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Home » Comic Book Forums » Comic Book 'Respect' Forum » Phoenix Respect Thread Remastered. (V. 20)

Phoenix Respect Thread Remastered. (V. 20)
Started by: id369

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GalacticStorm
Smart Alec Know-It-All

Gender: Male
Location: United Kingdom

Being a Phoenix an wielder of the Phoenix Force is stated to be the "ultimate mutation" the pinnacle of evolution. A power of a Phoenix is unparallelled telekinesis to give complete and total control over matter and energy at a phenomenal scale. ("Telekinetic Godhood")

Jean as Phoenix perceives things beyond surface level right down to the component parts which compose matter and energy:

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Throughout New X-men Jeans telekinesis consistently grew as the Phoenix within began to manifest once again.

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It expands until it becomes more than just an expression of her thoughts physically but until Jeans mind becomes in touch with all her surroundings.


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Old Post Jan 10th, 2008 06:58 PM
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GalacticStorm
Smart Alec Know-It-All

Gender: Male
Location: United Kingdom

Her telekinesis becomes in sync with matter right down to its component parts:

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Jean gains total control of matter down to the molecular level allowing her to generate any energy, shape or create any matter:

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Old Post Jan 10th, 2008 06:58 PM
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GalacticStorm
Smart Alec Know-It-All

Gender: Male
Location: United Kingdom

Rachel hears a psychic cry from baby Nathan(Cable) and flys off in a burst of energy to rescue him:

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Thinking about her brother, Rachel subconsciously recreated Kitty in his image as she flew off:

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The others claim how that that was a facet of the original Phoenix's(Jean) power, to rearrange reality around her to coincide with her conscious and subconscious desires:

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Old Post Jan 10th, 2008 07:00 PM
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Neo Darkhalen
Mission zero

Gender: Male
Location:

Can I post some classic pics of Phoenix.

BTW: this is a good thread; a good phoenix respect thread, best one by far.

thumb up

Old Post Jan 11th, 2008 11:31 AM
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"Id"
The Man of Tomorrow

Gender: Unspecified
Location: Diablo Corps

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Neo Darkhalen
Can I post some classic pics of Phoenix.

BTW: this is a good thread; a good phoenix respect thread, best one by far.

thumb up


Go for it, I have Storm Phoenix. But I am afraid of posting it. confused


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Old Post Jan 14th, 2008 01:01 AM
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Neo Darkhalen
Mission zero

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Hmmm I can see the trouble, perhaps if you post just a few...

Old Post Jan 14th, 2008 01:11 PM
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Mr Master
Junior Member

Gender: Male
Location: somewhere within time & space

quote: (post)
Originally posted by id369
Hush you, or else the non believer will come in
and disrupt the flow of this clean and informative respect thread.

You might've noticed I never touched your thread my boy,
but don't hink I didn't notice this subtle allusion.
quote: (post)
Originally posted by id369
Do me a favor If it comes to that, ignore his posts.

I could care less about the exaggerations and mis-interpretations taking place in here potna,
but now that this biatch put my name into it,
it's time to clear things up. smile
quote: (post)
Originally posted by id369
PS - freaking bio was never needed, the comic itself stated universe.

Freakin bio doesn't prove or change anything. smile

The Phoenix Force has always been a "Universal power"

did yall just discover that? laughing out loud

But,

in "Here Comes Tomorrow"

Jean did NOT manipulate the atoms of 616 Universe, (in any way, shape or form)

It is clearly stated in the Official Marvel bios,
it was the "Alternate Future of Reality 15104" (the Future of a Timeline)

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"In ONE Future, Phoenix severed the Alternate Future ... OF ... Reality - 15104"
...........................................................................................

Yall can spin it all yall want ...

You don't want me in your thread, that fine,
but tell those kids to stop using my name in it.


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Old Post Jan 16th, 2008 01:44 AM
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Mr Master
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Gender: Male
Location: somewhere within time & space

quote: (post)
Originally posted by id369
The comic states Orphan Universe, Mr. M tagged it as Baby Universe.
One has to understand, where the reference of orphan comes from.
Its an entire Universe plucked out from the Multiverse,
how could it be an Orphan? Oh…the relationship of Universe and Multiverse.

Every Universe baby or not is connected to the Marvel Omniverse.

Or the relationship of Timeline and Universe it's connected to.
quote: (post)
Originally posted by id369
Basically Jean ascends to the White Hot Room,
plucking out the future reality of 15104, and cures it.

I agree.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by id369
But the Phoenix Force was not contempt to how things ended up
since reality 15104 is the direct future of 616.

Not necessarily, it is a "possible" Future,
many "possible" Futures in Marvel.

I could give you a plethora of a realities set in the Future, even right now.
quote: (post)
Originally posted by id369
So Phoenix manifested the entire 616 reality in the palm of her hand,
and administers reality adjustment.
Scoot leaving the institute never happens, so Here Comes Tomorrow never comes to pass.

I completely disagree.

This is how it went down:

....................................................................................................

Jean Amputates the Future of Reality 15104 and Repairs it in the WHR:

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"Hospital White Hot" ... "Grow better Future"

....................................................................................................


Jean STILL hasn't done anything to Reality 15104.


After Repairing the Future of Reality 15104, PF says,

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"Telekinetic control of all those atoms at once ian't as easy as it sounds,

not even for a White Phoenix of the Crown"


++++++++++++++++++++++

There you have it, it was the reparation to the Future of Reality 15104,
that Jean manipulated atomically. yes

++++++++++++++++++++++
....................................................................................................


Now Reality 15104 appears in Jean's hands,
Jean doesn't know what it is, or what to do with it:

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....................................................................................................

Jean still hasn't done a thing to Reality 15104.

In the last Panel, Jean finally does something:

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"Live Scott"
....................................................................................................


And what does Jean do?

What did she do when she said, "Live Scott?"

Jean went into the Past, changed Scott's mind about his life, Emma & the X-Men,
and then Scott's decision Alters Reality 15104.


According to Grant Morrison: (the Writer of this arc)

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(excerpt from the Questionnaires addressed to the Writers, last page New X-Men #155)
....................................................................................................


On Panel verification:

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I guess ol' MORRISON wasn't lying about the Story HE CREATED.


....................................................................................................


There's no assurance that 616 would ever become 15104.

For there's a slew of Realities taking place Far beyond 150 years as we speak,
all these Realities are "Possible Future Timelines"

We'll never know until the time comes,
this is why these Timelines are enclosed in their own Reality apart from the 616 Universe.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by id369

The thing that makes it silly is,
that Phoenix did not have to manifest a universe,
and have total control of the atoms within it.
Not if it meant, to change the mind of a simple mutant.

It's not silly, its that she Never did that.

Jean simply went into the Past,
which is easily accomplished withIN the WHR (outside of Space/Time)

Jean then mind rapes Scott,
and Scott's decision alters the Future of Reality 15104.

The power was ALL in Scott's decision.

quote: (post)
Originally posted by id369
But its worthy feat (making up for the Xorn crap).

Never existed.

Now the Xorn crap, is 100% Canon.

Referenced across THREE separate Arcs,
and corroborated/confirmed in the PF's offiicial Handbook.b


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Last edited by Mr Master on Jan 16th, 2008 at 02:02 AM

Old Post Jan 16th, 2008 01:57 AM
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Mr Master
Junior Member

Gender: Male
Location: somewhere within time & space

Phoenix never held an entire Universe in her hands and made amputations to it.

With PREP (Seven pages to be exact)

Jean amputated the Alternate Future of Reality 15104.

Reality 15104 is 150 years old,
how can this be compared to 616 which has been expanding for Billions of years?

Reality 15104 is a possible Future of Reality 616.

Reality 15104's Future, NOT 616's ...
is what Jean amputated and Repaired in the WHR atomically.

Jean never did anything to Reality 15104 which manifested in her hands.

(read X-Men #154)

At the end of the issue (#154) Jean goes back in time,
changes Scott's mind about Emma & the X-Men,
this then Alters the possible Future of 616.

So essentially it was Scott's decision that created and Altered 15104, not Jean.

Jean ONLY manipulated Scott's decision,
but the power to alter that Reality laid in Scott's mind.
.........................................................................................


BTW.

Uatu did the same thing with Reality 311 (the year 1602 of the 616 Universe)

Uatu held it in his hands, and then placed that entire Universe within himself.

That entire Universe of course was a Timeline just like Jean's,
and a "Tiny" one at that, because it was a young Reality just like Jean's 15104.

........................................................................................

Uatu holding and placing a Timeline - Reality 311 (the year 1602) inside himself:

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"I place the High Tribunal's gift inside me; A Tiny Universe"



The High Tribunal Watcher didn't just repair this entire Universe laughing out loud uhh, Timeline,
he actually Re-Created it, from nothingness:

........................................................................................


All Timelines are universes, I've never denied that.
But Timelines because of their infancy and untimely existence are tiny/baby universes,
they are universes nontheless,

but there's a huge difference
between a Universe that's been expanding for billions of years,
and a universe that's barely over 150 years old.

This is why Uatu can also hold Timelines in his hands like marbels.


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Old Post Jan 16th, 2008 02:19 AM
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Mr Master
Junior Member

Gender: Male
Location: somewhere within time & space

quote: (post)
Originally posted by Mr Master
....................................................................................................

Jean still hasn't done a thing to Reality 15104.

In the last Panel, Jean finally does something:

(please log in to view the image)

"Live Scott"
....................................................................................................


And what does Jean do?

What did she do when she said, "Live Scott?"

Jean went into the Past, changed Scott's mind about his life, Emma & the X-Men,
and then Scott's decision Alters Reality 15104.


According to Grant Morrison: (the Writer of this arc)

(please log in to view the image)
(excerpt from the Questionnaires addressed to the Writers, last page New X-Men #155)
....................................................................................................


On Panel verification:

(please log in to view the image)

(please log in to view the image)


I guess ol' MORRISON wasn't lying about the Story HE CREATED.


....................................................................................................

I guess to conclude this debate once and for all, I also noticed this:


After Prep!

Jean took Sublime out of Beast (this disinfected the Future of Reality 15104)

Then Jean teleported to the WHR (Hospital) for Realities.

Jean heals "wounded orphan universe"

How?

By "Symbolically watering it with her heart's blood" ...

What does that mean?


(What it has always meant On Panel in bios and according to Grant Morrison himself)


Jean went into the Past ... forced Scott to stay with the X-Men & Emma,

and ... that's it.

.....................................

Notice the official "Here Comes Tomorrow" Bio literally states ...

... IT WAS Scott's decision that Altered Reality 15104 ...

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"In the modern era of Earth-616 ...

Cyclops took up the responsibility of running the X Institute ...

unknowingly ensuring that at least One apocalyptic Future ...

would Not come to fruition" ...

.................................................................................


That'll be all ... peace & love yall


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Last edited by Mr Master on Jan 16th, 2008 at 07:38 AM

Old Post Jan 16th, 2008 07:33 AM
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starlock
Team Authority

Gender: Male
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Great respect thread, kudos to all involved

I wish Mr Masters could just leave it alone, and debate these issues in the proper thread.Is it possible to take out his post? the flow of information is disrupted by his attempt at debating


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Old Post Jan 16th, 2008 03:09 PM
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Sundipped
MURDERER

Gender: Male
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quote: (post)
Originally posted by starlock
Great respect thread, kudos to all involved

I wish Mr Masters could just leave it alone, and debate these issues in the proper thread.Is it possible to take out his post? the flow of information is disrupted by his attempt at debating


Yes indeed. That's the reason this thread was supposed to be REMASTERED. . Good job guys. Mr. Master could u please take your references to the vs. board.

Old Post Jan 16th, 2008 07:24 PM
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Digi
Forum Leader

Gender: Unspecified
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Moderator

I'll agree with the majority in this situation. Master, leave it for either the vs. forum, your hierarchy thread, or even occasional (but not overwhelming) posts in the "Mythbuster" thread.

Any subsequent posts intended as debate-provoking will be edited.

As for others, if Master has a point, don't try to play off a character as higher than they are. Truth, not exagerration, is always preferable.


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Old Post Jan 16th, 2008 10:17 PM
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Mr Master
Junior Member

Gender: Male
Location: somewhere within time & space

To Digi, I never wanted to post in here, I never have,
no offense to the thread but thankfully from what I've seen
no one really pays any mind to it in the vs threads,
everyone pretty much know the real deal.

Anyway,

this is WHY I posted in this thread Digi ...

(I will never post here again, but let me clear my name ... Watch the hypocrisy)

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/...mp;pagenumber=2
quote: (post)
Originally posted by id369

Hush you, or else the non believer will come in
and disrupt the flow of this clean and informative respect thread.

Do me a favor If it comes to that, ignore his posts.


quote: (post)
Originally posted by Xplosive

So, it wasn't only orphan (which Mr Master so confidently thought it was),


quote: (post)
Originally posted by GalacticStorm

So much for Mr Masters claims that it was a


..........................................................................................................

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/...mp;pagenumber=3

quote: (post)
Originally posted by id369

Orphan Universe, Mr. M tagged it as Baby Universe. One has to understand,



..........................................................................................................


Quite different now when we see the big picture laid out for us .... ey Digi?


These cats are literally having a discussion about my views openly in This thread,
full of condescension, plus, discrediting my established interpretations.

On this one, you know I'm right ... You don't do that in a "Respect Thread"

You make your opinions known (right or wrong) and keep it at that.
..........................................................................................................

quote: (post)
Originally posted by starlock
Great respect thread, kudos to all involved

I wish Mr Masters could just leave it alone,
and debate these issues in the proper thread.
Is it possible to take out his post?
the flow of information is disrupted by his attempt at debating

The usual suspects in the arena of hypocrites never fails us.

Why didn't you make a comment about how it was THEM that started the debate?

All you saw was your opportunity to shine against Mr Master ... laughing out loud
quote: (post)
Originally posted by Sundipped
Mr. Master could u please take your references to the vs. board.

Same goes for you homie,
why aren't you telling the thread started not to incite Mr Master
into coming in here and making a point,
Mr Master's NAME is being tossed in a derogatory (fallacious) conversation between spam man, and himself concerning what I Then, POSTED in Here.

So they have the right to amuse the public with My Name in This thread

but I don't get to defend it though?

Right? .... Fascism? smile


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Last edited by Mr Master on Jan 16th, 2008 at 11:29 PM

Old Post Jan 16th, 2008 11:25 PM
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"Id"
The Man of Tomorrow

Gender: Unspecified
Location: Diablo Corps

So can we have these posted edited or deleted?


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Old Post Jan 17th, 2008 04:20 AM
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Digi
Forum Leader

Gender: Unspecified
Location:

Moderator

Master, by now you must realize that your heavy-handed and elaborate style ends up offending and/or intimidating many, or at least turning them off from it. I could care less about the validity of your conclusions. From all I've seen, they're very calculated and for the most part correct. But that clearly isn't the issue.

And sure, it runs both ways, so others should stop trying to incite you to debate. But nothing I saw in those posts counts as anything against forum rules, so quit trying to pass the blame when it's clear you've overstepped the bounds of this thread.


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Old Post Jan 17th, 2008 05:08 AM
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"Id"
The Man of Tomorrow

Gender: Unspecified
Location: Diablo Corps

Well there are plenty of threads discussing Phoenix, especially the events that happened in “Here Comes Tomorrow”. I mean off the top of my mind you have Original Phoenix Respect Thread and even the recent WC Phoenix runs a mini DC gauntlet! .

I guess we should just take, Mr. M’s response here, as a form of brining a perspective over Phoenix. But there is no reason, why Me or GS would write our own for informative reasons.

As long as, the flow of information is not broken and a heated debate is not incited. I see no harm done right?


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Last edited by "Id" on Jan 18th, 2008 at 05:42 PM

Old Post Jan 18th, 2008 05:35 PM
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"Id"
The Man of Tomorrow

Gender: Unspecified
Location: Diablo Corps

Disclaimer: I can provide most of the material posted by myself. So if anyone wishes to read over a certain issue. Simply PM me.

And so, I will post most of New X-Men #154 (not all …No Cover, introduction, and questioners for you >_< ) since recent rules forbid me to post an entire comic book. Reason for this is, I simply isolate, and cut out specific parts to explain myself. I don’t want you to get the wrong idea, of any quote or scan manipulation is taking place. So, the entire image can be used here as back reference.

Now I feel the need to explain myself, since I am the one claiming White Phoenix of the Crown amputated the future a reality (which was 616, which later becomes 15104) and manifested 616 Universe on the palm of her hand. I will also take my time, and break a few mythos regarding Phoenix in “Here Comes Tomorrow”.

New X-Men #154 “Here Comes Tomorrow” Part 3.
http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/...nv115402qe5.jpg
http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/...nv115403bm1.jpg
http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/...nv115404vz7.jpg
http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/...nv115405og5.jpg
http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/...nv115406zd1.jpg
http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/...nv115407la8.jpg
http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/...nv115408ik5.jpg
http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/...nv115409qo4.jpg
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/...nv115410bf7.jpg
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/...nv115411gu7.jpg
http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/...nv115412lb7.jpg
http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/...nv115413rh8.jpg
http://img260.imageshack.us/img260/...nv115414hy4.jpg
http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/...nv115415fm0.jpg
http://img260.imageshack.us/img260/...nv115416xe4.jpg
http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/...nv115417la6.jpg
http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/...nv115418cq1.jpg
http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/...nv115419mp1.jpg
http://img260.imageshack.us/img260/...nv115420sf3.jpg
http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/...nv115421ah0.jpg
http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/...nv115422hm0.jpg
http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/...nv115423ho8.jpg


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Old Post Jan 18th, 2008 07:33 PM
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Neo Darkhalen
Mission zero

Gender: Male
Location:

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Just a few, if you like them, then I shall post more...allot more

Old Post Jan 18th, 2008 08:14 PM
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"Id"
The Man of Tomorrow

Gender: Unspecified
Location: Diablo Corps

Here Comes Tomorrows

Ah the much alluded, and controversial occurrences of “Here Comes Tomorrow”. Its where two of Phoenix Feats takes place, ironically its also a topic that stems a much heated debate (I am sure you have seen it from time to time). Well I am such a nice guy, you can download issues 150-155 along with Official Mutant Files and The Official Handbook to Alternate Realities”. [/]Here[/].



Note: Please keep in mind that, when a reality is diverged from its time line it becomes an alternate/parallel reality from its breeching point (the point from where, an action to took place to alter the future). Before the event adjustment, it’s was the chronological future. After the even adjustment, it sprouts a different future. So I encourage the followings.

(1) - Have a basic understanding, of how future of a reality, can become an alternate reality (because it can get complicated).

(2) - I STRONGLY encourage, members to pre-read New X-Men 150-155, and use the bio to supplement (not override) the comic’s depiction.


Significance of the material I provided [/]Here[/].
New X-Men 150 - It marks the first appearance “Here Comes Tomorrow” arc, taking place 150 years into the future.
New X-Men 151-154 - The bulk happenings and occurrences takes place. Along with the “Event Adjustment“, at the end of 154. Where the past is altered, so the future never comes to be.
New X-Men 155 - The Epilogue sort of speak. You do find Grant Morrison short answer and explanation in the questionnaire at the vary last page.
The Official Hand Book of the Marvel Universe “Alternate Realities” - you will find one page, dedicated to “Here Comes Tomorrow”.
X-Men: Messiah Complex “Mutant Files” - You will find the most recent Official bio, over 616 Phoenix.


So if you think I am manipulating the context, just DL and back reference the uncorrupted material.


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Old Post Jan 22nd, 2008 05:24 PM
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