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If Sauron regained the One Ring...
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^^[leane]
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Some_Black_Guy
Whoa, who's that girl in your avatar? big grin


hein ??


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Old Post Oct 1st, 2005 09:44 PM
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The Rover

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Location: Canada

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Jaro
Sam saw the Eye of Sauron on top of the tower himself.


Rephrase: The "Eye" was on top of the Tower, (as it would seem), but it was not the only manifestation of Sauron.


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Old Post Oct 1st, 2005 10:43 PM
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JediMasterLuke5
Superman is a god

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If sauron would have regained the ring, Gandalf would ask the Valar if they would allow him to use all of his power and then he would destroy Sauron. Muhahahahaha

Old Post Oct 2nd, 2005 03:10 AM
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ESB -1138
Piano Man

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Gandalf is no where near as strong as Sauron. Because if we was Gandalf could have handle the ring without problems but he dare not touch it knowing the ring would overcome him.


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Old Post Oct 2nd, 2005 08:16 PM
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JediMasterLuke5
Superman is a god

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Nobody can handle the ring duh, not even Morgoth if he was alive. The ring answer's to its one master.

Gandalf on the other hand could have tooken Sauron out. The Valar only allowed the Istari to contest the Power of Sauron, they said that the Istari werenot allowed to match or better the power of Sauron. If the Valar would have allowed Gandalf to use his power to better Sauron, Gandalf would have destoyed him.

Old Post Oct 10th, 2005 01:30 AM
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DanielLB
The Bad Wolf

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The only person that would be able to manage the ring would be Tom Bombadil-for in his verys soul and heart he had absolute no desire for it, whereas, Galadriel,Gandalf, Aragorn, Sam, Boromir, Sauron, Gollum, Morgoth and so on had some sort of desire for itsmile


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Old Post Oct 10th, 2005 06:40 PM
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ESB -1138
Piano Man

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quote: (post)
Originally posted by JediMasterLuke5
Nobody can handle the ring duh, not even Morgoth if he was alive. The ring answer's to its one master.

Gandalf on the other hand could have tooken Sauron out. The Valar only allowed the Istari to contest the Power of Sauron, they said that the Istari werenot allowed to match or better the power of Sauron. If the Valar would have allowed Gandalf to use his power to better Sauron, Gandalf would have destoyed him.


Sauron returned to Mordor, and in Mount Doom around 1600 he forged the One Ring to rule the others. He had to put much of his own strength and will into the Ring so that it could master the other Rings of Power. The One Ring allowed him to perceive and control the thoughts of those who bore the lesser Rings.

When he wielded the One Ring, Sauron's power was enhanced, but there were two inherent dangers. First, if someone with great strength of will claimed the Ring, that person could become Sauron's master. Second, if the Ring were destroyed, Sauron would also be destroyed because he would no longer have sufficient power to maintain his existence and would be reduced to nothing more than a shadow. But Sauron could not conceive that anyone would try to destroy the Ring, and he knew that no one - not even himself - would have the strength of will to do so.

If Gandalf was so great he would have been able to wield the ring and become Sauron's master but he was weaker then he and would have never been a match for Sauron.


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Old Post Oct 10th, 2005 11:28 PM
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JediMasterLuke5
Superman is a god

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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Celestial
Sauron returned to Mordor, and in Mount Doom around 1600 he forged the One Ring to rule the others. He had to put much of his own strength and will into the Ring so that it could master the other Rings of Power. The One Ring allowed him to perceive and control the thoughts of those who bore the lesser Rings.

When he wielded the One Ring, Sauron's power was enhanced, but there were two inherent dangers. First, if someone with great strength of will claimed the Ring, that person could become Sauron's master. Second, if the Ring were destroyed, Sauron would also be destroyed because he would no longer have sufficient power to maintain his existence and would be reduced to nothing more than a shadow. But Sauron could not conceive that anyone would try to destroy the Ring, and he knew that no one - not even himself - would have the strength of will to do so.

If Gandalf was so great he would have been able to wield the ring and become Sauron's master but he was weaker then he and would have never been a match for Sauron.


No one can wield the ring except sauron. All the ring does is give the power to control the other rings. Read the part I said about the Valar, maybe that will make you change your mind.

Old Post Oct 10th, 2005 11:33 PM
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ESB -1138
Piano Man

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Let's look at some facts.
Morgoth greatest warrior was Sauron and he had an army of Balrogs.
Gandalf was killed by a Balrog (and he killed the Balrog so it's a draw)
Sauron is greater then all Nine Nazgul combined and Gandalf couldn't defeat them.

Sauron>Balrog=Gandalf
Sauron>Nine Nazgul>Gandalf


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Old Post Oct 11th, 2005 12:16 AM
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ESB -1138
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In J. R. R. Tolkien's fantasy universe, Middle-earth, the Valar are the Powers of Arda who live on the Western continent of Aman.

The Valar were the fourteen powerful spirits of the race of the Ainur who entered Arda after its creation to give order to the world and combat the evils of Melkor. They dwelt originally on the Isle of Almaren, but after its destruction, long before the Awakening of the Elves, they moved to Aman and founded Valinor.

They were the greatest of the Ainur who witnessed the Vision of Il˙vatar and so came to create Arda. Melkor came to Arda to claim it for his own.

ManwŰ and Melkor fought, and ManwŰ called other spirits to help him in his battle. Among these were the other Valar and the Maiar. Melkor withdrew from the battle, and the others continued their creation of the World. But Melkor saw this, and returned to fight for control of Arda.

The Valar have no fixed shape, but often take the shapes of Men and Elves, or they can remain invisible.

The Valar are not Gods, though Men often mistake them as such. They are actually emissaries or regents of Il˙vatar, the monotheistic God of the world, who rarely directly intervenes in the world's course of events.


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Old Post Oct 11th, 2005 12:34 AM
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JediMasterLuke5
Superman is a god

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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Celestial


Sauron>Balrog=Gandalf
Sauron>Nine Nazgul>Gandalf


Thats a bunch of bull crapt. Its more like this.

Gandalf>>>> Balrog
Gandalf>>Nine Nazgul
Balrog>>Nine Nazgul

The nine nazgul wouldnt be able to do shit to the Balrog.

Gandalf killed the Balrog. Gandalf may have died but after he killed the Balrog. And plus he killed the Balrog when he was Gandalf the Grey, now he is Gandalf the White with far greater power then before. Gandalf came back as Gandalf the White more powerful than anyone who currently walks middle earth. Freaking read the part about the Valor to prove Gandalf was more powerful the Sauron.

Heres the facts and read the quotes from the book


"Gandalf: Dangerous, And so am I, very dangerous: more dangerous than anything you will ever meet."

also here's another quote....

"The Dark Lord has Nine. But we have One, mightier then they are: the White Rider. He has passed through the fire and the abyss, and they shall fear him."

"Mightier then they are" means he greater then all Nazgul.

Old Post Oct 12th, 2005 07:38 PM
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Ushgarak
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Gandalf HIMSELF specified that he was not more powerful than Sauron. Geez, you could at least read the entirity of your own quotes; he says that after the quote you use there!


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Old Post Oct 12th, 2005 07:41 PM
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JediMasterLuke5
Superman is a god

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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Ushgarak
Gandalf HIMSELF specified that he was not more powerful than Sauron. Geez, you could at least read the entirity of your own quotes; he says that after the quote you use there!

The reason he says that is becuz the Valor will not allow him to use his full power. The Valor only allowed the Istari to contest the will of Sauron, they dont allow him to match or better Sauron even though they could. If the Valor allowed Gandalf to use all of his power he could destroy Sauron. But if the Valor wouldnt allow it, then Gandalf would put up a great fight but in the end loose.

Old Post Oct 12th, 2005 07:45 PM
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Ushgarak
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Again, it's nothing to do with this 'full power' use, and even if it was, then we are talking about Gandalf with whatever power he can use, not whatveer theoretical power you may wish to give him, because that is irrelevant to the story.

Why assume he is greater than Sauron anyway? Gandalf is not from a more powerful race, and Sauron has grown mighty indeed. As Gandalf himself also says, he is Gandalf the White- but Black is greater still.


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Old Post Oct 12th, 2005 07:49 PM
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ESB -1138
Piano Man

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I do not know why you think Gandalf is this almighty god when he said himself the Witch-King could best him.

The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King
Chapter IV: The Siege of Gondor Pg. 800-801 (One volume edition)
'Is Faramir come?' he asked.
'No,' said Gandalf. 'But he still lived when I left him. Yet he is resolved to stay with the reargurad, lest the retreat over the Pelennor become a rout. He may, perhaps, hold his men together long enough, but I doubt it. He is pitted against a foe too great. For one has come that I feared.'
'Not - the Dark Lord?' cried Pippin, forgetting his place in his terror.
Denethor laughed bitterly. 'Nay, not yet, Master Peregrin! He will not come save only to triumph over me when all is won. He uses others as his weapons. So do all great lords, if they are wise, Master Halfling. Or why should I sit here in my tower and think, and watch, and wair, spending even my sons? For I can still wield a brand.'
He stood up and cast opened his long black cloak, and behold! he was clad in mail beneath, and grit with a long sword, great-hilted in a sheath of black and silver. 'Thus have I walked, and thus now for many years have I slept,' he said, 'lest we age the body should grow soft and timid.'
'Yet now under the Lord of Barad-dur the most fell of all his captains is already master of your outer walls' said Gandalf. 'King of Angmar long ago, Sorcerer, Ringwraith, Lord of the Nazgul, a spear of terror in the hand of Sauron, shadow of despair.'
'Then, Mithrandir, you had a foe to match you,' Said Denethor. 'For myself, I have long known who is chief captain of the hosts of the Dark Tower. Is this all that you have returned to say? Or cab it be that you have withdrawn because you are overmatched?'
Pippin trembled, fearing that Gandalf would be stung to sudden wrath, but his fear was needless. 'It might be so,' Gandalf answered softly.


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Old Post Oct 12th, 2005 07:55 PM
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Discos
The Discmeister

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my theory is that someone would toss the ring into the great eye, and out of nowhere the figure of Sauron would return at 100% health (with all fingers) and with new shiney armour.

or he could perhaps could as the form of a silly vampire again smile


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Old Post Oct 12th, 2005 10:21 PM
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Covert22
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this thread made my stomach turn...

Bombadil was someone regarded as elder to Gandalf, Gandalf in turn was a mere Isatari... the Valar sent a few Miar and there is no reason to concieve that Gandalf in any form is more powerful than Saruman or even Radagast or the 'unspoken' wizards such as the blue wizard...


Gandalf had some special abilities he could tap and to imply that he could if he was 'allowed' would then apply as well to Saruman who worked against the Valar's interest could use some 'uber power' (note- VALAR not VALOR)...


furthermore Gandalf was bested by a mere Balrog which in turn is another miar.


and going to the form of sauron, if you try looking around at the opinion of bigger geeks than yourselves or even reading closer you will see that Sauron has a physical body, similar to his first and only diminished in ability due to not have the ring in his possesion. Its silly to even suggest that he doesnt.


besides the exception of perhaps Bombadil 1v1 Sauron was the most powerful force in Middle Earth and nothing short of a miar wielding the one ring would have a chance of defeating him in combat.

Old Post Oct 27th, 2005 05:32 AM
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ESB -1138
Piano Man

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I could undertsand the fact that Gandalf the Grey wasn't stronger then Saruman but he wasn't bested by a Balrog for he killed the Balrog and the Balrog killed him so:
Gandalf the Grey=Balrog


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Old Post Oct 27th, 2005 09:13 PM
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Covert22
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note- i should have an "if" before gandalf...


my point was that to think Gandalf was any more powerful than a balrog ever... is silly and to think sauron has no physical body would be even sillier.

Old Post Nov 1st, 2005 07:34 PM
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shaber
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Sauron would then have been able to regenerate a body and in any case, he was able to move the Ring by psychokinesis without one when coming back from the abyss after the downfall of Numenor.


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Old Post Nov 11th, 2005 08:20 PM
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