Plot Induced Stupidity, or PIS, is when characters don't use their abilities or skills to the fullest extent as shown before, even within their personality ranges, for the sake of the story plotline. It makes lesser powered characters an actual challenge against higher powered characters in the comics. Examples of PIS include Flash stories lasting longer than three panels, or Toy Man as a threat to Superman."
if you think one of them was not using his full potential (as opposed to greatly surpasing it) feel free to point it out .... after that you should ignore it to your hearts content
But couldn't I say. . . Claim some point that someone brings up claim its a PiS because it doesn't match up to my own self preconcived vision of what that other point is, then brush it off as if it never happened?
Rather than accepting it and explaining why it happened and hope that it gets' retconned?
I mean good and bad are subjective, so while something might seem like it's bad to one person, it might be good to another person. . .
So I could claim something was bad writing and ignore it if it doesn't agree with my preconceived notion of what it should be?
you could claim Spider-Man sticking to a wall or Wolverine being able to cut through butter is PIS if you want..... but unless you back it up with something.... a bio.... other instances.... whatever.... then not many people will think much of it..... and the whole debate aspect goes out the window and the forum becomes a bunch of posts saying
"Wolverine wins 'cos i think he's cooler"
if you know something that is being used in an argument is beyond the characters abilities then point it out..... such as Batman knocking the wind out of the Hulk..... just try to show reasons for your opinion and everybody will be cool with it
are you in the same forum I am? even when some things are backed up with other instances people still go "That was a PiS" and brush it off. . . even when it happens all the damn time. . .
Because everything is based on stats of one person not factoring in the strength's of the other side.
Wolverine has been attributed with the status of "superhuman" in another thread. Because he has super human strength (Maximum peak human enhanced by his adamantium skeleton) and a healing factor, and has reacently been able to rip out of spidey's webbing.
Plus Spiderman is being triple teamed here. he has to fight three at once. . .
Wolvie breaking out of Spidey's webbing is, for lack of better word, crap. The webbing itself has been compared to steel cable by the likes of Rogue, documented to be strong enough (according to how much is used) to trap the Thing for life, heck, Spidey himself has been entangled in the webbing and was rendered unable to pull free. And please, please, don't tell me you'd actually believe that Spidey is stronger than either of these characters. Either the strength of the webbing has been underplayed or Wolvie's strength overplayed.
What you're not factoring in are the possibilities of what one with Spidey's intelligence and experience as well as his abilities could do without morals to hold them back. Wolvie's been attributed with the status of superhuman? In the case of Ultimate Wolvie, yes, I'd say so. But as far as 616 Wolvie goes, no upgrade has indicated him capable of a superhuman strength type physical capacity. The only superhuman attributes he possesses would be his healing factor and endurance. Yes, at times he may be able to lift more than what he normally could, but it would have to be during a time of desperation or great stress. Otherwise, unless his strength was upgraded or he worked out ALOT, as of now he'd probably be within or on even terms with Captain America in terms of strength. Wolverine was NOT a peak human before the surgery that gave him his adamantium skeleton, nevertheless, it was the skeleton itself that gave him strength at the peak of human ability.
And when it comes to Spidey being triple teamed, Spidey can use ALOT more than just his superhuman strength to compensate for the numbers game. His speed advantage could allow to locate the two weaker links (Cap. A. and DD) who are susceptible to a one punch finisher before they could even completely react. When it comes down to what DD and Cap A. could do offensively or defensively, any methods they could try and execute could easily be eliminated/disposed of quickly courtesy of Spidey's physical advantage and good sense. That only leaves Wolvie. There are many methods to take care of Wolvie that are within Spidey's physical capacity: throw Wolvie a few miles, tie Wolvie and/or suffocate Wolvie with webbing, mulekick Wolvie a few miles, pin Wolvie under a car, tie Wolvie up with webbing and slam him hard and repeatedly into a wall, etc, etc. Spidey wins the day.
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Thanks for the sig TWelling4ever, go on, take a bow!
So spiderman telling Wolverine he wasn't holding back doesn't mean anything? To boarrow a mannerism from jinzin "pfft". And spidey being controlled so he wasn't holding back against DD also means nothing? again [jinzin]pffft[/jinzin]
You seem to have trouble handling comics and events that shine a posative light on any of spideys opponents and shines a darker light on spidey than you've worked up.
"Spiderman punched Wolverine and it didn't know him out!"
"Spiderman was holding back"
"Spiderman said he wasn't"
"It was crap writing so it didn't happen."
You also seem to have trouble accepting the fact that spider,an has yet to one punch ANY of the trio.
He's tried, and failed, what makes you think that he even CAN anymore?
"Because it's pis/cis if he doesn't!"
"So you're ignoring the attributes of his enemys?"
wolverine strength is a a superhaman level 1 look at the new hand books. if u are to lazy to do that read th new agent of shield were wiloverine ripps off his mettal holding with ease and then kills about a hundred or more super villains. wolverine vs spiderman is a much betetr idea then this bull shit. but in the end wolverine vs spiderman wolverien takes the win. also if any of u even try that spdierman can ko wolverine in a punch u know nuthing about comics. wolverine taken punches form spiderman with a smile on his face. and he is quick enough to hit spdierman as it been shown in there second fight and in the msot recent spiderman comic and also in there first fight
"Spiderman punched Wolverine and it didn't know him out!"
"Spiderman was holding back"
"Spiderman said he wasn't"
"It was crap writing so it didn't happen."
you're my hero creshock....
__________________ "damn jinzin, you're a real trooper, you provde fact after fact and pages and pages of proof and these wanton miscreants just keep at it"~MERC
Gender: Male Location: Kicking pigs out of the screen.
Creshok, I love the trio, I truly do, and I have put what they do into great consideration, but, I don't feel that Spidey is. All i hear is that he is triple teamed.
The reason I used the Aliens vs. Predator example is because I wanted you to have a rough idea of the speed of an aggressive all out Spidey, that plus his Strength, Pre-Cog, Agility, Webbing, ETC. makes him much more ferocious than the awsome aliens.
Let's put it this way, three highly trained fighter's wont stand a chance against a fully grown, beserk Polar Bear, Since His Power and Speed and ferocity simply overwhelms the latter.
Gender: Male Location: Kicking pigs out of the screen.
Good point Jinzin, I agree with you on the crap writing point. It isn't a valid argument since it exists, but we really can't do anything about it. It's kinda like pointing a finger and saying, HE DID IT!
I'm not worried though. Spidey has had many awesome victories under his belt where straight out violence wasn't the answer. He had to let the little evil go for the big evil, and it some of it is still on our minds.
For that and what was mentioned earlier, I BELIEVE that Spidey takes the belt.
Gender: Male Location: Kicking pigs out of the screen.
Also Wolvie8888, yes wolverine is awesome,yes he CAN hit spiderman, the funny part is you dont even need all of you strength to incapacitate someone.
You seriously believe a man who stopped a speeding train can't incapacitate another man with a nigh-indestructable skeleton. Who said he had to hit the skeleton!? Let me give you some combat knowledge I got from basic training. Props to wolvie
THroat: gagging, hemorraging
Area underneath the sternum:Pass out, incapacitate
Kidneys: death from internal bleeding
Neck: Causes intense pain and lack of movement for minutes.
Anything in the stomach: is a dead giveaway
An unpulled punch from spidey is capable to do any of these easily, especially to the other combatants. Only minimal strength is required though.
Spiderman and wolverine HAVE fought on at least three different occasions. Spider man has NEVER been able to one punch wolverine. Spiderman has SAID that he was NOT holding back against wolverine. Wolverine was taking full powered spider punches and was still concious, and not just barely concious either, he got spiderman pinned with his fists under spiderman's neck.
Spidey doesn't have the healing factor, that you seem to be over looking, that wolverine does.
And he also went full out against Spiderman, not fighting to the best of his abilities because he was being controlled, but fighting in an out of his character nmanner he was NOT holding back then either.
You want to apply real world physics? Why doesn't spiderman hurt his hand when punching adamantium? It'd be like a normal person punching steel.
Gender: Male Location: Kicking pigs out of the screen.
Firstly, I said that it would be like 3 HUMANS fighting a beserk polar bear. THEY would lose no matter their physical training. A polar bear is just too much.
READ CAREFULLY (I try to spell and punctuate perfectly so people won't put words in my mouth, something some of the trio supporters like to do, don't worry i read this WHOLE thread before I replied.)
There's been many situations where it swing to both favors. SPIDERMAN AND WOLVERINE ARE icons, they are fast moving and good fighters to pin head to head. Noone wants to see one floor the other easily.
I NEVER SAID THE HEALING FACTOR WAS NEGATEDa, only that is overrated and that aN ADRENALINED SPIDEY could incapacitate him easily. Without the webbing.
You seem to be ignoring the fact that wolvie is the Most Overrated character in the marverl universe, I know people who think he can beat professor X and Magneto at the same time. Why, "because he heals himself."
STATS ON WOLVIE:
STRENGTH: ENHANCED HUMAN (PEAK HUMAN ABILITY, at most he could probably fling a pool table with ease.
SPEED: ENHANCED HUMAN (Peak Human Ability) Can outrun olympic runners,same with agility.
DURABILITY: Superhuman, need i go on about this?
Sorry, "bub" but wolverine is overrated. Love the character hate the misconceptions about his limits. One minute he gets floored by a punch from cyclops, next he beats magneto, WTF???
Bottom line, People with superhuman strength can get overpowered, people with super speed can be overwhelmed, people with super brains get tricked, AND PEOPLE WITH SUPER DURABILITY CAN GET KNOCKED OUT!!!
Next time before becoming vulgar with me, consider reading more carefully so I won't have to reiterate myself and make you look blind.
P.S If wolverine's skeleton is that thick, strong, heavy and durable to the point where spiderman would hurt his hand hitting it after he breaks concrete's, buildings, and such, wolverine wouldn't be strong enough to support himself.
KMC Community Forums
May 23rd, 2005 03:06 AM
are you in the same forum I am? even when some things are backed up with other instances people still go "That was a PiS" and brush it off. . . even when it happens all the damn time. . .
"damn jinzin, you're a real trooper, you provde fact after fact and pages and pages of proof and these wanton miscreants just keep at it"~MERC
