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Alucard vs. Pyron
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ensatsu-ken
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonheartmm
i like the hellsing manga more than naruto or bleach manga. its overall more entertaining. although its lacking in the story/character development department. still loads of fun. the anime, is overdone n i dont like it so much. i like the character of alucard a LOT.

that isnt it.

the feats you stated dont give us an extent of his power. 4 tails/gaara/urochimaru/diedara/hokages/itachi have done far more impressive things than alucard. his familiras and unfairly weak.


I'm up to date with both the Naruto and Bleach manga, and I agree that the characters are quite strong, but I don't find there powers to be all that amazing. First off, 4-tailed Naruto (while not being the strongest Naruto character, he has shown us most of the strongest feats that we have seen from any Naruto character so far; considering that some have yet to reveal the full extent of their powers wink ) is basically when Kyuubi gets more control of Naruto's mind and body, due to his emotional state, during which time he literally acts like an animal, and doesn't even think about what he's doing (one example of this is how he can't distinguisn between friends and enemies when he's in that state; proof of that his how he attacked Sakura when she ran towards him to try and calm him down). He's strong alright, but just clawing and blasting at things wildly, didn't really do much to take down Orochimaru (and he ended up getting out of the fight in the same condition which he was previously in when he started the fight), and I highly doubt that it would do much against Alucard. As for Ichigo, while I do not like how he always seems to get rediculously stronger in a short amount of time whenever he needs to, I cannot deny this fact. the Bleach characters are definitely strong, and in the speed department, they definitely surpass any Hellsing character by a long shot. However, speed alone isn't going to do anything, unless they have the have the abilities to back it up. There spirit abilities are powerful, but please name one thing that a Bleach character has done, that you know FOR SURE, that Alucard would stand no chance again. Aside from destroying things with insane amounts/releases of spirit energy, they often don't seem to fight with any form of strategy, and at any rate, I have yet to see a single attack that they can do (and most of their attacks involve cutting, which so far, has proven to be a relatively useless form of attack against Alucard), which has the power to totally obliterate Alucard for good.

The bottom line is that I am neither saying that Naruto or Bleach characters are weak, nor am I saying that Alucard is that poweful (I do realize that he's hardly even close to being of the strongest manga/anime characters out there; and I also disliked him in the TV anime, just for the record). It just so happens that I find him to CURRENTLY be above the levels of most Naruto and Bleach characters, based on their abilities. And I am taking characters like Jiraiya, Itachi, and Pein (from Naruto), as well as characters like Aizen, Uluquiorra, The 1st Espada (who I can't seem to recall the name of at the moment stick out tongue ), and Nell (from Bleach), all into account; but I just can't really see what's so impressive about any of them (from what they have shown of their abilties so far), that is powerful enough to wipe out Alucard. that's my opinion, and its going to be pretty hard to change that, unless you have some definite proof that Naruto and Bleach characters would be able to completely crush Alucard.


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Old Post Sep 28th, 2007 03:10 AM
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Violent2Dope
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Kenny with a casual swing in Bleach cut a building in half. Aizen with a kido completely obliterated a giant Hollow.


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Old Post Sep 28th, 2007 09:49 AM
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ensatsu-ken
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Kenny with a casual swing in Bleach cut a building in half. Aizen with a kido completely obliterated a giant Hollow.


I'm aware of that, but that wouldn't kill Alucard if they simply just used that on him, and I'm pretty sure that you know that. They would need to do something a lot more powerful than that in order to take down Alucard, and I'm sure that you know that as well.


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Old Post Sep 28th, 2007 11:09 PM
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by ensatsu-ken
I'm aware of that, but that wouldn't kill Alucard if they simply just used that on him, and I'm pretty sure that you know that. They would need to do something a lot more powerful than that in order to take down Alucard, and I'm sure that you know that as well.
How would Alucaed even hurt Kenny? He took a released Zanpakuto from Ichigo to the chest without a scratch. Also, you said that Alucard can die from being heart stabbed, Kenny is one of the best in SS swordsmanship-wise, and is very physically large, strong, and has good overall speed and ferocity, he could do it.


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Old Post Sep 29th, 2007 03:12 AM
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ensatsu-ken
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
How would Alucaed even hurt Kenny? He took a released Zanpakuto from Ichigo to the chest without a scratch. Also, you said that Alucard can die from being heart stabbed, Kenny is one of the best in SS swordsmanship-wise, and is very physically large, strong, and has good overall speed and ferocity, he could do it.


I corrected myself earlier, and said that his heart had to be "impaled," which doesn't exactly have the same meaning as stabbed. Also, Kenpachi would first need to know that he has to go directly for Alucard's heart, and even then, Alucard could just keep summoning his minions. And how would Alucard hurt Kenpachi, you ask? Well, knowing Kenpachi, he wouldn't run away from anything, and he would most definitely try and take on anything that Alucard threw at him. First of all, if we're assuming that Alucard can see and touch Bleach characters, than Alucard could release CARS Level 0, and have a sword to fight with. However, he also has his CARS Levl 1 release, which released the black hound (as I remember Walter calling it). Unless Kenpachi knows that he needs to sever it directly down the middle, which he doesn't, his cuts on it would be useless, since it always adjusts and reattatches itself in several different places, as you have seen before, I'm sure. Seeing as he wouldn't run away, Alucard could just swallow him up. But, if that's not good enough for you, then going back to the sword, while Alucard isn't nearly as fast as Kenpachi, his sword could still wound him (and I know that you're thinking it would just be futile, like Ichigo couldn't cut Kenpachi due to not being able to release enough of his spirit energy; however, Alucard doesn't have spirit energy, and as you've placed Bleach characters against other ones, you have made compromises for them not having spirit energy, so I don't see why you can't do the same for Alucard). Still, even so, Alucard is extremely powerful in comparison to many mang and anime charcters, even if he is nowhere close to even remotely being the strongest anime character. In this aspect, we know that he is not ordinary, and the sword he got though his abilitiy is not ordinary either, so it must be stronger than just some average sword (just like how his guns are strong to the point in which they cannot be handled by any human). Getting back to how he would hit Kenpachi; all he would have to do is let Kenpachi attack him, and when Kenpachi stopped for a moment, believing that he has won, Alucard could immediately regenerate and slash at Kenpachi.

But, hey, even if you find that sword bit farfetched, he still has the black hound, which I don't really see Kenpachi trying to avoid. Also, even if you don't think Alucard can hurt Kenpachi, the same still goes vice versa, in that Kenpachi does not know that he needs to go for Alucard's heart (I doubt that he even knows what a vampire is stick out tongue ), and even if he did, Alucard could prevent it by either going intangible, or summoning his minions to get in the way of Kenpachi's sword (and he can summon them in the thousands if you remember), or he could take the form of the black hound, in which case it would be nearly impossible to tell where his heart is located (as in Kenpachi wouldn't know where to stab, and it has to be a direct hit). So, he basically has plenty of ways in which to deal with Kenpachi. It might not be so easy for him to take him down, but it would be even harder for Kenpachi to take him down, which is why Alucard has the advantage here, IMO.


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Old Post Sep 29th, 2007 02:16 PM
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leonheartmm
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u forget. any slice/cut/damage based in any level of mystical power really damages alucard. chakra/reitsu is exactly that.

Old Post Sep 29th, 2007 04:20 PM
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonheartmm
u forget. any slice/cut/damage based in any level of mystical power really damages alucard. chakra/reitsu is exactly that.
Yep.


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Old Post Sep 29th, 2007 04:31 PM
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ensatsu-ken
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonheartmm
u forget. any slice/cut/damage based in any level of mystical power really damages alucard. chakra/reitsu is exactly that.


Really now confused ? I don't ever recall seeing that in the manga or the anime. I recall that holy and/or blessed weapons, such as Father Anderson's Bayonetts, or things in the form of crosses, like steaks (I'm getting this part from Bram Stoker's Dracula, since Alucard is technically supposed to have been that very Dracula, according to the author, Kouta Hirano), were all harful to Alucard. However I never heard that Spirit Energy or or Chakra was the same thing as a holy or blessed weapon. Perhaps I missed some part in Hellsing that mentions that roll eyes (sarcastic) .

Once again, I'm not saying that Alucard is that strong, or that Bleach or Naruto characters are weak. But you guys keep insisting that Alucard is overrated, when I can't help but feel that you are underrating him a little bit, while thinking a tad bit too highly of the abilities of the Naruto and Bleach characters at the same time. Bleach characters seem more impressive with their huge releases of Spirit Energy and there speed, while Naruto characters also seem very impressive with their multiple techniques. However, I have seen all of those, and being mostly up to date with the manga of both series, I do not see how any of those would obliterate Alucard, like you guys are claiming. Maybe it may have been harsh of me to say that he would crush every Naruto and Bleach character, so I'll admit that I was wrong on that. However, I still do think that he is at least a little bit above their level, from what they have shown of us their abilities so far.


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Old Post Sep 30th, 2007 02:30 AM
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I don't think chakra would necessarily be all that effective against Alucard, but when it comes down to it high level Bleach characters are basically designed to take out Alucard. After all most of his power comes from his hundreds of trapped souls, and his ability to cope with all physical damage. However when it comes down to zanpaktou are designed to send spirits to the next life, and have been shown capable of taking down and purifying creatures composed of thousands of souls. (Aka, meno's and arrancar)


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Old Post Sep 30th, 2007 02:48 AM
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leonheartmm
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chakra is the same as reitsu/holy energy in the respective realm. or ki. holy is MYSTICAL energy. that is all. and alucard is harmed by it. besides any water element naruto jutsu wud destroy alucard.

yes alucard is overrated.

Old Post Sep 30th, 2007 12:43 PM
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ensatsu-ken
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonheartmm
chakra is the same as reitsu/holy energy in the respective realm. or ki. holy is MYSTICAL energy. that is all. and alucard is harmed by it. besides any water element naruto jutsu wud destroy alucard.

yes alucard is overrated.


I have read nearly all of Naruto and Bleach up to date, and you are pretty much just making that up, because their forms of energy was never referred to as holy energy. And you have absolutely no proof that such energy could harm Alucard. If anything, you are overrating the Naruto and Bleach characters. Alucard may be overrated, but you are only proving that the Bleach and Naruto characters are far more overrated in terms of their abilities. In fact, even if those did count as holy energy, it wouldn't matter, because as I've stated before, Alucard has been hit by Father Anderson's "holy" bayonetts, and has even chewed on a cross, which he said himself, that not many freaks can bite on them and come back for seconds. Hell, the guy even handels holy weapons himself (his bullets are made out of a melted cross). But still, you have no evidence to show that those energy forms would be considered holy in the realm of Hellsing, and they were never referred to as holy in their own respective realms. Maybe it was something like "sacred" energy from YYH, it might be considered holy, but it was never stated otherwise in either Naruto or Bleach.

So yeah, Narto and Bleach character get far more overrated than Alucard.


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Old Post Sep 30th, 2007 02:43 PM
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leonheartmm
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you dont understand mystical energy rei/reitsu/chakra. it hurts EVERYTHING including the spirit. alucard was nearly killed by anderson with helena's nail. u forgot that. that was mystical energy.

Old Post Sep 30th, 2007 06:56 PM
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Violent2Dope
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Kenny just picks Alucard up, and rips his heart right out.


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PYRON WOULD WIPE THE FLOOR WITH STORM LULZ!

Old Post Sep 30th, 2007 08:41 PM
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ensatsu-ken
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonheartmm
you dont understand mystical energy rei/reitsu/chakra. it hurts EVERYTHING including the spirit. alucard was nearly killed by anderson with helena's nail. u forgot that. that was mystical energy.


No he wasn't. It was painful for him, and it brought him to some of his old memories as a human, but it didn't nearly kill him. It really only set him in a trance. If you remember, Alucard said that monster is meant to be defeated by man, and the moment that Father Anderson became a monster, he has pretty much sealed his fate.

Once again, you are only assuming that there form of magic will have some holy affect on Alucard. You have absolutely not proof or evidence that shows that it can affect him the same way a holy weapon would (and those are all related to something religious; chakra and spirit energy are not). So, I did not forget anything.

Actually, you seem to have forgotten, or completely ignored, the part of my previous post that said that holy energy is useless unless you strike Alucard in the right place.


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Last edited by ensatsu-ken on Sep 30th, 2007 at 11:37 PM

Old Post Sep 30th, 2007 11:33 PM
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ensatsu-ken
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Kenny just picks Alucard up, and rips his heart right out.


He doesn't know thath e has to go after Alucard's heart. Also, Alucard would chew him up and turn him into dog....well, you know what stick out tongue.....before he had a chance to do that.

This pretty much proves that Bleach characters are more overrated than anyone from Hellsing.


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Old Post Sep 30th, 2007 11:35 PM
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by ensatsu-ken
He doesn't know thath e has to go after Alucard's heart. Also, Alucard would chew him up and turn him into dog....well, you know what stick out tongue.....before he had a chance to do that.

This pretty much proves that Bleach characters are more overrated than anyone from Hellsing.
Kenny cut a building in half, yep, that is pretty much the basis for my argument. stick out tongue


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Old Post Sep 30th, 2007 11:52 PM
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ensatsu-ken
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Kenny cut a building in half, yep, that is pretty much the basis for my argument. stick out tongue


Alucard summonned an army of the undead. Together, they would probably be at least 3 times larger than that 1 building, which I saw him cut down stick out tongue . Also, what's your point, Cutting is cutting. If Kenpachi was to use that on Alucard, it would simply only cut him, in which case he could easily regnerate himself wink .

Anyways, its been pretty clear to me that I am never going to agree with you guys, and vice versa roll eyes (sarcastic) . So, I have an idea for a simple solution: How about we just agree to disagree?


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Old Post Oct 1st, 2007 02:27 AM
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leonheartmm
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your putting limits on MYSTICAL power. holy vs non holy. by that argument PYRON cant kill him either. nor can thor or superman. he has been damaged before by both HOLY and DEMONIC artifacts/energy. its just a way of saying he isnt impervious to MAGICAL TYPE attacks. and thats exactly what reitsu and chakra is{u dont honestly beleive alucard stands a chance against aizen/kyuubi/goku/yasuke do u?}

Old Post Oct 1st, 2007 01:27 PM
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ensatsu-ken
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by leonheartmm
your putting limits on MYSTICAL power. holy vs non holy. by that argument PYRON cant kill him either. nor can thor or superman. he has been damaged before by both HOLY and DEMONIC artifacts/energy. its just a way of saying he isnt impervious to MAGICAL TYPE attacks. and thats exactly what reitsu and chakra is{u dont honestly beleive alucard stands a chance against aizen/kyuubi/goku/yasuke do u?}


Uhhh....you honestly aren't listening to a word that I have been saying, have you? He has only been damaged by Holy items, which almost always have some relation to something religious. Even so, Chakra and Spirit Energy are not Holy energy, and you are just completely making that up. That is not to say that he cannot be harmed by it, but its not something that can easily kill him, unless you have a lot of it to use, like Goku and Yusuke (and I never said that he could beat either Goku or Yusuke, so stop making stuff up). There is nothing in Hellsing that sais "Magic" affects Alucard, and most certainly not bad enough to make the slightest touch of Spirit Energy or Chakra totally obliterate Alucard, as you seem to be suggesting. If its something like a strong Kamehameha wave from Goku, or a DOTDF from Hiei (just to name a few of many examples, since I CLEARLY said that Alucard is not nearly the strongest manga/anime character out there, but what you have been ingoring in each of my posts (making it out to be as if I'm claiming that he's on the level of a god or something), would easily destroy Alucard, since those types of attacks would pretty much insinerate every cell (or whatever he's made up of) in his body, leaving absolutely nothing of him left. Superman could kill him in plenty of ways; for example, I'm sure he could do something like throwing Alucard into the Sun, which would obviously obliterate Alucard into nothing as well (and I'm aware that Alucard would not stand a chance against him either). Aizen has not shown us the full extent of his powers, but if you were paying attention to my posts, I also clearly stated that he would defeat Naruto and Bleach characters from what they have currently shows us of their abilities so far, as a whole. So, yes, while he's not nearly the strongest character out there, he is definitely more powerful than what you are giving him credit for (and you most certainly did not credit him for much, and exaggerated him being weak, by saying that he was not capable of much, when you know that he has done more than the 2 things that you have listed, and just came up with excuses for the other ones that I listed).

You see what I mean, if you actually bothered to read the last part of my post above you, I said what I said for a reason. I can tell that I am never going to get you to agree with me, and the same goes for you trying to get me to agree with you. So, why bother arguing over this if none of us is going to come to an agreement. I mean, you have your mind set on thinking that Alucard is extremely overrated, and I have my mind set on thinking that Naruto and Bleach characters are overrated (and your pretty much strengthening my opinion in that aspect).


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Old Post Oct 1st, 2007 07:23 PM
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Aizen will catch Alucard in an illusion and pierce his heart, or he would seal him, or obliterate him with a kido.


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Old Post Oct 1st, 2007 09:22 PM
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