While superman is class 100+ strength, he fights like a slugger. Batman with class 50 has all his martial arts. Can he beat superman down? *also does anyone have any scans of the recent superman comic where he almost kills batman before wonderwoman stops him?
Using Marvel's strength stats for DC characters is folly.
Take Superman ....you said he is 100+ (and I guess that is technically accurate, since he has over a 100T lifting capability). The thing is he can lift FAR more than this.
Take for example when Martian Manhunter, WonderWoman, and Superman moved the moon to fend off an attack by White Martians.
Now, the mass of the moon (in the real world note) is 74 quitillion tons (basically 7.4, followed by 19 zeroes, tons I.E 740,000,000,000,000,000,000 tons ).
Now, assume each was moving a third of that mass.
That is 24 quitillion tons EACH (240,000,000,000,000,000,000 tons EACH)!
I'd say that is quite different from Marvel's power system whereby the ability to lift even 80 tons is taken as a considerable feat (I actually laughed when some person said yesterday that the Martian Manhunter 'starts at 80 tons.' LOL. No he doesn't).
Anyways, Batman having a strength of '50 tons' does make him able to move faster than he currently does, jump higher, throw his batarangs faster etc etc etc.
However if he wants to defeat Superman he would still have to use his mind, since physically he is still pathetically weak.
Now ....maybe if Batman could lift 2.4 quitillion tons, had heat vision, had arctic and super breaths, was invulnerable, and had superspeed that approached that of the SpeedForce .....well, then he might attempt to match Kal-El in direct physical combat.
Last edited by spetznaz on Dec 30th, 2005 at 01:42 PM
If you're talking about that All star issue with the 200 quintillion, you're forgetting he did that with one hand, and it wasn't his limit either, they just had no way of adding more pressure. The machine was maxed.
Mate total missunderstanding .... Im dislexic and so i read things in the wrong context sometimes .... No i totally agree with you .... No he needs to be powerful as DC dont really have The 'Cosmic' characters who have the power of god, but tend to go round blasting each other .... DC's Cosmic and hightier characters tend to be one and the same. As he is the most powerful, he needs to be, powerful !
100% agree.
I think that Superman needs to be ...well ....super. Exceedingly so.
And his current strength levels (i.e in the quintillion range) more than satisfy me.
I'm tired of the people who want to depower Superman to the MArvel level (read 100 tons). 100 tons lifting weight is really 'nothing' for a superhero the caliber of Superman.
For example think of it this way.
The weight of an Abrams M1A2 MBT (main battle tank) is 68.7 tons.
68.7 tons.
This means that a character with a 100 ton lifting ability would NOT even be able to lift TWO Abrams tanks!!!!!!!!!
Now, take an oil tanker.
A fully laden oil tanker can have in excess of 300,000 tons.
How in goodness name is a 80 ton character supposed to even budge such a behemoth?
Note that the largest oil tanker, which is the Knock Nevis, weighing in at 647,955 tonnes fully laden would be TOTALLY out of the range of a 100 ton character.
Thus the whole 'Marvelize Superman' thing just wouldn't work.
Superman is not a male Rogue.
Superman is not a flying Colossus.
Superman is not a red-n-blue QuickSilver.
Thus he should be far stronger than Rogue.
Far more invulnerable than Colossus.
And far faster than QuickSilver.
Superman should never be at the level of Colossus. Ever. Not even near.
And if that means being able to move the moon that is fine with me.
Last edited by spetznaz on Dec 30th, 2005 at 10:01 PM
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