Registered: Dec 2007
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Team 1 imo. Obi-Wan is the weak link and I think Kun could take him out with a stray amulet-blast. Likewise Yoda could beat Uliq rather simply, but not as fast as Kun could Obi-Wan. From there the two double-team him and win.
They were on par when Kun was using single saber Niman, then Kun built his double bladed saber and developed his unique style. After that, Kun was in a league of his own.
What on God's green earth every gave anybody the impressiion that Kun was on Yoda level in both Saber and force powers is beyond me. Team 2 and it really isn't that close.
Registered: May 2010
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You realize a large part of his success with a saber is probably due to the fact he invented a whole new type of saber, and a style to go with it, correct?
As evidenced in PoD, fighting somebody with an unfamiliar saber is very difficult, no matter how powerful they are. (Note, this applies to the saber itself, not the style) Which implies that Kun is not a, "master duelist" since he did what most people wouldn't have thought of: He created a saber of his own, one with two blades.
Now, I have not read most of the comics that feature him, I mostly have vague things to run off of. So please, enlighten me as to who he beat with his lightsaber hwo was not completely unfamiliar with this new weapon.
Also, the Wall of Light denial isn't as impressive when put with the fact that he has those amulets.
Registered: Dec 2007
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Er, wait me?
Oh naw, I agree with you about the double-bladed lightsaber. Kun has jack crap in the way of feats for that thing. I think his best feat was matching Uliq 'I can fight evenly with an enraged Jedi without the Force and 15 years out of practice' Qel'Droma in a lightsaber fight myself. Which happened before he upgraded to a doublebladed.
He's still got his amulets her so I don't see why thats suddenly not impressive.
This whole "hurrrr amulet spam" argument needs to stop.
By Kun's own admission, not only are the amulet blasts nearly impossible to aim, and not only does using the amulets cause him physical damage, but by the omniscient narrators own statements, he can "barely control them", and just using them "nearly destroys him".
Exar Kun's amulets are a non-factor here. He can barely aim them while shooting at slow moving massasi and hundred foot long immobile worms, the latter of which Ray Charles could probably tag with a rifle.
I always wondered why Exar Kun never used his amulet blasts again after that massasi fight, and as of reading TotJ last week, I know why: he can't tag a Jedi with them.
Let's take a second and look at how fast Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon were moving here, starting at :09 in.
They literally traveled like 60 feet in less than a second with force speed.
That was Padawan Kenobi, mind you, not peak of his power, Return of the Sith kenobi.
So against RotS Kenobi and ****ing Yoda? He's not hitting shit, and he'll barely be able to get a single shot off anyway before they're right in his face waving lightsabers around.
Not that it would even matter. There's nothing stopping Yoda, one of the most powerful lightsiders in the entire mythos, from just ripping Exar Kun's arms off with the force, attached amulets and all, at the very start of the match.
Frankly, Yoda could just solo them both with the force. Neither Ulic nor Exar Kun ever displayed any impressive force abilities within the storylines. Ulic, especially, is the weak link here, showing literally nothing throughout the entirety of his screen time in way of impressive force feats.
As far as lightsaber skills, either of the PT Jedi can solo. Ulic held off featless wonder Sylvar without the force. Wow, big deal. Greivous held off half a dozen Jedi, some of whom were masters, two of which were council members, with almost no effort at all. That didn't stop Obi-Wan from handing him his ass in a lightsaber duel. Exar Kun's greatest display of lightsaber prowess is beating featless wonder Crado and featless wonder Mr. Crabs, who wasn't even using a lightsaber.
TL;DR There is no evidence found within the Totj comics that could be used to make a compelling argument for Ulic and Exar Kun winning this fight on any level, whether it be through the force or via lightsabers.
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Last edited by Tzeentch._ on Jul 5th, 2012 at 11:04 PM
Registered: Dec 2007
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He used the amulet blast on Aleema Keto actually. It looked like by that point he had gotten sufficient control over it as well, as he was able to direct it and use it non-lethally.
Ah, just went back and checked, and you're right. I'd forgotten it happened since it literally only lasted a single panel.
Dunno what's giving you that idea, though. He managed to hit Aleema, who was standing completely still and did nothing to stop it. And as for the burning, the panel changes from him blasting Aleema to him immediately dueling Ulic on the next panel. So, don't see how you can draw that conclusion.
edit- Also, it's worth noting that aside from knocking her out, the blast did no damage to her at all, despite the fact that Kun had arrived there specifically to kill them both.
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Registered: May 2010
Location: No clue. Looks.... Blue?
Was there any defence against the amulets shown? I have not read these comics, so.... Yeah.
Anyways, if she was standing still, then the issue arises that we don't know just how well he can hit moving targets, let alone one jumping up around everywhere.
And Kenobi did show the ability to use Force Speed in combat with the droidekas, so he could just run up and get in Kun's face. Theres no doubt he could hold off Kun and Ulic long enough for Yoda to get up there.
Registered: Dec 2007
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Bare in mind that Kun had literally just gotten the amulet and fallen to the dark side. All Force Powers take time to master, even moreso in this case as he was still new to the dark side. IMO, hitting Aleema with it shows that he had progressed in his mastery of it enough to use it casually.
Theres no pain there. He points at her and takes her out easily. As for not killing her, unless Aleema is more durable than a wall or a Sith Wrym then I don't see how it could be abything else than he went easy on her. Perhaps he had questions for her.
Massassi are a Force Sensitive species and can tag Jedi in combat. Also remember that it was the massassi rebelling that killed many of the Sith Lords of the Sith Golden Age.
IMO, if he can hit Massassi with it even with barely any control, thats not the case.
I'd say we should consider the mediums at work here. Its harder to get across how fast someone is from still images, as in a comic, than it is in a movie or a book.
Yoda: "A Jedi uses the force for knowledge and defense...never for attack."
As I have in the past, I'll defend Sylvar from those with poor memories. Featless? Hardly. She's tagged Exar Kun himself, fought Basalisk War Droids, killed Hssiss, killed Massassi warriors with her bare hands and killed an entire nest of Kiltik single handedly. If you don't know what those are:
.... They're pretty big. And there were a lot of them as seen in that second image. Sylvar killed them all, by herself, without losing her breath (Twilek dude didn't do anything). Plus she could hold a fat man in the air with one hand. Also she was skilled enough with the Force to deflect blaster bolts with her hands, an advanced technique.
The fact that Uliq could hold her off despite her rage (known to increase a Jedi powers, see Luke vs Vader) without the Force is one of the most impressive displays of swordsmanship in the mythos imo.
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Last edited by Nephthys on Jul 6th, 2012 at 02:52 PM
Unless the flesh of the creature is lightsaber-resistant, then I'm not terribly impressed by her defeat of it. Sheer size is not a decisive advantage over Force-enhanced physicality.
Is there any evidence to suggest that Kun could nail someone of Yoda's small stature and prodigious speed?
Registered: Dec 2007
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Its more the fact that they're huge (especially that queen) and theres hundreds of them. Sheer size can make for a challenging opponent, see: Rancor, Gorog etc etc. Either way, I'm not calling her the second coming or anything, but dismissing her as a no-name Jedi isn't correct.
Killing armies of giant bugs and basilisk war droids is not an indicator of dueling skills, however. She wasn't doing anything that every other character in the series wasn't also doing, thus, dismissing her is perfectly accurate, when killing fodder is all she has ever done.
As for your argument as a whole, it's all speculation. None of it based on anything resembling canon or showings, just your own interpretation. That's nice, but it's not an argument.
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Jul 5th, 2012 02:05 AM
