Racer: No but he doesn't belongs here
Blackheart: Yes
Blaze: Yes
Count Abyss: Outside his universe, yes
Deathurge: Yes
Despero : Yes
The Doctor: Yes
Doomsday : Yes
Dr Fate: Yes
Eclipso: No but he doesn't belongs here
Elders: Yes
Fernus: Yes
Gog: Which Gog? Kingdom Gog doesn't belongs here
Gray Man: Too little to go on
High Evolutionary: Why is he here?
Ion: No, but he doesn't belongs here
Jenny Quantum: No but doesn't belongs here
Keeper: Yes
King Thor: No
Magus: Yes
Mangog: Yes
Mongul: No
Nightmare: Yes
Onimar Synn: Yes
Onslaught : Which version?
Queen of Fables: No
Resurrection Man: Probably
Sentinel: Yes
Silver age kryptonians: No but doesn't belong here
Soulsandra: Who?
Stayne : Yes
Strange Visitor: Yes
Sun Eater: No but doesn't belong here
Superboy Prime : No but doesn't belong here
Superman 1 million: No but doesn't belong here
Takion: Yes
Thanos: Yes
Tyrant: No
Validus: No
either Stop lying, or stop pretending as if anything you say on this subject isnt trolling.
There is not 'other tier'.
Superman's has been Far above top tier on average since at least 2001.
To dispute this disqualifies you from the conversation.
Superman doesn't just have Trans tier feats-- He EASILY DESTROYING Trans tiers (Imperiex Probes, Despero, nu52 DD, Uncle Sam w/ GL ring auto protect, Earth Man, Gog II,)when he cuts loose since 2001 in OWAW, itself a culmination of a prior theme established near the beginning of Post Crisis Continuity -- Superman is a rival to Darkseid, can kill dynamic, increasing strength trans tier DoS Doomsday in moments while already near death. That's 1991-1992 this plotline was established. This theme was treiterated again in Nu52 continuity.
post Reborn Superman is now literally the combination of Post Crisis-PRe Flashpoint/Pre- Reborn Superman and Nu52 Superman.
Those characters are all at least Skyfather level.
Amazo literally copies Superman's power+the rest of the JLA.
Are you this stupid?
You're opinion is irrelevant.
These days Superman tanks far beyond Galactus level attacks and tears apart at least Kurse level beings while weakened.
Void Sentry tearing apart a high mid tier like Ares was a big deal.
All Out mode Superman tears apart Doomsday, a beings that can one shot shatter Elite top tier Nu52 Diana's arms. while being drained of his power. at HALF his current level.
Claiming He's anything less than lower tier Skyfather level in innate raw power is a deliberate lie, or ignorant biased Fanboyism.
Nu52 Superman literally had more power than gauntlet of Krona Hal Jordan(= TEN GL rings iirc, and with one ringHal can kill beyond Galactus level beings like Krona +6 Galalctus level emotional entities), GoW Diana(trans tier at minimum in innate power), Shazam(Elite top tier), the Flash(the source of the Speed Force) COMBINED.
That's a weakened Superman to the present.
he's essentially back to his Pre-Crisis levels albeit with less cartoony physics..
Now disprove anyting I just stated or Stop trolling this thread.
Superman destroys Trans tiers when he cuts loose-- at 1/2 his current level. He's shaking entire dimensions now.
Never let anyone else define you. Don't be a jerk just to be a jerk, but if you are expressing your true inner feelings and beliefs, or at least trying to express that inner child, and everyone gets pissed off about it, never NEVER apologize for it. Let them think what they want, let them define you in their narrow little minds while they suppress every last piece of them just to keep a friend that never liked them for themselves in the first place.
Never let anyone else define you. Don't be a jerk just to be a jerk, but if you are expressing your true inner feelings and beliefs, or at least trying to express that inner child, and everyone gets pissed off about it, never NEVER apologize for it. Let them think what they want, let them define you in their narrow little minds while they suppress every last piece of them just to keep a friend that never liked them for themselves in the first place.
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Jan 20th, 2019 08:07 PM
