As you might have guessed from the title, I'm curious to see where you put Force users in comparison to the rest of fiction. Feel free to use any metric you like but the CV method works well too ( street level: Batman and below/low tier: Spiderman and below/mid tier: Iron Man and below/high tier: Hulk and below/herald tier: Silver Sufer's the general benchmark/skyfather: Odin and below.
For me, I view Star Wars the most powerful characters as high tier-low herald. My reasoning for this is that Plagueis as of TPM ( being more powerful then Sidious ) put in more then 50% of the power necessary to shift the balance of the Force on a cosmic scale. And not just a slight shift but one that could be felt by every powerful Force user in the Galaxy. Now, some might consider this a universal feat as the Force has been confirmed to be universal but we'll stick with it being a Galactic level feat for now.
According to TFU, normally planets experience constant shifts between the Dark and Light sides and this is caused by the passive Force energy given off by the planet's population leaning torwards one or the other. Using the Milky Way Galaxy as a measuring stick, we know we have at the very least, 100 billion planets in our Galaxy. Assuming the main SW Galaxy has a similar number of planets, Sidious and Plagueis would have needed to have exceeded the passive Force energy given off by ( at the very least ) millions of planetary populations.
Consider then that Plagueis grew in power after this and TPM Palpatine was essentially an equal. Fast forward to RotS and Sidious is his confirmed superior ( likely by a fair margin ). Fast forward again to RotJ and he's collected knowledge of the Force from millions of worlds and has been draining Byss for nigh on 2 decades.
Imo, Sidious's energy manipulation should around herald tier.
This is why I don't it's far fetched to assume that he was moving at relativistic speeds in RotS. Anakin could perceive sub light fighters as dots of light yet Anakin ahd trouble perceiving Palpatine moving in combat. This isn't a one off perception feat for Force users as a Rebellion era Luke has percieved sub light fighters ( TIE's ) in motion.
"Luke reached out. The Force was here, as it was everywhere, and it was no harder to touch deep in space than it was in the swamps on Dagobah. He let it fill him. The TIE fighters suddenly seemed to be moving slower. Luke’s hands flew over the controls; he moved the stick with sharp and precise movements. Swung to his starboard and lit the lasers, double-tapped the fire button. Lines of fire lanced out and shattered one, two of the four TIE fighters. The explosion spat a hard spray of wreckage at him as Luke looped away. Shards of the destroyed TIEs sleeted against the X-wing’s transparisteel canopy, a meal and plastic hail." - Shadows of the Empire.
As I'm sure anybody reading this knows, there are many other examples of enhanced perception in SW.
As Obi Wan has dodged/blocked hundreds ( possibly thousands ) of hypersonic blaster bolts before as well the scaling for Sidious being this fast is not only precedented but supported.
The biggest argument against Force user's being this fast is of course that they would either burn themselves up moving this fast or damage their surroundings. This is of course easily explained by passive Force defenses. Starkiller was able to shield himself from the heat of atmospheric reentry without slowing or stopping his descent or affecting his surroundings. I don't see why this wouldn't function in the same manner for heat and force generated by a Force user's speed.
There's also the fact that the Force is stated to be "mystical" in the Book of the Sith by Witches like Talzin and the existence of things like Sith Sorcery which further lends credence to the "Force is Magic" dynamic.
TLDR: I think the most powerful Force user's are herald level and that the Force being "mystical" allows them a high degree of viability against bricks with weaknesses to magic.
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Last edited by UCanShootMyNova on May 1st, 2017 at 05:28 PM
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Registered: Mar 2014
Location: The Proud Nation of Kekistan
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Shadilay my brothers and sisters. With any luck we will throw off the shackles of normie oppression. We have nothing to lose but our chains! Praise Kek!
THE MOTTO IS "IN KEK WE TRUST"
Eh I tend to not really care much for who/what goes where, but got nothing better to do.
Force Users= Street High-High end(variable depending on who) realistically given The Force and what one could do with it.
Non-Force Users= Really depends on what gear they have frankly, so anywhere from Street to Mid as I see depending on what gear cause there's a ton of it which could make all the difference.
I mean you could give a Thug a set of Power armor and he'll jump up a few notches.
It wasn't a stalemate. Afterwards grevious indicated that dooku's earlier statement about how mace would put him beyond repair was correct. And the fight was incredibly brief
If anything I'd be using his wreckings of season 5 and season 6 kenobi in tcw, his ability to trash multiple council masters in ocw.
And his ability to ovderload the defenses of someone who deflected omnidirectional blaster fire from an entire army
Last edited by Rockydonovang on May 1st, 2017 at 06:42 PM
Grievous notes that Dooku was correct in the sense that he was too mechanical in his fighting style as it allowed Mace to exploit a contradiction between his sentient brain and computer brain.
The duel itself has them fighting evenly despite Grievous's hindrance. He only becomes an even more formidable opponent from analyzing Mace's fighting style which is why Mace didn't want to prolong the fight. As for how long the engagement was we know it was as long as it took for Kit and his 2 magnaguard opponents to cross over to the other side of the maglev in their fight. Since I hardly think Kit would have wanted to have been separated from Mace I imagine the progression from Mace and Grievous's location was a steady one as Kit analyzed the magnaguards fighting styles before taking them down.
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Last edited by UCanShootMyNova on May 1st, 2017 at 09:45 PM
IIRC the fight was only a couple of exchanges. And I razer arguing it was only a few seconds somewhere based on Fisto's fight with the Magna guards
I'm not really sure where you're getting they fought evenly from considering The fight had
Mace's style being too advanced(skill) for grievous to properly replicate despite his insanely fast processing speed.
Mace opted for bfr because
A. He had to save the chancellor
B. the car was about to derail
Granted grievous was hindered though there's no basis for him fighting evenly on even ground when he's only capable of occasionally pressing a dude who is at best mace's equal with a blade(Dooku).
2. So in other words, grievous being a machine limits his ability to deal with force users as skilled as mace?
And you're forgetting the part of Dooku's assessment which included that mace would make grveious into scrap beyond repair
Yes. We don't know how long those exchanges were. Sunrazer's wrong considering what I just posted. For that to be the case Fisto and the magnaguards would have had to agree to race to the other side of the maglev before they started fighting. Something that I personally do not find very likely.
He replicated the style after analyzing it for a few seconds to an extremely accurate degree, to the point that Mace didn't want to prolong it for the feat of making Grievous even more deadly.
And even if your claim were true, what would Grievous's ability to process and replicate Mace's fighting style have to do with how well they did against each other in the fight?
And because he didn't want to allow Grievous more time to replicate his form and couldn't defeat him in the time it would have taken CIS reinforcements to arrive.
Dooku is the one who trained Grievous thus giving him an inherent advantage over the general. There's also the fact that Dooku has held back certain bits of knowledge on lightsaber combat from Grievous in case he ever decided to rebel against him.
2. And how is that?
He said the same about Cin Drallig who was two shot by Anakin and he said it when he was scolding Grievous for "disrespecting" lightsaber combat with his mechanical movements. Regardless, Mace and Grievous's and duel prove Dooku's assessment generally inaccurate.
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May 1st, 2017 05:22 PM
