Yes, well. I meant an evil or possessed J'onn that was still substantially J'onn, just unhinged and not afraid to violate his friend's mind. Didn't really mean Fernus. But I see what you thought you saw I did there.
Just citing examples that I can remember, Supes and MM have fought at least four times in comic book history.
1- Pre-Crisis: Supes defeated MM to obtain a key that MM was protecting.
2- Post-Crisis: Supes killed MM during a fight that took place during the Armageddon 2001 storyline.
3- Post-Crisis: Spear of Destiny storyline. Supes falls under the influence of the Spear of Destiny and pretty much takes out all of Earth's heroes, including MM.
4- Post-Crisis: MM as Fernus incapacitates Supes and most of the JLA.
Unless I'm missing any other confrontations, Supes won three out of those four tussles. On top of that Supes has fought enemies that manhandled MM: Asmodel the Bull Host Angel (whom he defeated) and Despero (whom he fought evenly).
Also, if memory serves Supes said J'onn was "one of the most powerful beings on the face of the earth". Not the most powerful.
Simply put, I've never seen MM accomplish the kind of feats that Superman has: moving planets, moons, etc. Nor has he displayed Supes durability or heart in combat. So, I think Supes takes this, maybe not every single time but he'll win far more often than he looses.
Ostrander had Martian Manhunter take on the entire JLA, including Superman.
This was MM as he should've been written all along, morphing limbs out of nowhere and actually using his versatility, and he did quite well for himself.. But no major one vs one tussles or anything. Still, Ostranders run gave some solid arguments for why MM should really own Supes.
However, a white martian had Supes dead to rights by engulfing and smothering him, and HV doesn't create fire in and of itself so that wasn't saving him. In the end, it was the fire from Earths core that saved him, but MM is smart enough to avoid that...
There's also one issue where MM had Ultraman basically defeated and immobilized.. Wish I know the issue. Been looking for that one for awhile..
"Ostrander had Martian Manhunter take on the entire JLA, including Superman.
This was MM as he should've been written all along, morphing limbs out of nowhere and actually using his versatility, and he did quite well for himself.."
Many comic book characters suffer from amnesia of their abilities. MM is not special in that regard. How many times has Superman merely forgotten to move at super speed to avoid an attack? There was even a ridiculous storyline in the Superman books where Mongol Jr. trained Supes to use more than one ability at the same time. Are you kidding me??? By that point in time Supes had been doing the hero thing for over ten years and that possibility never occurred to him???
I wonder if Lois has to remind him to flush the toilet when he's done.
Nice stuff, and that's when Mongul one shots Supes.
The power gulf seemed a lot higher between them pre crisis.. I think post crisis, if MM was written as more than a one dimensional brick, it'd be a good fight.
You know, instead of trying to tank Supes best punch, maybe actually phase shift. Maybe extend a limb a little to catch him off guard, or grow a few extra limbs.. Maybe even go invisible. With Supes senses, it wouldn't throw him off like it might other characters, but every little bit helps...
In an arena fight, I'm a fan of the psi attack, physical knockout tactic. Superman can resist mind attacks, but even he'd be hard pressed to avoid getting knocked out while resisting one...
I agree that MM has been woefully underwritten and underused in the past. I've always liked him better when he wasn't written as a green Superman knockoff.
Unfortunately, comic book characters are not always written properly. Batman is a prime example of this. Whenever he's in the JLA books they augment him so much to make him relevant that they make him nigh perfect. I mean having him take out a group of villains (White Martians) when the other league members are struggling to deal with one each is crazy.
"Maybe even go invisible. With Supes senses, it wouldn't throw him off like it might other characters, but every little bit helps..."
J'onn tried that during their fight in Armageddon 2001. He went invisible but Supes just listened for his heart beat to find him and then the ass beating began.
On a separate note, I've always wondered why Supes didn't develop some form of telepathic ability. If yellow sunlight augments his physical abilities why does it not do the same to his brain? I mean more than just giving him a photographic memory and super speed memorization.
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Feb 6th, 2009 08:27 PM
