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Pre Ret Con Beyonder Vs. THe Presence
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Juntai
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Mr Master
I never said that or implied, next time read my post carefully and don't be so quick to snap your mouth.

sorry...the "lololol" got to me, considering you were wrong.

Come on Jun, your better than this.

I'll answer this with your own quote:

ps.

Didn't know Superman became a Universe before.

Didn't know Superman COMPLETELY Overpowered a blast of Energy that Erases Multi-verses

Didn't know Superman could ONLY be defeated by second most powerful being in the Omni-verse.

Given the person you were quoting, it did indeed seem you were saying that, I was asking to make sure, then laughing at the very idea.

Speculation is speculation on any level.

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Sep 12th, 2006 12:20 AM

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Mr Master
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Superherovandal
Sure he is powerful but if he was so powerful why was he able to be retconned?Huh?

Able?

What's going to stop executive decisions in a comic book company.

He was retconned because he was TOO POWERFUL...

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Superherovandal
IN both universes you don't retcon Supreme Being but you can to all else.

Well TOAA didn't even exist when pre-Beyonder was around.

WHO do you think the Supreme Being was?

Beyonder is the Living Embodiment of Supreme Power
(please log in to view the image)
(please log in to view the image)

Just like the Omniverse is everything in Marvel Now.

So the Multi-verse was EVERYTHING upto May 84' and the Beyond Realm was EVERYTHING OUTSIDE of the Marvel Multi-verse between May 1984 and Nov. 86'

Beyonder was EVERYTHING OUTSIDE the Multiverse
(please log in to view the image)

And apparently EVERYTHING INSIDE the Multi-verse aswell.
(please log in to view the image)

Dr Strange's take on it.
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Superherovandal
So just by being retconned he is shown not to be equal to Yahweh in any shape or form.

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Sep 12th, 2006 12:23 AM

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Mr Master
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by sexyking
Yes But captain Mar-vel isnt supreme in power is he.

You said Omniscience defeats NON-Omniscience, you were wrong.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by sexyking
Anyway i still disagree that the beyonder is equal in power to the presence or TOAA.

I answer your question appropiately and correctly, and you give me, "Anyway i still disagree"... confused

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Sep 12th, 2006 12:27 AM

sexyking
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Mr Master
You said Omniscience defeats NON-Omniscience, you were wrong.

I answer your question appropiately and correctly, and you give me, "Anyway i still disagree"...

No i said two beings of supreme power and ones ominiscience while the other isnt. The one with the supreme power and ominiscience wins. Yes you answered my questions but do you believe that due to the fact in you answering them thats going to sway my opinion. I just dont see the beyonder stalemating the presense and that isnt going to change no matter how much scans you put up.

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Sep 12th, 2006 12:35 AM

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sexyking
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Sep 12th, 2006 12:35 AM

Mr Master
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Juntai
Speculation is speculation on any level.

If you say so,

but comparing Superman to the IG on any level, calls for speculation on the author of said comments.

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Sep 12th, 2006 12:37 AM

Mr Master
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by sexyking
I just dont see the beyonder stalemating the presense and that isnt going to change no matter how much scans you put up.

As you wish.

Just wish you had one scan of what this Presence is capable of.

Or does the title define his feats?

Atleast we saw TOAA's power in action.

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Sep 12th, 2006 12:39 AM

Mr.Biscuits
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Mr Master
As you wish.

Just wish you had one scan of what this Presence is capable of.

Or does the title define his feats?

Atleast we saw TOAA's power in action.

What the Presence is capable of?Just pick up a random New gods or Spectre Book and you'll see.

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Sep 12th, 2006 12:41 AM

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Juntai
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Mr Master
As you wish.

Just wish you had one scan of what this Presence is capable of.

Or does the title define his feats?

Atleast we saw TOAA's power in action.

By issue 27 of Spectre volume 4, Hal/Spectre tapping a piece of Gods whole was portrayed as greater than all creation, so much that he was able to guide the destiny of all realities and every being in them.

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Last edited by Juntai on Sep 12th, 2006 at 12:51 AM

Sep 12th, 2006 12:48 AM

Mr Master
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Juntai
By issue 27 of Spectre volume 4, Hal/Spectre tapping a piece of Gods whole was portrayed as greater than all creation,

I have the Spectre collection,

I recently began opening the pages, I will continue to learn more about the Spectre.

On another note:

If a piece of the Presence is greater than all creation, what's the deal with this "Full Powered Spectre," I heard he equaled the Presence.

Spectre will never need to be Full Powered if a piece of Presence is more than all.

Or is it this piece that makes him "Full Powered"?

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Juntai
so much that he was able to guide the destiny of all realities and every being in them.

Like so Beyonder nearly shattered the entire Timestream and ALL that came before it.
(please log in to view the image)
You know what this means right?

ALL the Events through out Marvel's History, would have been ERASED.

This isn't speculation, Reed is speaking definitively, ONE thought necessary from the Beyonder, and Marvel, goes by by.

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Sep 12th, 2006 01:35 AM

Juntai
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Mr Master
I have the Spectre collection,

I recently began opening the pages, I will continue to learn more about the Spectre.

On another note:

If a piece of the Presence is greater than all creation, what's the deal with this "Full Powered Spectre," I heard he equaled the Presence.

Spectre will never need to be Full Powered if a piece of Presence is more than all.

Or is it this piece that makes him "Full Powered"?

Like so Beyonder nearly shattered the entire Timestream and ALL that came before it.
(please log in to view the image)
You know what this means right?

ALL the Events through out Marvel's History, would have been ERASED.

This isn't speculation, Reed is speaking definitively, ONE thought necessary from the Beyonder, and Marvel, goes by by.

Which Spectre collection? There's multiple volumes and many tie ins and tons of stories outside of those.

Most people don't know what they're talking about concerning Spectre. That's how stuff like "full powered" Spectre comes along. Spectre, the character as a whole, is a human soul tied to a piece of God. I take it as Spectre using his high end showings, but for some reason people believe he needs permission to act against anything.

And Spectre has destroyed and recreated DC more than once already.

But Spectre isn't the object of this thread.

I was merely giving a vantage point on a piece of the supreme being is greater than all of creation.

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Last edited by Juntai on Sep 12th, 2006 at 01:49 AM

Sep 12th, 2006 01:46 AM

LatinoStallion
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
God creates 3 beyonders and they beat the crap out of the beyonder. It's all with in God's power to do so. But the beyonder cannot create another God.

Which God are you talking about ? The Presence from the actual comic book series (who has never been shown to put up a feat such as that), or the God that you personally worship ?

If you speak of the latter, then please don't include your religious bias into this...give comic book fact, not personal bullshit....you DC fans seriously do not know how to argue....

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Sep 12th, 2006 01:52 AM

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LatinoStallion
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Juntai
I was merely giving a vantage point on a piece of the supreme being is greater than all of creation.

So is Pre-Retconned Beyonder....

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Sep 12th, 2006 01:52 AM

Juntai
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
So is Pre-Retconned Beyonder....

Not in the same sense. Beyonder wasn't guiding the destiny all realities and every being and soul in them. And that was just with a piece of the whole.

__________________

I am God's mighty fist. I am God's strength made manifest.

Sig by: Skeets, S.S, thesilverspider, Sir SKEETS Alot

Sep 12th, 2006 01:55 AM

LatinoStallion
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by galan7777777
and multi-eternity may be infinate, but a single eternity clearly isnt..... if there is anything whos power is greater then a certain character, then that being does not possess infinate power

Multi Eternity is Infinite

Pre Retconned Beyonder is superior to Multi Eternity

Get your Facts straight bro...

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Sep 12th, 2006 01:55 AM

LatinoStallion
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Juntai
Not in the same sense. Beyonder wasn't guiding all realities and every being and soul in them. And that was just with a piece of the whole.

No, because he didn't care too...

If Yahweh IS infact the Presence, then he is limitted simply by the fact that he admitted to Lucifer that even he is shaped by forces external to himself.

Forces external to himself, meaning FORCES that are NOT a part of him...therefore strongly implying that he and his creation is not the only one that exists....that there are those forces independent of and beyond even himself. Lucifer last issue....

The fact that Yahweh Abandoned his creation, and left Hell as a place for his rejected failed creations, means right there that he in fact DID NOT GUIDE all realities and every being as a whole, because if that were the case no one would end up in Hell, and he would have never abandoned his creation.

On top of that, Juntai, consider that Yahweh made "practice" creations before he finally made the current creation that Elaine took over. Again, only another example of how flawed, imperfect, and truly limitted this seemingly omnipotent force is...

In no way superior to Beyonder...

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Sep 12th, 2006 01:59 AM

Juntai
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Lord Urizen
No, because he didn't care too...

If Yahweh IS infact the Presence, then he is limitted simply by the fact that he admitted to Lucifer that even he is shaped by forces external to himself.

Forces external to himself, meaning FORCES that are NOT a part of him...therefore strongly implying that he and his creation is not the only one that exists....that there are those forces independent of and beyond even himself. Lucifer last issue....

The fact that Yahweh Abandoned his creation, and left Hell as a place for his rejected failed creations, means right there that he in fact DID NOT GUIDE all realities and every being as a whole, because if that were the case no one would end up in Hell, and he would have never abandoned his creation.

On top of that, Juntai, consider that Yahweh made "practice" creations before he finally made the current creation that Elaine took over. Again, only another example of how flawed, imperfect, and truly limitted this seemingly omnipotent force is...

In no way superior to Beyonder...

You're confusing Vertigo and DC comics again.

__________________

I am God's mighty fist. I am God's strength made manifest.

Sig by: Skeets, S.S, thesilverspider, Sir SKEETS Alot

Sep 12th, 2006 02:01 AM

Mr Master
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Juntai
Not in the same sense. Beyonder wasn't guiding the destiny all realities and every being and soul in them. And that was just with a piece of the whole.

Actually Beyonder was One with all the Reality that existed in Marvel
(please log in to view the image)
Everything was guided by him.

Beyonder also created a Universe from scratch, roughly 22 Quintillion times Bigger/Greater than our own, on panel.

22 Quintillion = 22,000 Quadrillions

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Sep 12th, 2006 02:04 AM

Juntai
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Mr Master
Actually Beyonder was One with all the Reality that existed in Marvel
(please log in to view the image)
Everything was guided by him.

Beyonder also created a Universe from scratch, roughly 22 Quintillion times Bigger/Greater than our own, on panel.

22 Quintillion = 22,000 Quadrillions

He was speculating in that scan, and we know he's far from omniscient. But I will say he could give cows wings, probably. However, that is still a lot different than actually doing what Spectre was.

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I am God's mighty fist. I am God's strength made manifest.

Sig by: Skeets, S.S, thesilverspider, Sir SKEETS Alot

Last edited by Juntai on Sep 12th, 2006 at 02:18 AM

Sep 12th, 2006 02:08 AM

Mr Master
Junior Member

Gender: Male
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Juntai
He was speculating in that scan, and we know he's far from omniscient.

Please,

Can you point out to me where the speculation is?

(please log in to view the image)
"Everything is, what I say it is"

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Juntai
that is still a lot different than actually doing what Spectre was.

Spectre guided all reality in DC, Beyonder controls all reality in Marvel.

Difference?

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Sep 12th, 2006 02:18 AM

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