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Home » Star Wars » Star Wars: Literature & Expanded Universe » Star Wars Versus Forum » Darth Maul vs Count Dooku


Darth Maul vs Count Dooku
Started by: braz

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AncientPower
The Chosen One

Registered: Aug 2014
Location: The balance of the Force


 

That moment when the old Ben accolades from DE have been laughed at for a decade and then Disney makes it canon.


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Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 06:05 AM
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Jaggarath
DarthAnt66

Registered: Feb 2013
Location: USA


 

Filoni's said Kenobi three-shotting Maul was because he thought every time Maul matched Kenobi's blade it suggests parity, but he didn't think there was any.

Rebels Kenobi is genuinely far beyond Maul (or Ahsoka).


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Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 06:06 AM
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Rockydonovang
freedom fighter

Registered: Dec 2016
Location:


 

quote: (post)
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Filoni's said Kenobi three-shotting Maul was because he thought every time Maul matched Kenobi's blade it suggests parity, but he didn't think there was any.

Which proves that Maul =/ Kenobi, nothing more.

The three-shotting has already been explained by multiple separate reasons.

It should be obvious Kenobi isn't actually capable of three-shotting Maul in a typical sw duel.

Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 06:08 AM
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Jaggarath
DarthAnt66

Registered: Feb 2013
Location: USA


 

"Every time Maul would block or parry Obi-Wan Kenobi would mean that he is his equal, and I just don’t think he is."

Not... really.

Rebels Maul is just a complete shadow of his former self.


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Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 06:08 AM
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Rockydonovang
freedom fighter

Registered: Dec 2016
Location:


 

Ant, does not equal does not equal
quote:
genuinely far beyond

And it's funny how you're only willing to take this authorial intent into consideration, not what Gilroy said, not what Beck said, and not what Feloni has also said.

Keep cherrypicking bro.

Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 06:10 AM
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Jaggarath
DarthAnt66

Registered: Feb 2013
Location: USA


 

Yeah, he is. That's inherently reflected in Dave's quote. thumb up

I don't even know what the two have said, but Filoni has never said Maul has grown.

You have admitted that you just want Maul to have grown to wank Ahsoka.


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"There is only Revan. Only he can shape this galaxy as it is meant to be shaped."

Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 06:11 AM
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Rockydonovang
freedom fighter

Registered: Dec 2016
Location:


 

quote: (post)
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Yeah, he is. thumb up


Yes, he's not equal to Kenobi?

Well, yea, that's obvious. thumb up

Last edited by Rockydonovang on Oct 8th, 2017 at 06:15 AM

Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 06:12 AM
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Jaggarath
DarthAnt66

Registered: Feb 2013
Location: USA


 


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Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 06:14 AM
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Rockydonovang
freedom fighter

Registered: Dec 2016
Location:


 

To address the last minute edit...

What the quote says
quote:

"Every time Maul would block or parry Obi-Wan Kenobi would mean that he is his equal, and I just don’t think he is."
What Ant says:
quote:

Rebels Kenobi is genuinely far beyond Maul

There's a difference. erm
quote:

I don't even know what the two have said

Let's change that:
quote:

Andi Gutierrez: "The actual duel between the two Masters is very short, like a samurai film. How did you come to the conclusion that it had to be done this way?"
Carrie Beck: "We never entered into this story trying to think about how satisfying that battle should be, it really became about what was the genuine intention of this moment and knowing where these two men are at this point in their lives. I think it's important for us, even though on the timeline we aren't to A New Hope yet, to think about what we know of Obi-Wan in that movie and work backwards in some way, to make sure that the character's progression charts appropriately."
Henry Gilroy: "When you fight someone many times, and have faced off, you kinda know each other's moves, so if you think about it, the biuldup to this confrontation and the actual lightsabers hitting each other is actually longer cause they're basically playing it out in their heads, and the amazing thing is the move that Maul tries after the initial exchange, he actually attempts the move that killed Qui-Gon Jinn. He tries to basically bash him with thehilt."

Both an in universe and out of universe alternative to your claim that Ben Kenobi>>>>>>Rebels Maul.

Aside from your claim being unsupported, it's pretty illogical given that Rebels Vader isn't>>>Ahsoka who isn't>>>>Rebels Maul.

What Ant says:
quote:
but Filoni has never said Maul has grown.

What the quote says:
quote:

The actual duel is very short, how did you come to the conclusion it had to come this way?...(feloni) If you talk to a lot of people who sword fight, they'll tell you people who are very good don't have long fights. So that scene, its a homage to the 7th samurai. I think on one level people would be excited to see [/I]another prolonged lightsaber fight. But I just never really saw the confrontation that way because to do that is to say the characters don't have [I]growth "

erm
quote:
You have admitted that you just want Maul to have grown to wank Ahsoka.

Which doesn't remotely invalidate my argument bro. Though I'd argue for Maul having grown even if Ahsoka didn't scale above him. Not because I especially like Maul, though he's one of my favorite villians, but because that's what the only evidence on the matter suggests.

I'm sure though you're being objective here, hence why you're making up sh!t that the evidence you're trying to use doesn't actually say.

quote: (post)

A fairly accurate portrayal of how your posts right now. thumb up

Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 06:33 AM
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Rockydonovang
freedom fighter

Registered: Dec 2016
Location:


 

For the record though, Ahsoka doesn't need Rebels Maul tp be>SOD because she has closeness with Vader, a force user who's LOTS incarnation has done a better version of SOD Maul's best feats.

Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 06:43 AM
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ChocolateMuesli
Senior Member

Registered: Aug 2017
Location:


 

quote:
"Every time Maul would block or parry Obi-Wan Kenobi would mean that he is his equal

who said this? legitimately one of the most retarded things ive ever read

Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 06:45 AM
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Rockydonovang
freedom fighter

Registered: Dec 2016
Location:


 

quote: (post)
Originally posted by ChocolateMuesli
who said this? legitimately one of the most retarded things ive ever read

Feloni off course.

Regardless of how retarded or non retarded such a statement is, it's not saying this:
quote:
Kenobi is genuinely far beyond Rebels Maul

Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 06:51 AM
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Jaggarath
DarthAnt66

Registered: Feb 2013
Location: USA


 

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Rockydonovang
your claim that Ben Kenobi>>>>>>Rebels Maul.

(please log in to view the image)

When I said "far beyond," I didn't mean you holding down Shift and your "." key, lmfao.

That being said, I consider Old Ben on par with / better than Vader and Rebels Maul a tier 7 - do the math.


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Last edited by Jaggarath on Oct 8th, 2017 at 06:56 AM

Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 06:53 AM
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Rockydonovang
freedom fighter

Registered: Dec 2016
Location:


 

The gif would have been more effective if you had cropped the "your claim" bit, bro.

BTW, the cat in your gif is not trying to reach for the celing. I'd follow his example.

Edit: are these last minute edits some sort of divisionary tactic?

Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 06:56 AM
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Jaggarath
DarthAnt66

Registered: Feb 2013
Location: USA


 

cringe

You're holding onto a lone wonderfully ambiguous quote like it's the only thing between you and eternal damnation.


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"There is only Revan. Only he can shape this galaxy as it is meant to be shaped."

Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 06:58 AM
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Rockydonovang
freedom fighter

Registered: Dec 2016
Location:


 

quote: (post)
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
cringe

Is your face alright buddy? sad
quote: (post)
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
You're holding onto a lone wonderfully ambiguous quote like it's the only thing between you and eternal damnation.

A very nice deflection. thumb up

Now are you going to address how the quote which says Kenobi is beyond Maul doesn't say Kenobi is "far beyond Maul"?

Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 07:03 AM
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Jaggarath
DarthAnt66

Registered: Feb 2013
Location: USA


 

No, it pretty clearly states that. Filoni ended the fight quickly because he didn't think Maul was capable enough of contending with Obi-Wan.

In regards to the Filoni quote, frankly? I think he misspoke - he meant to say "character," not "characters," since we have him on-interview directly stating "Maul has not grown since TPM."

And in regards to your "combat not emotional growth BS," they're the same thing. They're both coordinated. You don't decline in one and not the other.

Filoni's alleged statement that Maul has grown as a swordsman is not reflected in the actual episode, hence the entire community's reaction to your retardation. We don't see Darth Maul apply a new maneuver vs Obi-Wan, which would be an indication of growth - he uses the same ****ing technique he used versus Qui-Gon, which Filoni has said hearkens back to the fact Maul has no grown.

And then we have Witwer stating multiple times that Maul has indeed declined, which makes perfect sense. Witwer's statements are legitimate because we know that Witwer and Filoni talked extensively about the behind-the-scenes of Maul's character going into this fight.


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"There is only Revan. Only he can shape this galaxy as it is meant to be shaped."

Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 07:08 AM
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Jaggarath
DarthAnt66

Registered: Feb 2013
Location: USA


 

FWI, I don't plan to respond to whatever post you create - I'm going to bed.

You've debated this endlessly with Darth Thor, I don't think anyone will ever change your opinion on it, mostly because if you did change your opinion then you'd have to realize how retarded you've been for the past year of your existence.


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"There is only Revan. Only he can shape this galaxy as it is meant to be shaped."

Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 07:17 AM
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Jaggarath
DarthAnt66

Registered: Feb 2013
Location: USA


 

But I'll pose this question, which I don't think DT has:

Do you actually believe that if you would go up to Filoni and ask him which incarnation of Darth Maul is the most skilled with a blade that he would answer with Rebels Maul? That he would pick an incarnation of Maul deliberately designed to be an older, deranged, out of prime version of Maul rather than the Maul in his twenties taking on two Jedi with Duel of the Fates in the background or the one ruling a planet of Boba Fetts and duking it out versus Sidious himself?

Don't answer, since obviously you'd say yes in public, but really consider the narrative Filoni is trying to present and answer to yourself if you believe you're being true to that vision.


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"There is only Revan. Only he can shape this galaxy as it is meant to be shaped."

Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 07:24 AM
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Rockydonovang
freedom fighter

Registered: Dec 2016
Location:


 

Do I seriously have to do this with you again?

What you say:
quote: (post)
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
he didn't think Maul was capable enough of contending with Obi-Wan.

What the quote says:
quote:

"Every time Maul would block or parry Obi-Wan Kenobi would mean that he is his equal


Do I actually have to explain to you the difference between contention and equality?

I'm aware you're a smart person, so I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt, and assume you're lying. :up
quote: (post)
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
In regards to the Filoni quote, frankly? I think he misspoke - he meant to say "character," not "characters,"

That backtrack tho.
quote: (post)
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
since we have him on-interview directly stating "Maul has not grown since TPM."

I wonder why you haven't posted more than 6 words from the quote...

Is it because what comes before and directly after makes clear that's referring to emotional growth? erm
quote: (post)
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Filoni's alleged statement that Maul has grown as a swordsman is not reflected in the actual episode, hence the entire community's reaction to your retardation. We don't see Darth Maul apply a new maneuver vs Obi-Wan, which would be an indication of growth - he uses the same ****ing technique he used versus Qui-Gon, which Filoni has said hearkens back to the fact Maul has no grown.

Again, Feloni says Maul hasn't grown emotionally. The contradiction you're looking for remains non-existent.
quote: (post)
Originally posted by DarthAnt66
And then we have Witwer stating multiple times that Maul has indeed declined, which makes perfect sense. [/B]

You really don't like context, do you Ant:
quote:
Witwer: He has this ambition that still exists inside him and that ambition is eating him up –especially now that he’s past his prime and his glory years. Yeah, he’s a sadder character than we perhaps remember in Clone Wars.

As I stated earlier in this thread, I don't have any interest in re-explaining why your reorientation of quotes to say what you want them to say doesn't work over and over again.

If you want to keep discussing this, then bump this:
https://comicvine.gamespot.com/prof...-growth/131038/

Otherwise, let's stop deflecting away from how you're blatantly making sh!t up regarding what Feloni has said.

Old Post Oct 8th, 2017 07:27 AM
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