What I think is...if I don't understand what AC is saying then I will ask him myself. I don't need you to tell me what he is saying. I think I understand his position. What I think he is saying is that any such language someone is capable of using in regards to the quality of music (goodness/badness) is subjective.
I'm gonna spell it for you...there is no "quality" of music according to what he thinks regarding no truly bad/good music existing.
Saying a piece of music is truly "good" means that it possesses an amount of quality. It has higher quality than music that might be said to be truly "bad" (although...this can't be said according to you).
So saying...
"each person determines their own view and opinion on the quality of a song, it's all opinion."
...is a contradictory statement.
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Last edited by EPIIIBITES on May 12th, 2007 at 04:54 AM
Thing is...I think you're able to realise that within your understanding of music, saying "This song sucks" doesn't say anything about what quality a song might have...
...But he says that he and others determine quality of songs or music...which makes no sense if he believes what he says he believes regarding music have no objective goodness or crapness
You've said there is no "quallity" that can be placed on music, because you're of the opinion that there is no objectively good/bad music.
One piece of music doesn't have more or less quality than the other...the idea of it is absurd to you...and THAT is totally in line with your thinking there is no objectively good or bad music.
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Last edited by EPIIIBITES on May 12th, 2007 at 05:11 AM
Because music doesn't exist objectively either. There are only soundwaves. And it's up to the individual observer to decide how to interpret sound. Some sound may be regarded as noise. Other sound may be regarded as music. But "noise" and "music" aren't properties of soundwaves. They're concepts invented by humanity.
So my point...and we'll end it here...is that people like AC make comments like "this song is crap"...(people who say there's no such thing as objectively good/bad music)...and can't accept it when I show them how all they can really be saying with such as statement is that they "really, really don't like this song" or "it doesn't appeal" to them...because how could they be otherwise making a statement about the song “actually” sucking or being crap, or (as AC said) determining it's value? They can't according to their belief of no objectively good/bad music...ie. music that has no concept of value.
It's so simple...can't believe you don't get it.
Saying "this song is crap" or "this wine is crap", and suggesting that you said it to show you really don't like the song/wine makes sense.
Saying "this song is crap" or "this wine is crap" and suggesting that you've said what you've said because of what you've determined it's value to be (like AC does) makes no sense...let alone calling a person an idiot for having a different opinion than you
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Last edited by EPIIIBITES on May 12th, 2007 at 05:35 AM
Yes. Timbre, Pitch, Tempo, Dynamics (whether its loud or soft), etc.
Generally it would probably mean that I don't like the song. One cannot say a song sucks objectively because there is no such thing as a song in the external world. As I said, there are only soundwaves and how we interpret them.
You are aware that the word "quality" has more than one definition aren't you? I am not speaking on behalf of AC or anyone but myself so stop asking me what he was thinking.
No...that's what I'm saying!!! He doesn't use the same definition of "quality" you use.
His measure of quality "It's boring, dull, false" is ridiculous...and says a song sucks because those are the views and opinions he has of the quality of the song.
I'm agreeing with you that it's different
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Last edited by EPIIIBITES on May 12th, 2007 at 06:31 AM
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May 12th, 2007 04:26 AM
