Surfer vs Sundipped Superman is still Surfers fight to lose imo.
He's not gonna see a guy glowing/burning with all this clear to see Solar energy, and go in punching.
He'd drain him, claiming that while Superman may be powerful, his is the power cosmic, to which even a suns might must obey.
All Star Superman is a similar case, only he'd overload him and likely put him into a coma.
PC Superman is Superman all the way.
And is it me, or do the Superman supporters make it seem as if Surfer draining Superman of his powers is a bullshits and tricks way of winning a fight?
If he doesn't outpunch him, it's pussy right?
Wrong.
If Darkseid with a handwave turned Superman from top tier to human level, that'd be a clear addition to his respect thread.
Surfer does the same thing, and it gets the "only wins if he power drains!!" clause.
Fool, where i come from, that'd be called an owning.
Surfer....holding the power of life and death over Superman, in his hands....good stuff.
Surfer is able to mentally calculate the trajectory of a being in mid teleportation(not just moving fast, actually teleporting) and attack it upon its arrival http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/...98902312rp5.jpg
Neither Toyman nor Lex Luthor have superspeed, and both have tagged PC Supes plenty of times.
Based on...
Wrong. Basic knowledge of opponents assures that Surfer won't have to do ANY of that. He doesn't have to "discover" Supes weaknesses because they're well known by the population of his home planet. The only thing Surfer MIGHT have to use Cosmic Awareness for is discovering the exact composition of K-nite, but that'll be easy enough to do if Surfer weakens him with red sun radiation first(and red sunlight is something Surfer can replicate with EASE).
The fight starts in a NEUTRAL eviorment, so there WILL be K-nite in existence.
Also, if he shot a blast that would have destroyed a planet at Surfer, and it didn't affect him... what does that say about his durability (especially since it was heat)?
Where is this scan saying galactus made him immune to heat...and even if he is heat vision has tons of physical force behind it as well,...and whats the difference between superboy and superman....pc supes is even stronger and faster,it is a quantifiable speed feat...crossing multiple universes..supes was faster then pc flash so again he would be faster then norrin in a fight,surfer isnt going to be pulling red sun radiation blasts in the first micro second of the match,and isnt going to whipping k-nite up on the fly when pc supes the guy who travels multiverse,tows galaxies of planets and takes 100s of galaxies worth of energy attacks without even having a bloody lip is after him,surfer isnt beating pc supes its that goddamn simple.
It says he can survive planet destroyers...not that he can take a punch from a guy who can move whole galaxies with physical strength or who blows out solar systems with sneezes...
That was a comic fight,this is a battledome fight so superman can use his speed and ridiculous power to its full extent,his universe sealing heat vision,galaxy towing,solar system sneezing,multiverse infinity breaking speed...I dont see at all how surfer gets a single win in this fight.
You do realize "CIS" applies to the forum, right, and I've never seen PC Supes use any of the bullsheet you've mentioned in a fight (which is the only thing that counts).
Kthnxbia.
Anyway...
That blast would have "reduced an entire world to a smoldering cinder".
That never said how much it could actually destroy, just that it would have wiped out a planet.
Plus, Surfer said it "CANNOT" harm him. I'm not saying Surfer's completely immune to heat, but he's pretty damn resilient.
I never actually posted it in the respect thread because I thought it was common enough knowledge that I didn't need to. But now that I know there are people questioning it I'll track it down again.
Cool. Show me how much.
Because they're different characters so feats for one don't carry over. And I'm pretty sure I've seen scans stating that Superboy was actually the more powerful of the two, but I could be mistaken on that one.
It's no more quantifiable than Hulk holding the matter/anti-matter sphere's separated, Thor and Herc sealing a dimensional rift by punching each others fist's, or Sentry containing a cosmic cube.
And what are PC Flash's uber feats that are more impressive than Norrin's to suggest that?
Why can't he if he has nanosecond reflexes?
Again, it wouldn't have to be on the fly if Surfer weakens him with red sun first. Surfer would be able to do it at his leisure when Supes is powerless.
For the majority, no. But he CAN pull some wins.
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Last edited by darthgoober on Oct 22nd, 2007 at 03:09 AM
Eh, surfer has a boatload of ridiculous powers. he actually could pull out a win or two vs. PC superman.
1.) Surfer can go intangible at any time, avoiding superman's attacks at will.
2.) Surfer can shrink himself down to sub microscopic size, while keeping the full range of his abilities. He did this vs. red shift, and a few times when he needed to enter the microverse. It's a perfectly valid tactic to shrink to submicroscopic size, then eliminate superman from the inside. the Atom used this tactic to kill Darkseid once.
3.) Surfer is, again..a massively versatile energy user. If draining superman isn't an option, he can simply radiate red solar energy omnidirectionally, weakening superman as the fight drags on.
4.) Surfer is perfectly capable of absorbing/destroying the sun, depriving superman of his primary power source. the sun goes nova or gets absorbed, and he just uses speed and intangibility to wait until supes simply runs out of power.
5.) Surfer is a massively powerful and experienced matter manipulator. what's to stop him from turning the ground to a variety of kryptonites (red, green, gold, take your pick) or the air around superman into adamantium? If you doubt just HOW good at it he is, Surfer managed to reconstruct a city around himself to repair the damage while simultaneously fighting (and beating) godlike cable at high speeds.
Either one of these two could win depending on the situation. don't sell surfer short.
Last edited by Space M ummy on Oct 22nd, 2007 at 03:11 AM
Bullshit fights are the only that counts my ass,they are feats within his powers there is no reason at all he cant use them in a fight,I hope your kidding about the hulk thing,and taking planet destroying attacks are still nothing compared to the power supes can conjure up.
Both of these guys are fast as hell but speed is not the issue here but acceleration from 0 and reflexes. Even if an object has a very small acceleration then it can still reach any speed imaginable, provided that it accelerates long enough.
So its possible for both Superman and the Silver Surfer to reach any speed they like provided they accelerate long enough. Flash, on the other hand, has a slightly higher acceleration than Supes when moving. That is why he is said to be faster.
So from now on, when certain characters are said to be faster than others then what is meant is that they have a higher acceleration than the other and not top speed.
Silver Surfer has some good acceleration. But superman does have mega acceleration and reflexes though. Its just that, IMO, I think Supes can accelerate to a speed faster than SS can respond. Thus its possible for Supes to get in the first strike. Now both can reach any speed they like, but that doesn't matter. It's just that out of all the SS comics I've read and seen, I'm not convinced that SS has the instant speed/acceleration from 0 and reflexes to prevent Superman from striking first.
So I believe that its definitely possible for Supes to win, especially if Supes, after the first hit, strings in a combo to the point of ko. This is because if Supes hits and affects SS with the first hit (something that Supes is fast and strong enough to do) then he is also fast enough to string in another hit before SS can recover, and then another, and another until Silver Surfer is koed. See the combos in the Street Fighter II video game for more understanding of this. But this would be one heck of a match up though.
Well, if Superman has hundreds of "obscure" feats, but he never uses them in fights, then shouldn't that apply to the forum as well?
Otherwise we'd have Surfer phasing hand through everything (which, by the way, he has repeated... multiple times, but not really in fights).
Plus, I don't really see what towing a galaxy worth of planets has to do with anything... is he going to tow Surfer?
Well if you want to go by top end feats ONLY rather than the character's average...
1. A WEAKENED Surfer briefly matched Thanos's power output.
2. Surfer's power output was sufficient to create a black hole as a side effect.
3. Surfer took down a Watcher
4. Surfer stalemated Korvac
5. Surfer took down two Galactus level beings
6. Surfer took down an Eternity level being
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Last edited by darthgoober on Oct 22nd, 2007 at 03:21 AM
check the respect thread. surfer has nanosecond level reaction times. There's no realistic way for superman to blitz him.
Keep in mind also that surfer can phase through solid matter. he doesn't even HAVE to dodge to avoid superman's attacks. But what happens if surfer phases his board and rematerializes it THROUGH superman?
Except almost all those are not with surfers own power,while what im talking about is everyday pc supes normal powers,unless surfer has a crunch to feed on its not really making a difference.
1. Was an "as is" feat, he matched Thanos
2. Another "as is" feat.
3. Surfer was upgraded by the Blackbody, but he never got rid of the upgrade so he still has it.
4. Another "as is" feat.
5. He fought them with his own power first, and channeled the crunch after he was injured. But seeing as how it's within Surfer's POWER to channel the Crunch, you can't really invalidate the feat.
6. Again, it was the Blackbody that allowed Surfer to absorb enough energy to match the Uni-lord, but he never got rid of it.
Matching thanos is impressive...but then I remember supes heat vision can seal half or more of a universe...and can take 100s of galaxies worth of energy and be fine,blackhole is nothing impressive to pc supes,I really dont remember a wacther ever getting taken down so please post a scan of that,Im still not seeing korvac throwing out pc supes level attacks,he wasnt really matching aegis and tenebrous more like blasting them to no effect and yes I can invalidate that feat because he only won because a huge outer energy source that he wouldnt have in this fight,surfer doesnt waltz around at uni-lord level far from it actually.
Surfer doesn't have nanosecond level reaction. For that scan had him speak whole sentences to himself before he broke out. Second, it is silly to even say nanosecond reaction time. For reaction time is the time it takes for one to respond to something the moment it started to exist. Surfer was already in that device awhile and trying to get out. So there is no nanosecond reaction here. Also, Surfer won't be phasing if Supes gets in the first hit right away.
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Oct 22nd, 2007 02:42 AM
