Doubtful. If forced, I'd have to side with LM here. But the "laughable" comment was my main sticking point. More than the other recent prep fights, I can't gift this one to the Doctor. The Time Lords as a whole, perhaps. But I always shy away from absolutes in these type of fights. To pretend we can make accurate determinations when considering reality-warping, multiversal potential requires more than a bit of hubris, imo. The Doctor's starting advantages (TARDIS) and ability to improvise better than most give him the edge over many other known prep gods. But Lucifer has no such disadvantages.
Not sure you caught the edit where I try to work through the fight. But here it is...
So like, if the Doc decided to use the Eye of Harmony to rewrite the laws of reality to benefit him and/or hurt LM, and weaponized the Heart of the TARDIS (essentially, the entirety of time and space converted to a power source) to use against LM, and managed to make the fight take place in some pocket dimension or abstract dimension outside LM's primary influence, whose properties level the playing field, or maybe the "un-space" between dimensions that is outside causal control...maybe we're getting close? But that also assumes a lopsided view of the fight, with LM doing nothing while the Doctor brings his best weapons to bear.
It would also be out of character for the Doctor, so we'd have to assume CIS is off.
Probably not. But a lot of things tend to go pear-shaped when you're in a place where the laws of reality are defined by another. A lot of this is hypotehtical, as it must be when trying to interpret how two abstract-level characters interact.
In any case, I was just outlining possible avenue(s) of victory. I wasn't saying that's the most likely outcome. As stated, I would side with LM in this thread.
So an object which can redefine the entire universe as the user see's fit will do nothing to Lucifer? I am aware that there is an argument that Michael and Lucifer created DC's creation etc but still someone like the doctor using the EOH to gain an advantage over an opponent and say that it would do squat is nonsensical, also, like digi stated, The Heart Of The Tardis is Immensly powerful, if he weaponised that and this is just a theory weaponised it to target Lucifer he has a chance imho but i was just stating he could win with the EOH.
Spite. Lucifer goes down to the awesomeness that is Quadrophenia.
__________________ What CDTM believes;
Never let anyone else define you. Don't be a jerk just to be a jerk, but if you are expressing your true inner feelings and beliefs, or at least trying to express that inner child, and everyone gets pissed off about it, never NEVER apologize for it. Let them think what they want, let them define you in their narrow little minds while they suppress every last piece of them just to keep a friend that never liked them for themselves in the first place.
I do think I outlined the best case scenario for the Doctor. I'd be shocked if LM no-sold the attacks I mentioned. But in the myriad ways this fight could go, LM wins most of them.
@Digi: Don't listen to abhi's nonsense. Lucifer has come close to(or actually been) beaten before, so it's not a question of whether the Doctor is capable of doing so or not.
Nope, the conundrum that lies here is that Lucifer isn't exactly the standard plot device omnipotent "jobber" that characters can just plot-defeat and get it over with. Lucifer is capable of overcoming great odds(and by great, I mean GREAT) even when stripped of his vast abilities. He finds a way even when there is no way, much like the Doctor himself.
This is what makes this such a hard battle to figure out.
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Oct 4th, 2013 03:49 PM
