It seems, at least to me, that drawing an arbitrary line that constitutes a "clear majority" isn't the way to go. It becomes pretty subjective at that point.
The voting is pretty much over, and there are 7 more votes for Batman being bumped than against.
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I referenced the 2/1 ratio because that was the ratio we had, not because that is what is needed for a vote to pass. Big difference.
And to be perfectly honest, you have no place saying that something "no longer applies" in an accusatory tone before a character has been decided upon. No decision has been made on Batman. None. So tell me, how do you justify saying "seems to me those words no longer apply when Batman is up for a vote" when you literally have no clue whether or not they do? Not only is it illogical, it's insulting.
And yes, it is putting words in my mouth, because I've repeated ad nauseum that there isn't a set percentage required, that the list was wrecked when we did briefly try a set percentage, and that each vote is decided upon individually.
As it is, the last page and a half of everyone ignoring my last post, warning to keep things on topic and civil, has proven to me what needs to be done. Batman is being removed from the list entirely.
So I'll repeat this:
And then say that any further concerns should be sent to me via PM. I won't have this thread spammed any longer over a ridiculous argument spawned from an arbitrary placement of a character that would be just as well off in either tier.
I closed and unstickied this and wanted to talk to you about it, but haven't had the time. So here goes:
The tiers thread failed at everything it was intended to accomplish. Not only did it only create problems, but it didn't solve any either. The purpose was to create a rough guideline for vs. forum reference, to streamline battles. In reality, those who don't need the aid of the list were familiar with it, and those who desperately needed its guidance either didn't know it existed or ignored it entirely.
It also became popular to simply dismiss the list based on 1-2 mistakes they saw with it. The differences of opinion on the forums ensures that no one will ever like the entire list.
Then there was this thread itself, which often turned into flame wars over controversial characters. Too few seemed to realize that the list was never meant to be perfect, never can be perfect in anyone's eyes. I always encouraged those who created problems to make their own lists for personal use. It never worked...proving themselves right over whether {character X} was in mid or high was always too pressing to let it be.
The one good thing it did was create a shared vocabulary for levels (meta, street, trans, etc.). But those are now instilled in the forums, and the thread is no longer needed to ensure that others learn them, since they now assimilate the vocabulary from interacting on the forums.
If you're a knowledgeable poster, you already know what the tiers thread will tell you. And if you're not, you're not going to take KMC's word for it without figuring things out for yourself. So, I'm not going to decide what to do with this thread because I consider this more your forum than mine anymore. But my advice, for both yourselves and the forum, is to close it and forget about it. If others disagree, it's because they want this thread open, but they're speaking from a personal perspective, not one that takes into account its affect on the entire forum.
Given how easily accessible digital comics are now then they were a decade ago, I believe allmost of us are far more well-informed these days then we were back when this thread was first conceived(and ultimately locked.) That said, I think good things can come of this thread, and we can make a lot of much needed changes to the tiers list based on the evidence at hand and not just personal biases or w/e.
However, we still need to consider averages here and not just cherry-picked high-end showings to determine where the characters should fall on the list. Once a consensus has been reached about a particular character's placement, I will edit the list accordingly.
Also, I want to work on editing the existing list FIRST. Once that has been straightened out, I'll be open to adding additional characters to the matrix. One character at a time is best.
But most importantly: I do not want this to devolve into another flame/bash war like it did before, nor do I want to see shitposts. Crap like: "Thor am weakling. Him am street level", or "Superman am God. Him am abstract level" is a good way to get this thread closed again, permanently. Be adults.
**I'll start by keeping this open on sort of a 2 week trial basis. If it seems like good things are coming from the discussions and progress is being made, I'll keep it open. If it looks to be going downhill again, it will be closed no questions asked.
With that being said, reopening/pinning.
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I am tired of being caught in the tangle of their lives."
Last edited by Galan007 on Jan 2nd, 2019 at 08:51 PM
Gender: Male Location: Planning to take over the WORLD!
in my unasked for opinion, i would suggest creating a panel of say, 5 of the most knowledgeable kmc members to go through the list before opening it up to the forum in general. let 5 people work on it as a group and make a adjustments where they see fit. once the adjustments have been made, open it to the forum for additional fine-tuning and debate.
just a suggestion of course. good to see it open for discussion again.
Gender: Male Location: Planning to take over the WORLD!
yeah and people knowledgeable in different areas. some know dc really well, some know marvel, a couple know more independent stuff. star wars is another area. kind of be cool to round up forum area experts to help shape the list if they could. otherwise just try and find the most knowledgeable overall posters i guess.
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Sep 9th, 2009 05:41 PM
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