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Butch and Sundance
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LaurenE147
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Butch and Sundance

What were Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid's real names?


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Old Post Jul 5th, 2002 08:50 PM
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ToMacco
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Paul Newman and Robert Redford?


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4 8 15 16 23 42

Old Post Jul 6th, 2002 04:53 AM
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greedo
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ToMacco that was a good one very Homerish!


On April 13, 1866, the couple welcomed their first of many children, Robert LeRoy Parker, who would later become known as “Butch Cassidy.”

Harry Longabaugh at the age of 15 was caught stealing a horse and was sentenced to two years imprisonment at the jail in Sundance, Wyoming. He would be known afterwards as the Sundance Kid.


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Old Post Jul 6th, 2002 08:00 AM
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greedo wins!!!!!! So few people pay attention to that.


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Old Post Jul 7th, 2002 12:37 AM
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Ushgarak
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Can anyone tell me what ACTUALLY happened to the man who was assumed to be Butch Cassidy? As in how he died?

(Bearing in mind, of course, that there is still no proof that the two Americans shot dead there were actually those two...)


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Old Post Jul 7th, 2002 01:15 AM
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greedo
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A little exerpt from a book

"Legend had it that Butch and Sundance were killed in a shootout with the Bolivian cavalry at San Vicente, Bolivia, in 1908; however, this story was not reported in the United States until 1930, well after the fact. Historical and archaeological research has shown that two American outlaws were indeed killed at San Vicente, but whether they were Butch and Sundance is not certain. A 1992 exhumation showed that one of the outlaws in question bore an unquestionable physical resemblance to Sundance, but the other body was not in good enough condition to compare it to Cassidy. Etta Place’s fate is also unknown; for the last century, countless stories have circulated concerning the true fate of each of the three outlaws. The most persistent of these rumors is that Butch Cassidy lived until 1937 in Spokane, Washington, under the alias William T. Phillips. In his 1977 book In Search of Butch Cassidy, historian Larry Pointer presented convincing evidence, including photographic and graphological analysis, in arguing that Phillips was really Cassidy.

Only three people probably knew the truth and they are all long gone now...


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Old Post Jul 7th, 2002 07:51 AM
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LaurenE147
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Sundance was never heard of again after that shootout. His letters to his sister stopped.

Butch's sister said he died of pneumonia long after the shootout. She could be a crazy woman overtaken by grief, but it brings up a lot of controversy.


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Old Post Jul 7th, 2002 03:52 PM
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Ushgarak
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Be that as it may, my question is still unanswered.


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Old Post Jul 7th, 2002 06:54 PM
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LaurenE147
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Your question is unanswered because nobody knows the truth. It's kind of like Anastasia. Thee ws a shadow of a doubt so they searched for her far and wide. Even though they did those blood tests on her body compared to the rest of the family and it was in fact her.


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Old Post Jul 8th, 2002 01:04 AM
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Ushgarak
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I don't know what question you are answering, Lauren, but my question was asking what actually happened to the man that was assumed to be Butch. Which is perfectly well known seeing as there were about 100 witnesses. The mystery is whether it was Butch or not.

There is another Anastasia pretender who has just cropped up, actually.


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Last edited by Ushgarak on Jul 8th, 2002 at 01:21 AM

Old Post Jul 8th, 2002 01:05 AM
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greedo
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What happened afterwards is the central myth surrounding Cassidy. Some claim he and Sundance were killed, others emphatically believe that another pair of outlaws were killed by the troops and that Cassidy and Longabaugh purposefully let it be known they had been killed. The oft-told stories relate that the pair returned to the West and lived out their lives under alias names and identities. Like many other Western figures, Butch Cassidy has become larger than life. His name still generates fond recollections from many Utah old-timers who love to tell stories about him. Whether he died in South America or died of old age under one of the several identities that are attributed to him may never be fully proven.

Unless a diary or actual child of the two came forth this will be one of those unsolved mysteries...rest in peace Butch and Sundance.


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Old Post Jul 8th, 2002 04:23 PM
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I was answering your question. Nobody knows.


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Old Post Jul 8th, 2002 04:34 PM
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Ushgarak
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You were NOT answering my question, Lauren! What is wrong with you!?

I asked- and I have REPEATED what I asked- what happen to the man who was ASSUMED to be Butch Cassidy! As in the one who died at the shootout. And like I say, over a hundred people saw that man die!

To make it clear- at the end of Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, the two of them charge out towards the gynmen and are shot down. This is the film assuming that those two American bandits were actually Butch and Sundance.

But whether it was them or not, the point is that they did not die that way.

I am asking how did the man ASSUMED to be Butch die.


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"We've got maybe seconds before Darth Rosenberg grinds everybody into Jawa burgers and not one of you buds has the midi-chlorians to stop her!"

"You've never had any TINY bit of sex, have you?"

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Old Post Jul 8th, 2002 05:13 PM
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He died. Duh.


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Old Post Jul 8th, 2002 09:50 PM
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Ushgarak
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Sigh... HOW did he die?


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"You've never had any TINY bit of sex, have you?"

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Old Post Jul 8th, 2002 10:00 PM
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LaurenE147
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They shot him.


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Old Post Jul 8th, 2002 10:59 PM
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Ushgarak
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No they didn't. That is something the film made up.


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"We've got maybe seconds before Darth Rosenberg grinds everybody into Jawa burgers and not one of you buds has the midi-chlorians to stop her!"

"You've never had any TINY bit of sex, have you?"

BtVS

Old Post Jul 8th, 2002 11:11 PM
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greedo
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quote:

Two stories exist of the Butch Cassidy death: one that Butch Cassidy died in a gun battle with Bolivia troops. The second has Butch Cassidy according to the family returning to the states and living anonymously for years


This second story has Butch Cassidy dying in Spokane, Washington in 1937


According to all I have read there were two men killed in a gun battle in Bolvia (whether they actually were BC & SDK or not two men died by gun shots).

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this is Saint Vicente where the two men were killed.

Here is a quote from their report...
quote:

Most historians believe that Butch and Sundance died in a shoot-out in San Vincente, a town in southern Bolivia, where they had fled after robbing the payroll of the Aramayo Mining Co. that was being carried on a mule. After a patrol discovered them holed up in a rented hut, gunfight ensued, ending when darkness fell. Later that night, townspeople reported hearing screams and two shots. In the morning, they found the outlaws dead, both shot in the head. Badly wounded during the gunfight, the outlaws had chosen to commit suicide rather than fall captive.


or there is this

quote:

The official document states that the village’s mayor, miscellaneous village officials, and two soldiers went to the house where the two bandits were holed up. One of the soldiers approached the house and was shot by someone from within. The soldier retreated to care for his injury, and a few more volleys of gunfire were exchanged, although no sounds came from within the house after midnight. As the sun came up the following morning, the men outside cautiously approached the house again and, upon entering, found both men inside dead. The money from the mining company payroll heist was also inside and was later returned to the company. The bodies of the two outlaws were soon buried in a local graveyard.

Later, some time after the hasty burials, the pair was conjectured to have been Butch and Sundance, and a common belief grew that Butch shot Sundance before turning the gun on himself.

Almost immediately after this “identification,” doubt about the identities of the dead men spread, and rumors and sightings of Butch and/or Sundance became commonplace and widely reported. Matt Warner, Mormon Church officials, and his family claimed sightings of Butch after his "death". In her biography of her brother, Butch Cassidy, My Brother, Butch’s sister Lula cites several instances of people familiar with Butch who encountered him long after 1908, and she relates a detailed impromptu “family reunion” that included Butch, their brother Mark, their father, and Lula herself, in 1925.


There is a lot more.........


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Last edited by greedo on Jul 14th, 2002 at 05:43 AM

Old Post Jul 14th, 2002 05:40 AM
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Ushgarak
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The important bit is that they killed themselves; there was no charge at troops outside. In fact, one eyewitness account says that 'Sundance' shot 'Butch'.


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"We've got maybe seconds before Darth Rosenberg grinds everybody into Jawa burgers and not one of you buds has the midi-chlorians to stop her!"

"You've never had any TINY bit of sex, have you?"

BtVS

Old Post Jul 14th, 2002 01:39 PM
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