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Home » Star Wars » Star Wars: Literature & Expanded Universe » Star Wars Versus Forum » Novel Vitiate (Malachor + SF amp) vs. DE Sidious


Novel Vitiate (Malachor + SF amp) vs. DE Sidious
Started by: The Ellimist

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The Ellimist
The Shadow

Registered: Apr 2016
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Novel Vitiate (Malachor + SF amp) vs. DE Sidious

who wins


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Old Post May 18th, 2018 06:45 PM
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Azronger
Most Powerful Jedi

Registered: Jun 2016
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Old Post May 18th, 2018 07:12 PM
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Freedon Nadd
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Registered: Feb 2015
Location: Romania


 

For the last time: The Star Forge(itself) does not amplify your strength in the Force. It's the captive Jedi's lifeforce that reinvigorates you during a battle such as Revan's with Malak. And that heal factor is minor, barely having any effect on this duel's course.


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RealistRacism: "Sheevites, much like the Banites, were meant to increase in power with each member. From Lightsnake to Gideon to Azronger, this was supposed to be the case. However, knowledge must've been lost in some kind of Gravid-like incident, as Az turned out to be a mid-tier debater with a sub-par track record, sh!itting all over Tempest's legacy. Sad."

Old Post May 18th, 2018 07:50 PM
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AncientPower
The Chosen One

Registered: Aug 2014
Location: The balance of the Force


 

Vitiate's mere presence as a spirit denied the will of the Force across Nathema and possibly more worlds. Which in so many ways makes the vaunted Plagueis scaling for Sheev look pathetic.


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Old Post May 19th, 2018 03:37 AM
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S_W_LeGenD
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Registered: Nov 2006
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by AncientPower
Vitiate's mere presence as a spirit denied the will of the Force across Nathema and possibly more worlds. Which in so many ways makes the vaunted Plagueis scaling for Sheev look pathetic.

Good point.

Vitiate prevented recovery of Medriaas with his power all along* while partaking in other matters which included corrupting Dromund Kaas, on-shotting a Dark Council, formulating an organic network of Children and Voices and consuming Ziost respectively. When you look at these developments from a wider angle, you get the impression that Vitiate's showings are firmly above the pay-grade of any Jedi and/or Sith. This is bordering on the level of The Ones or close.

*As in literally prevented a VOID in the Cosmic Force to heal around Medriaas, preventing the recovery of the planet in turn, or a mix of both.


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Last edited by S_W_LeGenD on May 19th, 2018 at 01:42 PM

Old Post May 19th, 2018 01:34 PM
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Haschwalth
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Vitiate's presence denied the very will of the cosmic force over Medriaas for millennium.
It makes it much more believable that SOR Revan was affecting the force to such a degree passively, which caused the force to respond.

Old Post May 19th, 2018 01:59 PM
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The_Tempest
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Registered: Sep 2012
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Haschwalth
Vitiate's presence denied the very will of the cosmic force over Medriaas for millennium.
It makes it much more believable that SOR Revan was affecting the force to such a degree passively, which caused the force to respond.


Nice. Source?

Old Post May 19th, 2018 03:28 PM
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Nephthys
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Registered: Dec 2007
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Nathema Reborn
The ecological revitalization of Nathema has been nothing short of miraculous. Vibrant plant life has not only taken root but flourished, dramatically altering the planet's once-desolate landscape.

Force-users no longer experience the unsettling "wrongness" that they once felt whenever setting foot on the planet. The air has become fresher, and the weather more dynamic. That this has all occurred since the death of Valkorion cannot be a coincidence, though experts cannot agree on any precise environmental mechanism that could have brought about such an abrupt change.


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Old Post May 19th, 2018 11:25 PM
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Haschwalth
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Registered: Jul 2017
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by The_Tempest
Nice. Source?


quote:
The ecological revitalization of Nathema has been nothing short of miraculous. Vibrant plant life has not only taken root but flourished, dramatically altering the planet's once-desolate landscape.
Force-users no longer experience the unsettling "wrongness" that they once felt whenever setting foot on the planet. The air has become fresher, and the weather more dynamic.
That this has all occurred since the death of Valkorion cannot be a coincidence, though experts cannot agree on any precise environmental mechanism that could have brought about such an abrupt change.


Vitiate, was passively maintaining the Void of Nathema. Aka he was passively denying, the force's will to create life over Nathema, for millennium. Until his death.

Old Post May 19th, 2018 11:29 PM
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The_Tempest
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Registered: Sep 2012
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Haschwalth
Vitiate, was passively maintaining the Void of Nathema. Aka he was passively denying, the force's will to create life over Nathema, for millennium. Until his death.


Not since The Force Awakens has there been such a Star Wars-related letdown. Why am I supposed to be impressed by this, especially vis a vis Sidious's feats?

Old Post May 20th, 2018 01:53 AM
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AncientPower
The Chosen One

Registered: Aug 2014
Location: The balance of the Force


 

Because it means even Vitiate's spirit whilst trapped in Yavin's temples, could maintain a passive void from across the galaxy. This is his most basic of Force displays, this is as effortless as destroying T3-M4 for him. It's not even really a feat, because he's not actively doing anything.

What he was doing simultaneously was mentally dominating the Dread Masters, suppressing the Force powers of Vaylin, fueling a galaxy-wide ritual, two-shotting Tol-Braga's strike team, waging a stalemate with Sel-Makor, breaking Revan's mind, controlling the entire Imperial Guard and all of his Children, and maintaining a void in the Force over Nathema. Yet he still had massive power left to spare.

It's the wider picture Temp.


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Old Post May 20th, 2018 02:19 AM
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The Ellimist
The Shadow

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quote: (post)
Originally posted by AncientPower

It's the wider picture Temp.


Permission to sig?


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Luke Skywalker. A simple farmboy – became powerful. Now... beyond powerful.

Old Post May 20th, 2018 02:31 AM
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AncientPower
The Chosen One

Registered: Aug 2014
Location: The balance of the Force


 

Granted.


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Old Post May 20th, 2018 03:02 AM
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The_Tempest
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Registered: Sep 2012
Location: United States


 

Sidious kept the Force out of balance on a galactic scale during all his feats and shenanigans.

What’s been offered here is literally orders of magnitude less significant.

Old Post May 20th, 2018 03:34 AM
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AncientPower
The Chosen One

Registered: Aug 2014
Location: The balance of the Force


 

Except imbalancing the Force is something Nihilus and Revan are shown to nearly replicate. Though given the new quotes solidify Valkorion's death causing serious mental damage to every Force user in the galaxy, that's millions by the way, this feat isn't anywhere near beyond Valkorion.

Not that literally causing voids in the Force against its will is less impressive than having an effect on its balance.


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Within your furnace heart, you burn in your own flame. This is how it feels to be Anakin Skywalker.

Old Post May 20th, 2018 04:35 AM
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The_Tempest
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Citations needed on all of that, please.

Old Post May 20th, 2018 05:19 AM
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AncientPower
The Chosen One

Registered: Aug 2014
Location: The balance of the Force


 

The Triumvirate, including Nihilus, caused pervasive psychic misery throughout the Republic strong enough to feed on:

quote:
The Sith seemed to have achieved the victory they had long sought. Less than one hundred Jedi, nearly all of them in hiding, survived the Sith's purge. Many citizens took this unimaginable event as proof that the Force had turned malevolent, or that cosmic balance was nothing more than a story for children. Despair was palpable, and many planets offered only halfhearted and ragged defense against Sith attackers. Planets throughout the slice surrendered, and the Sith fed on the psychic misery of a shattered Republic.
- The Essential Atlas


I'll assume you're going to say that 'psychic misery' means fvck all. Well, not really:

quote:
Luke and Jaina were fighting back-to-back. The Sith attacking them had two advantages. One was the fact that they outnumbered the two Jedi. The second was that they were being reinforced by the emanations of the dark-side nexus within the temple. It surged forth like psychic sewage, clogging the Jedi's reflexes as it fueled their enemies.

Ben drew more and more heavily on the Force—it was difficult here, so close to a dark-side nexus, and it took more out of him.
- Fate of the Jedi: Ascension


For Revan, there's the fact that the mere existence of his dark side personality caused a persistent, growing 'cyst' in the very fabric of the cosmic Force. Causing the Force as a whole to 'roil' and 'convulse'. Without Revan's light half to balance himself out, this caused a major balance issue that only grew in strength as he himself did:

quote:
"The Force moves through the Emperor's Hand in a manner that few others experience. For us, the Force is an intricate tapestry woven into our very essence. That tapestry has become flawed. I speak of a persistent disturbance. A cyst, dense and tangled and unpleasant. It began small and nearly imperceptible but has been growing ever larger... the source of this basal disturbance is of the gravest concern to us..."
- The Emperor's Hand


quote:
"The Force roils and convulses like never before."
- Spindrall


It's also implied that, not only did a fraction of the Emperor's power weilded by the First Son have the capacity to shield the hundreds of extremely powerful Children scattered throughout the Republic from the senses of the Jedi Order.(Stated by Master Kaedan to be like the dark side 'screaming' through the Force when they were uncovered) But the very opening dialogue of the Decieved trailer by Darth Malgus states that the entire Jedi Order was blinded by the power of the dark side.

As far as Valkorion goes, his death sent a shockwave through the Force that threatened to knock even Satele Shan unconscious. The new codex entries only confirm that his death was felt across the galaxy by all Force users:

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quote:
Although each and every one of the Zealots felt Valkorion's death vividly through the Force, all of them refuse to believe that it has actually occurred. Wild and improbable theories about his current state of existence and how best to continue serving him have driven the zealots into forming rival, warring groups who raid and kill one another interminably.
- Nathema Zealots Codex Entry


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Within your furnace heart, you burn in your own flame. This is how it feels to be Anakin Skywalker.

Old Post May 20th, 2018 07:59 AM
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S_W_LeGenD
Senior Member

Registered: Nov 2006
Location: Earth


 

Balance of the Force is known to shift over time due to actions of living beings (Force and Destiny, 2015) - this is not much of a news anymore. Palpatine didn't imbalance the Force on his own; there is centuries-worth of history beforehand which contributed to the imbalance and Palpatine merely contributed to it (Darth Plagueis, 2012). That the Force remained out of balance during the course of rule of Palpatine isn't a big deal either because Galactic Empire was in the picture and it spanned over thousands of worlds.

In-fact, Balance of the Force is an everyday theme in SWTOR storytelling at present:-

Decide the future of the galaxy and determine the fate of your allies and enemies – your every action drives the galaxy closer to the light or dark side of the Force.

----

Valkorion prevented recovery of a VOID in the Force around Medriaas with his mere presence irrespective of where he was located for as long as he existed - a feat which is unique to Valkorion and provides ammo/context for assessing his/its power.

Valkorion's manipulation of Medriaas utterly blows Palpatine's manipulation of Byss out of water. Valkorion not only prevented recovery of Medriaas but he could determine who could function on Medriaas under such conditions; he made it possible for the Nathema Zealots among others to endure the apocalyptic conditions of Medriaas.


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Last edited by S_W_LeGenD on May 20th, 2018 at 08:18 AM

Old Post May 20th, 2018 08:12 AM
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Freedon Nadd
Senior Member

Registered: Feb 2015
Location: Romania


 

NGL - Outbalance only means when the Dark Side>Light Side. But you're essentially correct - The Old Republic Sith Lords also brought the Dark Side to rule outbalancing the harmonic nature of the Force.


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RealistRacism: "Sheevites, much like the Banites, were meant to increase in power with each member. From Lightsnake to Gideon to Azronger, this was supposed to be the case. However, knowledge must've been lost in some kind of Gravid-like incident, as Az turned out to be a mid-tier debater with a sub-par track record, sh!itting all over Tempest's legacy. Sad."

Old Post May 20th, 2018 05:35 PM
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