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Originally posted by Lord Urizen
.Romantic interpretation

"Jonathan Lovingly Taketh His Leave of David" by Julius Schnorr von KarolsfeldOther scholars, however, interpret the love between David and Jonathan as more intimate than friendship. This interpretation views the bonds the men shared as romantic love, regardless of whether or not the relationship was physically consummated. Jonathan and David cared deeply about each other in a way that was certainly more tender and intimate than a platonic friendship.

The relationship between the two men is addressed with the same words and emphasis as loving mixed-sex relationships in the Hebrew Testament. When they are alone together, David confides that he has "found grace" in Jonathan's eyes. Throughout the passages, David and Jonathan consistently affirm and reaffirm their love and devotion to each other. Jonathan is willing to betray his father, family, wealth, and traditions for David.

The covenant made between the two men strengthens a romantic rather than political or platonic interpretation of their relationship. At their first meeting, Jonathan strips himself before the youth, handing him his clothing, remaining naked before him. When they first make their covenant, not long after their first meeting, the reason supplied is simply because Jonathan "loved [David] as his own soul." (1 Sam. 18:3). Each time they reaffirm the covenant, love is the only justification provided. Additionally, it should be observed that the covenants and affectionate expressions were made in private, rather than publicly as would a political bond.

The fact that David refers to Jonathan as "brother" does not necessarily signify a platonic relationship. "Brother" was often used as a term of romantic, even erotic, affection in ancient Mediterranean societies. For instance, "brother" is used to indicate long-term homosexual relationships in the Satyricon (eg. 9, 10, 11, 13, 24, 25, 79, 80, 91, 97, 101, 127, 130, 133), in the poetry of Catullus (Poem No. 100) and Martial (ie. 2.4, 7.24, 10.65), and in Apuleius' The Golden Ass (8.7). "From the middle of the second millennium B.C.E. ... it became usual for commoner husbands [in parts of the Mediterranean] to call their wives 'sister'" when they were in fact not siblings [1]. For exposition, see John Boswell's Same-Sex Unions in Premodern Europe (pgs. 67-71) and Craig Williams' Yale University Ph.D. Dissertation Homosexuality and the Roman Man: A Study in the Cultural Construction of Sexuality (pg. 319).

Although David was married, David himself articulates a distinction between his relationship with Jonathan and the bonds he shares with women. David is married to many women, one of which is Jonathan's sister Michal, but the Bible does not mention David loving Michal (though it is stated that Michal loves David). He explicitly states, on hearing of Jonathan's death, that his love for Jonathan is greater than any bond he's experienced with women. Furthermore, social customs in the ancient Mediterranean basin, did not preclude extramarital homoerotic relationships. The Epic of Gilgamesh, which predates the Books of Samuel, depicts a remarkably similar homoerotic relationship between Gilgamesh and Enkidu.

�� M. K. Hopkins. (1983) "Brother-Sister Marriage in Roman Egypt." Comparative Studies in Society and History. 22 (pg. 311)
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Erotic interpretation

David and Jonathan
The Biblical account of David and Jonathan has been read by some as the story of two lovers.
"La Somme le Roy", 1290 AD; French illuminated ms (detail); British MuseumThough sex is never explicitly depicted, much of the Bible's sexual terminology is shrouded in euphemism. Numerous passages allude to a physically intimate relationship between the two men: Jonathan's disrobing, his "delighting much" in David, and the kissing before their departure. Saul accuses Jonathan of "confusing the nakedness of his mother" with David; the nakedness of one's parents is a common Biblical sexual allusion (e.g. Lev. 18:6-19; Lev. 20:11,Lev. 20:17-21; Ezek. 16:36-37; Ezek 23:10; Hab. 2:15; etc.).

Some scholars (a strong minority) insinuate innuendo in David's "bowing three times" before Jonathan and David's subsequent "exceeding" (1Sam. 20:41). It has been suggested this is a reference to oral sex and ejaculation. More socially conservative translations explain "exceeded" as "got control of himself" - others, such as the Living Bible fail to mention the kissing altogether, saying instead that they "shook hands". In fact, the Hebrew word, "gadal" for "exceeding" is translated elsewhere as a reference to "greatness". The strong minority suggest this means "until David became great" (ie. until David had an erection).

Seeing other parts of the bible referring to homosexuality may cast doubt if it concurrently portrayed such an erotic bond between the two men in a positive manner as is suggested by the romantic and erotic theories. However, since textual scholars view the passages mentioning David and Jonathan as having come from a source known as the republican source due to its anti-monarchial spin, it is possible that it was meant to refer to an erotic relationship in order to condemn David.

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Allusions to Jonathan and David
The homoerotic interpretation can be found in literature. For example, the anonymous Life of Edward II, ca. 1326 AD, has: "Indeed I do remember to have heard that one man so loved another. Jonathan cherished David, Achilles loved Patroclus." We are also told that King Edward II wept for his dead lover Piers Gaveston as:"...David had mourned for Jonathan." The playwright Oscar Wilde invoked the example of David and Jonathan in his defense of pederastic friendships.

In Renaissance art, the figure of David took on a particular homoerotic charge, as can be seen in the colossal statue by Michelangelo, in Donatello's David. In many other works, such as the paintings of Caravaggio, David is portrayed as a beautiful youth conquering a Goliath whose head is often the self-portrait of the artist, a coded expression of the artist's homoerotic attraction.

The indie rock band Belle & Sebastian's song "Jonathan David" interweaves references to the Biblical friends and/or lovers with what appears to be the "break-up" of two close male friends over a girl, with the strong suggestion that one of the male friends is in love with his chum.

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Originally posted by Alliance

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Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Yeah i knew it, nobody wants to talk about it. Just pretend it doesn't exist...

You f*cks

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Originally posted by Regret
Lol, I just believe you and those that hold this view are misinterpreting the text.

There isn't reason to debate this with you, you have shown to be too opinionated on the subject of homosexuality. You belittle those that discuss the topic with you and are often offensive with those that discuss homosexuality without agreeing with you. Many would discuss other topics with you, but most have come to the decision that the subject of homosexuality is not a worthwhile topic to debate with you. Don't insult people because you have made discussion of the topic with you of little worth to many.

I did not mean this to be offensive, just stating what the situation appears to be from my perspective.

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Originally posted by Lord Urizen
OR

People just don't wanna address the subject.

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Originally posted by Regret
Some of them probably don't, you do tend to have valid points when you are not giving in to the emotional side of your view.

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Originally posted by Lord Urizen
True

But most of the time my emotional responses are given to emotional-based answers.

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Originally posted by Regret
Lol, that is also true

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Originally posted by Regret
Lol, I just believe you and those that hold this view are misinterpreting the text.

There isn't reason to debate this with you, you have shown to be too opinionated on the subject of homosexuality. You belittle those that discuss the topic with you and are often offensive with those that discuss homosexuality without agreeing with you. Many would discuss other topics with you, but most have come to the decision that the subject of homosexuality is not a worthwhile topic to debate with you. Don't insult people because you have made discussion of the topic with you of little worth to many.

I did not mean this to be offensive, just stating what the situation appears to be from my perspective.

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Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Exxxxxxxxxactly. Friends can be friends and even love each other strongly without it crossing the line into homosexuality. I know that I have childhood homies that I love--AS FRIENDS AND BROTHERS ONLY THOUGH. Don't get it twisted.

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Originally posted by debbiejo
What bible did you get this from??????? King James, NIV?, ...........CURIOUS.

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Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah because the outcry against that place had grown great before the face of the Lord and their sin was very grave. Can you guess why God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah? I believe that homosexuality was the most prominent sin of the Sodomites and Gomorrahites. The Bible does not go into detail per se about what their grave sin was, but I believe that Genesis chapter 19 gives us a hint/clue.

The men of Sodom, both old and young all the people from every quarter, surrounded Lot's house.They called to Lot and said to him, "Where are the men [they were angels in human form] who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us that we may know them [i.e., commit sodomy with].

So, I believe that this was the grave sin that God referred to in Genesis 18:20. There were other sins but I believe that this one was perhaps most abominable.

2 Peter 2:6-8
6 and turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes, condemned them to destruction, making them an example to those who afterward would live ungodly; 7 and delivered righteous Lot, who was oppressed by the filthy conduct of the wicked 8 (for that righteous man, dwelling among them, tormented his righteous soul from day to day by seeing and hearing their lawless deeds)�