KillerMovies - Movies That Matter!

REGISTER HERE TO JOIN IN! - It's easy and it's free!
Home » Comic Book Forums » Comic Book Movies » Comic Books » The "canonicity" of JLA/Avengers

The "canonicity" of JLA/Avengers
Started by: zopzop

Forum Jump:
Post New Thread    Post A Reply
Pages (2): [1] 2 »   Last Thread   Next Thread
Author
Thread
zopzop
Breaker of Stone

Gender: Unspecified
Location: Limbo

The "canonicity" of JLA/Avengers

Why is this crossover NOT canon when it's referenced on panel in DC and in Handbook entries in Marvel? I actually believe it WAS referenced on panel in Marvel involving Terminus but I don't have the scan.

Here is the event in question from JLA/Avengers :
(please log in to view the image) (please log in to view the image) (please log in to view the image) (please log in to view the image) (please log in to view the image)

Here it is in Terminus' handbook entry confirming play by play what went down regarding him in JLA/Avengers :
(please log in to view the image)

Also why can't we use this as proof regarding how various characters would do vs each other between companies since this event IS canon to BOTH?


__________________



Unstoppable?

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 02:11 AM
zopzop is currently offline Click here to Send zopzop a Private Message Find more posts by zopzop Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
juggernaut74
Bigsexy

Gender: Male
Location: Death Star

Sounds good to me.


__________________

The price of fame is high and the Thing cant pay the way.

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 02:17 AM
juggernaut74 is currently offline Click here to Send juggernaut74 a Private Message Find more posts by juggernaut74 Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
abhilegend
Reborn

Gender: Male
Location: Fortress of Solitude

Here are some more bios

Photon

(please log in to view the image)

Grandmaster

(please log in to view the image)

If I wanted I can find other bios too which have described JLA/Avengers but who cares.


__________________

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 05:16 AM
abhilegend is currently offline Click here to Send abhilegend a Private Message Find more posts by abhilegend Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
Igniz
I reign supreme!

Gender: Unspecified
Location:

Because JLA/Avengers is no longer mentioned in the appendix section of Blockbusters of the Marvel Universe.Blockbusters of the Marvel Universe was published in January 26, 2011 making it more current than any of the comic books that came out.Yet the Marvel Vs DC event was mentioned stating that Earth-616 was temporarily merged with DCU on Blockbusters of the Marvel Universe.There is also a detail of a crossover there known as "Megaverse Crossovers" were Superman battled Spiderman.Yet I can't find any mention of JLA/Avengers in the appendix section for some reason.

http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums...ans/BMU_063.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums...ans/BMU_064.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums...ans/BMU_065.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums...ans/BMU_066.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums...ans/BMU_067.jpg

Note:These scans are from the Blockbusters of The Marvel Universe.I borrowed my brother's USB containing this file.So the scans aren't really mine stick out tongue


__________________

I'm the CEO of NEST!
Respect Chaos King Fear The Dread Dormammu Surtur Carnivore

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 10:23 AM
Igniz is currently offline Click here to Send Igniz a Private Message Find more posts by Igniz Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
zopzop
Breaker of Stone

Gender: Unspecified
Location: Limbo

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Igniz
Because JLA/Avengers is no longer mentioned in the appendix section of Blockbusters of the Marvel Universe.Blockbusters of the Marvel Universe was published in January 26, 2011 making it more current than any of the comic books that came out.Yet the Marvel Vs DC event was mentioned stating that Earth-616 was temporarily merged with DCU on Blockbusters of the Marvel Universe.There is also a detail of a crossover there known as "Megaverse Crossovers" were Superman battled Spiderman.Yet I can't find any mention of JLA/Avengers in the appendix section for some reason.

http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums...ans/BMU_063.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums...ans/BMU_064.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums...ans/BMU_065.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums...ans/BMU_066.jpg
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums...ans/BMU_067.jpg

Note:These scans are from the Blockbusters of The Marvel Universe.I borrowed my brother's USB containing this file.So the scans aren't really mine stick out tongue

I don't understand what this proves? It clearly states :
quote:
Megaverse Crossovers
Superman Vs. the Amazing Spider-Man (1976) Interactions between beings of different Megaverses, generally through travel from one to another, temporary (partial or complete) merging of realities and coexistence of inhabitants, and/or occurrence on Earth-7642, where counterparts of most known realities' contents exist.

Why doesn't JLA/Avengers fall into this category?

It's clearly canon according to multiple handbook entries and I believe it's even mentioned on panel involving Terminus but I haven't found the scan yet.


__________________



Unstoppable?

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 12:58 PM
zopzop is currently offline Click here to Send zopzop a Private Message Find more posts by zopzop Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
-Pr-
...

Gender: Male
Location: Ireland.

Why?

In short, because we said so.

Honestly though, too many people try to use it to the exclusion of the character feats in their own universes, and it gets ridiculous.


__________________

"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured... the first thought forbidden... the first freedom denied – chains us all irrevocably."

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 02:55 PM
-Pr- is currently offline Click here to Send -Pr- a Private Message Find more posts by -Pr- Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
zopzop
Breaker of Stone

Gender: Unspecified
Location: Limbo

quote: (post)
Originally posted by -Pr-
Why?

In short, because we said so.

Honestly though, too many people try to use it to the exclusion of the character feats in their own universes, and it gets ridiculous.

Oh I can understand if Mods don't want it on the forums cause it causes a sh|tstorm, but it IS canon to both companies no?


__________________



Unstoppable?

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 03:07 PM
zopzop is currently offline Click here to Send zopzop a Private Message Find more posts by zopzop Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
-Pr-
...

Gender: Male
Location: Ireland.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by zopzop
Oh I can understand if Mods don't want it on the forums cause it causes a sh|tstorm, but it IS canon to both companies no?


I believe, personally, that it is, yes.


__________________

"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured... the first thought forbidden... the first freedom denied – chains us all irrevocably."

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 03:10 PM
-Pr- is currently offline Click here to Send -Pr- a Private Message Find more posts by -Pr- Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
curryman
Senior Member

Gender:
Location:

I agree with PR's assessment.

Even if it's canon it's infinitely more convenient to keep any crossover-garbage off the forum.

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 04:00 PM
curryman is currently offline Click here to Send curryman a Private Message Find more posts by curryman Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
Badabing
LiZod

Gender: Male
Location: Isla Nublar

Moderator

quote: (post)
Originally posted by -Pr-
I believe, personally, that it is, yes.
Don't ever post and sentence like this again.


__________________



Sig by Rao Kal El

http///www.raptorrules.com

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 05:15 PM
Badabing is currently offline Click here to Send Badabing a Private Message Find more posts by Badabing Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
-Pr-
...

Gender: Male
Location: Ireland.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Badabing
Don't ever post and sentence like this again.


I'm sorry, was that supposed to be English?


__________________

"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured... the first thought forbidden... the first freedom denied – chains us all irrevocably."

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 06:29 PM
-Pr- is currently offline Click here to Send -Pr- a Private Message Find more posts by -Pr- Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
Digi
Forum Leader

Gender: Unspecified
Location:

Moderator

He was just too filled with bloodlust to type properly...

(please log in to view the image)


__________________

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 06:55 PM
Digi is online now! Click here to Send Digi a Private Message Find more posts by Digi Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
Rage.Of.Olympus
RIP GUY222

Gender: Male
Location: Asgard

If you believe JLA/Avengers is canon for Marvel, that's perfectly fine, many others don't. I don't think it's ever been referenced in a Marvel comic though. That being said, using handbooks for conclusive evidence is about as faulty as using them for power levels. Like I told you earlier, shit like Marvel vs. Capcom was referenced in Shuma's entry IIRC and so on.

For me, the biggest thing that swung me to my position was Busiek saying it takes place in that Hostess Pie Universe when asked about continuity. I remember there being more said and how he didn't care about current line-ups and wanted to do a classic Avengers/JLA crossover etc. but I'd have to find the quotes as it's been a while.


__________________


Last edited by Rage.Of.Olympus on Jul 29th, 2013 at 07:53 PM

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 07:47 PM
Rage.Of.Olympus is currently offline Click here to Send Rage.Of.Olympus a Private Message Find more posts by Rage.Of.Olympus Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
Galan007
|Omni-Lord|

Gender: Male
Location:

If JLA/Avengers were canon in the literal sense, then Marvel(and DC) would be able to reference it, as well as the cross-company-characters involved, directly. Instead, they have to indirectly allude to the aforementioned in their bios. Clearly this means copyright laws are still very much intact-- and if one company cannot specifically mention the event/characters without being sued by the other company, then how can it possibly be dubbed 'canon'..?

I just chalk it up to cross-company shoutouts, personally. However, I do see your point-- the events of the Silver Surfer/Superman crossover were also indirectly mentioned in a Marvel bio, but I don't know if you could consider it 'canon' for the very same reasons. /shrug


__________________


全王

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 07:48 PM
Galan007 is currently offline Click here to Send Galan007 a Private Message Find more posts by Galan007 Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
Philosophía
___________

Gender: Male
Location:

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Galan007
If JLA/Avengers were canon in the literal sense, then Marvel(and DC) would be able to reference it, as well as the cross-company-characters involved, directly. Instead, they have to indirectly allude to the aforementioned in their bios. Clearly this means copyright laws are still very much intact-- and if one company cannot specifically mention the event/characters without being sued by the other company, then how can it possibly be dubbed 'canon'..?
(please log in to view the image)

So just because, say, DC can't reference names like Galactus directly, but continue the story itself [written by the same writer who wrote the crossover, no less], then it's not canon because...they couldn't spell out Galactus?


__________________

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 08:20 PM
Philosophía is currently offline Click here to Send Philosophía a Private Message Find more posts by Philosophía Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
Galan007
|Omni-Lord|

Gender: Male
Location:

To clarify:
I don't believe Marvel and DC can legally recognize cross-company stuff as canon-- that's why they can only allude to the events and characters, but cannot mention them directly. Where the forum is concerned, however, JLA/Avengers can certainly be argued as canon to Marvel IF handbook entries qualify as irrefutable evidence-- a notion which several people would likely contest.

I don't care either way, though. I'm perfectly happy assuming that Mxy can pop-into the Marvel universe any time he chooses(as Impossible Man's bio mentions.) thumb up


__________________


全王

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 08:44 PM
Galan007 is currently offline Click here to Send Galan007 a Private Message Find more posts by Galan007 Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
TheGodKiller02
True Killer

Gender: Male
Location: Hunting with wolves

^
quote: (post)
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
That being said, using handbooks for conclusive evidence is about as faulty as using them for power levels. Like I told you earlier, shit like Marvel vs. Capcom was referenced in Shuma's entry IIRC and so on.

Debate-ender right here.


__________________

Old Post Jul 29th, 2013 09:14 PM
TheGodKiller02 is currently offline Click here to Send TheGodKiller02 a Private Message Find more posts by TheGodKiller02 Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
Igniz
I reign supreme!

Gender: Unspecified
Location:

quote: (post)
Originally posted by zopzop
I don't understand what this proves? It clearly states :

Why doesn't JLA/Avengers fall into this category?

It's clearly canon according to multiple handbook entries and I believe it's even mentioned on panel involving Terminus but I haven't found the scan yet.


Because Superman Vs Amazing Spiderman happened in a situation were the characters from DC and Marvel are interacting as if they've known each other.There was no separate universe in that crossover while JLA/Avengers, still retain the separate universe law.Ex Flash couldn't move fast in the Marvel Universe because speedforce doesn't exist there.The blockbuster of the marvel universe also clearly stated that earth-616 temporarily merged with DCU.But before the merger of Marvel and DC, fights happened there like Hulk Vs Superman,Wolverine Vs Lobo and etc.And Blockbuster of the Marvel Universe clearly states that the marvel characters that fought in that crossover are from earth-616.If that is the case, would Storm beating Wonderwoman be legit as evidence in the forums?And again, BMU is current compared to the handbooks you referenced.And since JLA/Avengers isn't mentioned in it despite crossovers like Marvel Vs DC and Superman Vs Spiderman are mentioned there only indicates that its not canonical.And Tom Brevoort also mentioned in Formspring that JLA/Avengers isn't canonical.


__________________

I'm the CEO of NEST!
Respect Chaos King Fear The Dread Dormammu Surtur Carnivore

Old Post Jul 30th, 2013 05:42 AM
Igniz is currently offline Click here to Send Igniz a Private Message Find more posts by Igniz Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
One Big Mob
All will be revealed

Gender: Unspecified
Location: Traveling both time and space

Looks like the zop is on the other foot now.

Good work everybody except zop and philzop


__________________

Old Post Jul 30th, 2013 05:52 AM
One Big Mob is currently offline Click here to Send One Big Mob a Private Message Find more posts by One Big Mob Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
comicfan11
Ocean's Heaviest Hitter

Gender: Male
Location: Throne of Atlantis

quote: (post)
Originally posted by -Pr-
I believe, personally, that it is, yes.


__________________
"King of the seas, remember?"

Old Post Jul 31st, 2013 01:14 PM
comicfan11 is currently offline Click here to Send comicfan11 a Private Message Find more posts by comicfan11 Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote Quick Quote
All times are UTC. The time now is 11:53 PM.
Pages (2): [1] 2 »   Last Thread   Next Thread

Home » Comic Book Forums » Comic Book Movies » Comic Books » The "canonicity" of JLA/Avengers

Email this Page
Subscribe to this Thread
   Post New Thread  Post A Reply

Forum Jump:
Search by user:
 

Forum Rules:
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is OFF
vB code is ON
Smilies are ON
[IMG] code is ON

Text-only version
 

< - KillerMovies.com - Forum Archive - Forum Rules >


© Copyright 2000-2006, KillerMovies.com. All Rights Reserved.
Powered by: vBulletin, copyright ©2000-2006, Jelsoft Enterprises Limited.