Ok, my examples were before the Exodus, and the commandments. Did you read the rest of the Bible? The 20+ chapters that come after Exodus?
God got angry when some people complained, so he burned them alive.
Numbers 11:1 "And when the people complained, it displeased the LORD: and the LORD heard it; and his anger was kindled; and the fire of the LORD burnt among them, and consumed them that were in the uttermost parts of the camp."
God tells Moses and his people to break the 6th commandment, because a man picked up sticks on Saturday:
Numbers 15:32 - 15:36
And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day.
And they that found him gathering sticks brought him unto Moses and Aaron, and unto all the congregation.
And they put him in ward, because it was not declared what should be done to him.
And the LORD said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp.
And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the LORD commanded Moses.
God sends an angel to destroy 185,000 that haven't done anything yet:
Isaiah 37:36 Then the angel of the LORD went forth, and smote in the camp of the Assyrians a hundred and fourscore and five thousand(185,000): and when they arose early in the morning, behold, they were all dead corpses.
God created evil:
Isaiah 45:5 I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:
45:6
That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else.
45:7
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
Well, the jist of it for me is thus: If you commit ANY sin, you go to Hell, or are to be murdered by those who have been "enlightened" by God. Or he'll command you're father to kill you.
In the last one He seems to be declaring Himself like the far eastern concept of an Absolute Spirit that is beyond good and evil. Seems uncannier than a weak and envious being!
One page back, I quoted Revelations, but would you like more?
God determines who is evil before they even know about it, and then condemns them for being evil!
Jude 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
Whoa, what happens to free will here??
----------------------------------------------------
Ephesians
1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
1:5
Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will
Here it clearly says that we are without blame before him in love...but they don't mean "we", they only mean Christians, don't they? Arrogant ****ers.
----------------------------------------------------
Here, Jesus himself says that you ARE to follow the Old Testament, and that he has NOT come to change the laws. (Guess you are practicing Chritianity a little wrongly, huh?)
Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
5:18
For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
__________________
Last edited by Mr. Sandman on Oct 11th, 2004 at 08:42 PM
Fiery Eyes> “the OT is old law, when Jesus died on the cross, we are under new law: Grace, is there any place in the NT, where anything like that took place?”
So the OT doesn’t count anymore?
__________________ "Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
-Voltaire
"That includes ruining Halloween because someone swallowed a Bible."
"I just thought you were a guy."
"... Most guys do."
The OT is GREAT, has wonderful stories and experiences, and we can learn ALOT from the OT, I never said, it didn't count, what I said was WE are under GRACE now.
Its the same God who once commanded genocide that suposedly still rules the world today. Its easy to see why people can justify genocide with christianity. If there are Christians can understand this:
Numbers 31:7
So they made war against Midian, just as the LORD had commanded Moses, and they killed every male. (New American Standard Version)
they can jusify other "unchristian" actions when put in a similar situation. Many early christians viewed America as the promised land "a land flowing with milk and honey," putting them in the same situation as Moses' people in the old testament story of the exodus.
If they learned this from the OT, doesn't mean that the Bible spreads the idea of genocide as an acceptable way to protect God's people? What do you learn from that story then? How is that story supposed to be interpretted by a "good" christian?
There was sin, people making other idols and worshiping them, adultry, sorrcery ect., people were warned but took no heed to the warning, just like today, people are warned what the end of time will bring but most don't listen, don't believe it's true and go on as if there is no God.
So you think it's okay to commit genocide as long as the people you're murdering aren't Christian?
__________________ "Men curse the Communist Party, but eventually it may release them. If hell were endless, then God would be worse than our Secret Police."--Pastor Valentin
I wasn't saying there was we shld do that, i was giving an explanation for what happened at that time. We are under Grace now, no where in the NT will you find that, if you can plz let me know.
And I am willing to party with you Eöl Moriedhel, Firey Eyes, or anyone else. Although I don't think that my partying falls under what god considers either good or moral.
Hmmm, the real change of tone occurred after Jesus came and died.... perhaps the earlier version of God was "out of touch", with humanity,as quite frankly, we must all be quite different in thought and actions to a supremely powerful God, perhaps Jesus humanised him, added humanity to him, so he went from being a being that was prepared to destroy, to one that had, through the son, assimilated human values............................ the creator being remade by the creation?
__________________
From even the greatest of horrors irony is seldom absent.
KMC Community Forums
Oct 11th, 2004 04:56 PM
Ytaker agreed with me once on October 9th, 2004
