For the most part Christianity is a big part of American conservatism. Most of the conservatives I know are more interested in small government than religion. Still, rhetoric involving religion is more prominent among conservative groups and pundits than liberals.
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Graffiti outside Latin class.
Sed quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
A juvenal prank.
If we go by anecdotes, Christianity is central to the conservative American. Alas, I don't have actual statistics. Logic dictates, however, that the majority will be Christians.
It is the basis for the ideology it seems. I'm studying Southern rhetoric right now so I've been up and down this convo many times. If someone doesn't get into it later, I'll cover it but I'm lazy right now .
__________________ "Where ignorance is bliss, 'tis folly to be wise." - Thomas Gray
I will just say a few things to get the ball rolling rather than attempt to cover the entire thing.
First let me mention that I am only 21 years old. I consider myself a moderate thinker. Two years ago, I thought I was a liberal but as some things have changed, I found myself becoming more and more conservative politically, musically, etc. I would be willing to argue that part of being "conservative" is a belief that things should be a certain way or should not be changed wildly that we forget it's purposes; however, these things can be taken to an extreme which then results in a group simply making up things to preserve a false memory or to excuse irrational behavior.
Religion is one of those things that is often used to make very blanket statements about how life should be lived and the way you should swing your vote. History (or it's misrepresentation) is also used to sway groups of people. History affects culture, culture controls rhetoric (direct or indirect).
For example, there is this republican who I can't think of for the life of me who ran for reelection as a senator in 2008. A Native American was videotaping one of his town hall meetings or something like that waiting on him to say something stupid on tape. The idiot senator then looks at the Native American (who is obviously holding a camera) and calls the guy a "caca" or some variation of that word (a derogatory term for Native Americans and means "shit" in Spanish). Rhetorically speaking, it was the senator's way of reaching out to the "real" (speaking to the culture) voters in a way the rest of the public might not understand. So of course the video was published and he lost, but this is an example of how this persist today.
*I'm sure someone knows about this and can find the video but I gotta do some work for this damn Geology lab now...
__________________ "Where ignorance is bliss, 'tis folly to be wise." - Thomas Gray
Ever since traditional conservatism, pre-American, religion was seen as a necessary part of society because it was meant to provide social services and an additional structure of social order in a society. The difference between traditional conservatism and the American conservatism that emerged during the cold war on the heels of people such as Rousas Rushdoony, Billy Graham, and James Kennedy, is that traditional conservatism did not prescribe any specific faith as long as the church worked in tandem with the state whereas American Christian conservatism specifically prescribes a form of charismatic protestant Christianity which tends to reinforce American conservative social and economic policies regardless of biblical doctrine on one end of the spectrum while advocating theocracy or even Dominionism (basically, Christian Fascism) on the far end of the spectrum.
__________________ Land of the free, home of the brave...
Do you think we will ever be saved?
In this land of dreams find myself sober...
Wonder when will it'll all be over...
Living in a void when the void grows colder...
Wonder when it'll all be over?
Will you be laughing when it's over?
I could easily argue that the Christian conservatism you mention existed and was used way before the cold war. Any discussions of slavery (political and literary) were dominated by religious undertones before the middle of the 19th century when slavery became the American problem rather than Native Americans specifically.
It would be very difficult to explain on a purely secular level why poor white citizens of the U.S. would be for slavery when, at the very least, it insured less jobs for them. There are loads of examples where politicians and scholars up until the 1960s openly used the Bible as proof that equal rights or any mix of races was immoral and against God's will.
__________________ "Where ignorance is bliss, 'tis folly to be wise." - Thomas Gray
That's splitting hairs and actually has to do with religious and political factions.
I was simply stating that in traditional conservatism, the roll of the church is to provide further social order as well as maintain schools, hospitals, social welfare etc.
Financially, it means that people are obligated to pay taxes to the government, which in this case typically meant a monarchy with or without a parliament which provides law enforcement and defense in exchange (judicial rights were typically pay per use affairs). The church collected tithes through shaming/social pressure or fees through services or the selling of indulgences, typically from the poor or middle class (or the pre-bourgeoisie service/banker/merchant class) which it then used to pay tributes to government and either a central church, Rome, or the head of the orthodox church (be it Moscow or Constantinople). What was left-over was used for financing schools, often run through monasteries-many of which also did some of the leading scientific research of the day, hospitals and orphanages, the upkeep of cemeteries, and some limited support for the poor through tax payments or debt relief.
All in all, a pretty inefficient system which would be made even more ass-backwards today if applied in an Dominionst system. Dominionists believe in prosperity gospel which nearly every other religious movement views as a heresy so bye-bye to any support for the poor or unemployed right there.
__________________ Land of the free, home of the brave...
Do you think we will ever be saved?
In this land of dreams find myself sober...
Wonder when will it'll all be over...
Living in a void when the void grows colder...
Wonder when it'll all be over?
Will you be laughing when it's over?
Re: How big a part is religion to the conservative ideology?
The two usually go hand in hand, but it's not always necessary for one to exist with the other in certain people. I know plenty of atheistic conservatives.
Registered: Nov 2003
Location: Welfare Kingdom of California
I believe you can separate yourself from religion in the conservative field. It isn't very difficult as an independent to do it...but the conservative keeps the one governement under God very tight. Many third world countries in Central and South America cannot separate themselves from religion and govenment. Mostly because it is embeded in the culture...but still there are countries like Cuba and Venezuela that broke from it.
Re: Re: How big a part is religion to the conservative ideology?
hi...
also, many conservatives come from other religions
anyways, a better question might be about the role of religion in all American politics. No supposedly liberal candidates can run as someone without religion, if it isn't so explicit in their political ideology (though, they make similar appeals to divine truth and justification).
Also, a good question would concern the influence of religion even though terms might be hidden in secular rhetoric.
They didn't break from it. Cuba tried to get rid of Christianity and Venezuela is ruled by an autocrat. It's not a system that should be enshrined. Argentina and Suriname both have greater religious freedom than either of those countries.
Because you know, "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone" is a liberal plant, Capitalism is ordained by God who is male and has only one name and who commanded Jesus, who wasn't a Jew but was Aryan and born of pure Nordic Blood and fought against the evil of the Jews, to encourage incorporation among the money changers in the temple, God forever cursed the "mud races" as a plague on humanity, and the golden rule is "Do as I say, not as I do, now give me all your money and kill yourself".
__________________ Land of the free, home of the brave...
Do you think we will ever be saved?
In this land of dreams find myself sober...
Wonder when will it'll all be over...
Living in a void when the void grows colder...
Wonder when it'll all be over?
Will you be laughing when it's over?
Registered: Jun 2005
Location: Southern Oregon,
Looking at you.
There are people out there who have conservative ideas, but are not Christian. For example: I have a lot of conservative ideas, but I am a Buddhist. However, the conservatives I know, think I'm liberal.
I was referring to committing what would typically be referred to as heresy in order to justify a political belief. The oldest example I can think of in the 20th century is prosperity Gospel.
And as usual, if you had bothered to read my first post, you would note that I made that exact point when I described the difference between traditional conservatism and American conservatism, specifically Christian Conservatism.
__________________ Land of the free, home of the brave...
Do you think we will ever be saved?
In this land of dreams find myself sober...
Wonder when will it'll all be over...
Living in a void when the void grows colder...
Wonder when it'll all be over?
Will you be laughing when it's over?
Oct 1st, 2009 05:23 AM
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