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Ascertain the fate of The One
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The Omega
Z10N0101

Gender: Female
Location: Denmark

Ascertain the fate of The One

(Thread heading compliment of Burlyman).

So: What really DID happen to Neo? Just as the question of just what DID happen to the Matrix is open for debate, so is the fate of Neo.

At the very end, when Neo is being carried off by the Machines, we see a shot of his body glowing brightly in the shape of a lotus-blossom.

The symbolism of the lotus in Buddhism is that it represents the ordinary person, who is born and raised in an environment which may contain a lot of questionable ways, morals and principles, but has the potential to learn and creatively rise above its environment. If it rises high enough, then it reaches the surface and can fully realise the potential of life.

According to Hinduism, within each human inhabiting the earth is the spirit of the sacred lotus. It represents eternity, purity and divinity and is widely used as a symbol of life, fertility, and ever-renewing youth.

The cynic could say, that the glow was an “after-effect” of the energy, the machines shot through Neo’s body (just like when you heat up a pot of hot water, and remove it from the plate, the pot and water will still be warm for some time).

So, did neo transcend to a “higher state” of being? And what does THAT mean within the Matrix Universe? Because we’re not dealing with a move ON Hinduism and Buddhism, but a film that borrows from… everything (even the Trainman kept looking at his watches and ran like the rabbit from Alice in Wonderland).
So what does it mean? If anything?

Also: Is THIS a coincidence (From M1)
(please log in to view the image)


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Last edited by The Omega on Nov 12th, 2003 at 12:51 AM

Old Post Nov 12th, 2003 12:49 AM
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furryman
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Omega> Councillor West said it happy


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Old Post Nov 12th, 2003 12:51 AM
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furryman
honky

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where di smith end up? -the source..


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Old Post Nov 12th, 2003 01:10 AM
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SimplePriest
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Omega, what do you see in that picture? I mean "is what a coincedence?"


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Old Post Nov 12th, 2003 01:38 AM
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rysdigital
the end has come

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Location: Netherlands

it looks exactly like how the smith's were destroyed at the end of revolutions.


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Old Post Nov 12th, 2003 01:41 AM
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furryman
honky

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in rev, was the epicentre of it their eyes


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Old Post Nov 12th, 2003 01:44 AM
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The Omega
Z10N0101

Gender: Female
Location: Denmark

SimplePriest> I’m referring to the white light that’s breaking Agent Smith up. Isn’t it exactly the same lights and patterns we see at the end of Revolutions? That didn’t exactly kill Neo, did it?
I also suddenly recall the scene, where Trinity’s picked Neo up from Mobil Avenue, and they’re driving in the old black Cadillac trough the city. The people at the Hammer cannot SEE Neo. Why? They see SOMETHING, but not him. What’s that all about?


__________________
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
-Voltaire
"That includes ruining Halloween because someone swallowed a Bible."


"I just thought you were a guy."
"... Most guys do."

Old Post Nov 12th, 2003 03:28 PM
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xeous
The Next.

Gender: Male
Location: United States

Also, is that the same street that they are driving down(When the Hammer can't see him) in M1 where he says, "I used to eat at that place...Really good noodles."?


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Old Post Nov 12th, 2003 03:31 PM
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JediHDM
Jedi of the Matrix

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Omega> YES!! It is the same, which is the point..."everything that has a beginning has an end". And yes, i believe Neo has ascended, which means that matrix has become a "heaven on earth", in that, the beginning of the matrix was perfect, by creation, but the end of the matrix will be perfect by choice...let me say it this way...

Smith killed Neo, creating the ONE
Neo killed Smith, creating the ZERO-virus
Smith copied over the ONE, creating balance...most would say neo died, the one died, however...
the ONE DESTROYED Smith, meaning the ONE is still alive. which leads me to think that, since the ONE must be IN a person, the PERSON must, also, be alive, meaning, Neo is alive, which is why his body is glowing, and looks like a lotus-blossom, because Neo, a normal man, has become divine.


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Old Post Nov 12th, 2003 04:52 PM
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The Omega
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Gender: Female
Location: Denmark

JediHDM> And then we have to translate all of that to the Matrix movies. Let me see if I can explain this smile
There ARE all kinds of religious references! REFERENCES being the keyword there. Neo IS not Buddha, or Jesus, or Mohammed or Orpheus… Just like the Mero Isn’t Hades. But the references are tools for interpretation. Like the Karma/Purpose reference used my Rama-Kandra on Mobil Avenue.
It’s, for example, possible that Neo didn’t die because of the anti-virus, and the Speak-machine was talking to him when saying “IT is done”. But that Neo chose do DIE, because he had nothing more to live for.
But if the anomaly was NOT returned to the Source it’s Neo-version could conceivably still be around. But WHY would this “transcended” program chose to return?


__________________
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
-Voltaire
"That includes ruining Halloween because someone swallowed a Bible."


"I just thought you were a guy."
"... Most guys do."

Old Post Nov 12th, 2003 05:00 PM
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JediHDM
Jedi of the Matrix

Gender: Male
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Perhaps Neo had to choose to die to live...perhaps, if he had fought to the death, he would have just died, and Smith woulda been killed that way (im not saying its true, just conjecture) then perhaps the fact that Neo used his choice allows the Matrix to become better than before. I mean, if it weren't better, why did the Architect leave his cubicle? (box? cubicle? box?) I mean, wouldn't he stay in there, ad infinitum? Perhaps, this transcended Neo (i'm not gonna say program) chose to return to help ensure his choice was not in vain.


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FOR THE MOTHERLAND!!
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Old Post Nov 12th, 2003 05:04 PM
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((The_Anomaly))
2003 Super Senior Member

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i think that the hammer cannot tell thats its neo because his "mind" is now completly the anomaly and there is absolutly no physical essence to hima at all, i came up with this from things in reloaded (when neo is flying to the freeway scene) link says "what is that?" and at the end when he is flying morpheus says "whats that?" link says that he doenst know what it is but its moving faster then anything that hes ever seen, so i think that as neo uses the anomaly more it overtakes his "physical" presence allowing him to do thigs that are nearly impossible....thats my take on it anyways..


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Old Post Nov 12th, 2003 06:12 PM
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((The_Anomaly))
2003 Super Senior Member

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to continue the anomaly overtakes the physical essence of neo as he exerts his abilities....or something like that......just to clarify...............


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Old Post Nov 12th, 2003 06:14 PM
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The Omega
Z10N0101

Gender: Female
Location: Denmark

JediHDM> But think about the cycles (reincarnations). Neo’s supposed to be the “second coming” of The One (well, the fifth One, but Morpheus and co. didn’t KNOW that). That essentially deals with reincarnation. Returning because your purpose had not been fulfilled.

I can’t remember who brought this up, but someone asked, if the Oracle told Trinity, not only that she would fall in love with the One, but that she would die for him? The Oracle does tell Neo, that either HE or Morpheus would die. So there is a MESS to interpret here.
Did the Oracle refer to Neo’s death and resurrection at the end of M1, or his death now, at the end of Revolutions. OR his death at the end of Reloaded (remember, Neo’s died three times now)?
Again, Trinity is granted some 24 extra hours to live (And this reminds me of Sartre’s “Les jeux sont faits” brrrrrr), because she’d not said what she meant to say, when she was shot falling from the window.
Is his purpose fulfilled? The lotus blossom would seem to indicate that. Unless Trinity can somehow be “restored” his heart is free and so is his mind.
But WHY couldn’t the Hammer-crew see him when they drove around town after Mobil Avenue? That Morph/Link couldn’t see him in Reloaded, was most likely due to the speed with which he flew.


__________________
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
-Voltaire
"That includes ruining Halloween because someone swallowed a Bible."


"I just thought you were a guy."
"... Most guys do."

Old Post Nov 12th, 2003 11:32 PM
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priestjim
Grovda

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Location: Athens,Greece

Omega> Speed has nothing to do with the pattern of code that matches a person, Neo in this case. And I don't remember anyone being able to see Neo inside the Matrix after he got out of Archie's room.
* Is this a 9 I am seeing in the Smith picture? *
The first time Neo destroyed Smith but only the Smith that was there in the hallway. Smith wasn't completely destroyed. Only his kareer stick out tongue He had his agent abilities removed (like the earphone). And he had chosen excile instead of deletion. (But doesn't that sound funny? Programs having a choice?). Now somehow Smith found out that some of Neo's One code was appended/overwritten to his code and that he has some special abilities like copying himself. But Neo had taken purpose from Smith (the agent "job"). So Smith wanted appart from getting out of the Matrix (for some reason) to revenge Neo. So he had become dangerous for the system itself. And for Smith to be destroyed once and for all the machines should connect to Smith through Neo and delete him. Now remember that the Oracle, Sati and Seraph survived after Smith was destroyed? They were programs (I don't know if normal human beings survived) and so was the One!. So Neo should have survived at least as a program inside the Matrix. The One with Thomas Anderson's touch smile


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Old Post Nov 13th, 2003 12:10 AM
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SimplePriest
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Omega, I'm confused embarrasment


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Old Post Nov 13th, 2003 12:30 AM
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The Omega
Z10N0101

Gender: Female
Location: Denmark

Priestjim> ?? Yes, that DOES look like a nine. It better not be, or we’ll have to interpret that, too! big grin
We don’t KNOW if speed has something to do with the code Link/Morpheus sees or not. Maybe it has, maybe it has not.
Just Like Neo was not ready to die, or Trinity, so the same seems to go for Smith, who felt “compelled to stay. Compelled to disobey.” But the program WAS deleted, the shell too, was completely destroyed. It just didn’t return to the Source (like when I delete stuff here, it FIRST goes to the trashcan, and only when I delete it THERE it’s gone. Or well… If you’re clever enough NOTHING is ever truly gone).
Yes, Smith wanted OUT of the Matrix, so he set out to make it crash by infecting all of it. And yes, he wanted REVENGE.
Oh, the human avatars that were affected survived, too. Otherwise the machine-world would collapse instantly through lack of energy. Avatars are programs.
Did Neo survive inside the Matrix? That’s the question. Could he? Yes. WOULD he???

SimplePriest> About what? Ask! (Wears Oracle wig)


__________________
"Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities."
-Voltaire
"That includes ruining Halloween because someone swallowed a Bible."


"I just thought you were a guy."
"... Most guys do."

Old Post Nov 13th, 2003 12:51 AM
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SimplePriest
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Gender: Male
Location: United States

embarrasment What happened to Neo? If my friends knew that I was this clueless they'd all lose hope. I'm the one they come to for all their Matrix guidance, and I have to say that after Revolutions, I'm thouroughly Confused embarrasment

How did he kill smith?? Did his code return to the source?? Why couldn't they see him?? Why can't the matrix Reload without the One returning to the source?? Why? Why? Why do you persist... oops eh-hrmm. That slipped out. And is this bugger Dead or Alive???

uggghhh, I can't believe it. I'm a true fan, and I'm lost


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Old Post Nov 13th, 2003 01:04 AM
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Sifer

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Smith was deleted. He had the choice to refuse or not for the 2nd time, but this time he couldn't understand the choice, so therefore could not see his demise smile


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Sifer

Old Post Nov 13th, 2003 01:12 AM
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SimplePriest
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He ( do you mean Smith) had the choice to refuse or not... (refuse what)

sorry... I am very much Simple today embarrasment


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Old Post Nov 13th, 2003 01:14 AM
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