__________________ "Happiness is a lie. Life is horror. The light is always dying all across the universe. The last star will flicker out someday, when it does, all that remains is shadow. And I will be its king!"'-Amahl Farouk
__________________ "Happiness is a lie. Life is horror. The light is always dying all across the universe. The last star will flicker out someday, when it does, all that remains is shadow. And I will be its king!"'-Amahl Farouk
Solid, solid thread. Koon and Katarn are balanced as duelists and Force Users, while Maul is the best duelist here by a fair margin, but the worst Force User, and the same goes for Malgus but the other way around. Going to favour Team 2 though. Dueling will be the most prevalent aspect of this fight, and Maul will beat either of them in a duel. Malgus can hold off either of them with his Force power advantage and capable dueling skill, although he'd lose to Plo IMO. Even if he would lose to whoever he fights, Maul is beating the other guy, and then Maul would win the last 1v1.
__________________ “The galaxy must experience the pain of death and the rapture of rebirth as I have. I will bring chaos. It is time for war.”
Both Kyle and Maul are combat experts, so I guess they are somewhat even. Not much known about Plo Koon. His perhaps best feat is fending off Ventress, while having broken arm. He lost to Opress but everyone had hard time dealing with his strength in first encounter, so it doesn't prove anything.
Even if team 2 characters are stronger, Kyle knows battle meld, so he and Koon should fight better as a team. Either team has a chance to win.
Kyle and Maul are definitely not equal as duelists. Kyle could present mid-difficulty to Maul in a duel, but that's it.
Koon didn't lose to Savage in terms of saber skill - he lost because his mask was ripped off. Savage was perhaps getting the better of him seeing as he was dodging blasters bolts from Clones while dueling Koon, and he landed a kick on him, but even then neither of those elements are conclusive to Savage winning, so it was an even fight.
__________________ “The galaxy must experience the pain of death and the rapture of rebirth as I have. I will bring chaos. It is time for war.”
Kicking someone on the floor, or kicking them at all, doesn't mean you're the better duelist. People get kicked all the time in duels and it isn't conclusive of anything. The fight goes on. Neither of them faltered in their saber skills. Savage ripping his mask off shows a certain level of cunning but how you could try and translate that into a dueling win is beyond me.
There is no way to figure out who is a better duelist. Kyle and Maul are not connected in any way to make any parallels.
Katarn after little Jedi training defeated 7 Dark Jedi and Jerec. That shows a great talent and potential.
He is the battlemaster of NJO and I remember in on of the books he was mentioned as unarmed combat expert as well, that means that like Maul he is as skilled and versatile as it gets.
Luke compared a Sith to be a match for Kyle and Kyp. Luke put that Sith on the defensive but still failed to defeat him. It implies that someone of Kyle's level is not an easy opponent for Luke.
As of Koon, agree, that fight is circumstantial and doesn't prove anything.
Yeah except he didn't just kick him on the floor, and simultaneously fight off clone troopers. He also ripped his mask off. You can't just ignore that. If he didn't have a mask, that would have punch in the face. And you really don't want to be punched in the face by a physical beast like Opress.
Btw I never said he's better at dueling. Just that he's more powerful in overall close combat (Sabers included).
1. Yes, there are definitely ways of figuring out who the better duelist is. Accolades, quality of opponents fought and defeated, and so on. All areas where Maul outstrips Kyle, by the way.
2. That's nice and all but people frequently overblow this feat. He defeated seven Dark Jedi... one by one, and none of them have half-decent dueling feats to begin with. It's a good endurance feat, and it's nice that he did it with little training, but defeating opponents of such a low quality isn't putting you on par with one of the most skilled duelists in Sith history, who was more than a match for one of the most skilled Jedi in history along with his padawan, who was approaching him in skill.
3. Simply being battlemaster means little to me when we're this far up the foodchain. And Kyle being vaguely listed as an "unarmed combat expert" most certainly doesn't put him on par with Maul, who had mastered numerous martial arts as a teenager, and had mastered numerous martial arts that Sidious himself described as "exotic", which is a pretty big deal when you consider just how large the galaxy is for something to be considered exotic. That's without even mentioning his Teras Kasi, or his myriad of martial arts feats.
4. Could you be any more vague with this feat? I mean, I don't know who you're talking about or the context or anything, really, so this doesn't mean much to me either.
I'm not ignoring it, I'm just saying that it's not as simple as "Savage beat Koon" - he beat him a very specific way, so it's worth mentioning.
He isn't really a better lightsaber duelist, or at least not by much. The lightsaber duel itself that they had was even. Which is what I'm saying, Savage beat him through means other than sabers.
Fair enough. Koon actually seemed a bit better in Sabers to me as he tagged Savage's cloak.
But overall, in close combat, I still give Savage the win, simply because he did. It's very much like his win over Ventress. He didn't outduel her, her simply smacked her head and that disarmed her.
__________________ "Happiness is a lie. Life is horror. The light is always dying all across the universe. The last star will flicker out someday, when it does, all that remains is shadow. And I will be its king!"'-Amahl Farouk
Oct 29th, 2014 03:32 AM
