you said inconsistant writing. i brought up the many times hairyboy has been shot and sniped before.
frank shot him with a rocket launcher several blocks away. his smell isn't THAT strong. don't even bring that up. and wolverine beng sniped several times before (and once even on Punisher volume2) speaks for itself.
and you never brought up a single instances. All you stated was that he been shot before , stabbed and so forth. No one saying he has not. Whats im sayign is for logan to be caught unaware that a person that he met before and is hunting is able to shoot him unaware with utterly no reason is pis.
Just like spidermans spider sense not going off in that instant or DD radar senses.
It was not that far away you can tell by the picture. Also his smell is that strong. The examples that I brought up are far beyond a few blocks in range. Logan should have and could have smell him. DD should have and could have heard him. Spiderman spider senses should have gone off.
Also a rocket launcher would make a shit load of noise and would be easy for some one of his reflexes to evade.
...........Not by an opponet he met and was tracking.
as for the second one. How surprizing that in another punisher comic Logans super senses are again neglacted. At least in the instances Logan was tracking another individual and not punisher.
Oh and why do low showings now the norm again?
also did not wolverine put down punisher in that very arc with a glancign blow?
What if Frank just fines Leech and have him null Wolverines healing factor. What would happen to Wolverine didn't have his healing factor and still had adamantium in his body?
No its not Wolverine is shopping and Bucky shots him with a sniper gun.
That was before his HF upgrade and Wolverine does not have an uber HF anymore, so no it didnt neglect anything. Hell by the time Punisher got up to him the wound had already healed!!!
pay attention to what you're saying, man.
you say yourself that wolverine has been shot and stabbed in the past by other characters (and even admit that sometimes it was with him looking at them) and say its PIS if Frank does it.
i already prooved earlier that spidey's senses only go off once the danger presents itself. the people pointed their guns at spidey and his senses didn't go off. it was only once they opened fire that the senses went off.
Also DD and Spidey escaped from teh rocket launcher. and they did it because their respective senses warned them. wolverine was being a dumbass as sat there trying to figure out what Frnak meant by "suckers". and got blown apart.
and it is isn't pis since others have sniped, shot and blown him apart before too. Bucky is one. also notice that frank didn't snipe him in the link Phantom provided. he just shot him from nearby with an assault rifle. his senses haven't done wonders for him as you say. there was another case in ultimate x-men when he was hit by a rocket launcher.
all you're doing is help me prove how much of a curbstomp Punisher vs these three really was. cheers
~Sado
Last edited by Sado22 on Feb 21st, 2008 at 03:25 PM
Wrong. Bucky was the one Logan was tracking,but he not the one that shoot wolverine which you would know if you read the issue.......
I ment to say senses which I editted,but you must have begun your post before I had the chance to edit it.
Also for the time period which was the 90's that was a low showing for logans healing factor and damage soaking abilities.
Logan healing factor was only down graded by a few years. Thats still well beyond punisher damage out put.
Logan has shown to withstand being eaten and also blown up twice.
Theres not that many and there reason given why he was unable to detect them.
Not to mention Logans senses have only increased over time.
I mean currently in wolverine 62. He found mistyc in 8 and haft hours. He had no idea were she was in the entire world and it only took him 8 and haft hours. Thats how good his senses are and his tracking ability
eaten? i would love to see what teeth can do to adamantium.
that also applies to being blown up. there was a time when he was incinerated too during civil war.
we all know that. the fact remains that not only does punisher know all but he can keep wolverine down long enough..........like he HAS. and i'm getting tired of prooving events that already happened. you have anything besides a hissyfit to offer in your defense cuz this is getting tedious. just admit wolverine has nothing on Frank and that Frank has pwned him everytime they came across the other. and THAT is what matters.
I know what I am saying. It not the fact frank shot him that’s the problem. It the fact that Logan was caught by surprise when he was look for frank……..sorry, but wolverine senses were ignore. He should have known frank was in the area and were he was easily. He also would have heard the rocket a mile away.
Those times I admit Logan got stab or shot. He was not looking for some one and then got shot completely unaware even though he has super senses and knows there scent. Also if you did not realize this Logan lets him self be shot…….it quite common of him. He could dodge the fire, but why bother when he knows it won’t put him down. You be hard press to find a comic were Logan attempts to dodge gun fire and is it. When Logan attempts to dodge gun fire he does.
No you did not. You actually proved to be completely ignorant of Spiderman’s abilities. Hell you would not even respond to my original post of your thoughts of how Spiderman’s spider sense works. You go “look at his venom fights”. That was by far the worst example you could provided. Every Spiderman read knows dam well that Spiderman’s Spider sense does not work on venom or carnage and that one of the reasons there such a threat.
No the entire point of the spider senses is to tell him when danger is around.
Becauses there was no danger prior to that. That was also spiderman from a while back. Spiderman from that punisher arc had far more advance spider sense. For example during civil war spiderman was able to tell that there were missles in the area prior to them be fired. Spiderman has also on many occasions new when danger would appear prior to the attack. The whole point of spider senses is to give spiderman knowledge of an attack before it happens.
Please don’t spout bull shit. First of all neither one stated there senses went off.
Second of all neither warned wolverine
And third Logan ahs super human senses also.
Ya and it was out of character……..Like ive been saying……..they were written down to be idiots.
Not when he was tracking them. He has never been caught unaware by an enemy he was fallowing unless a reason was given.
Shot and blown apart because he never attempted to dodge and he was fine.
If Logan does not want to be shoot he won’t be.
The only time Bucky has shot Logan was when Logan was fighting capt and Logan even implied that he new Bucky was there………and it was part of his plan……..
Ya in another Punisher comic how wonderful. Which continue to neglect that he has super human senses.
Also Logan was not tracking Punisher he was fallowing some one else……so it quite irrelevant and is simply a low showing for him.
We don’t go by low showings here or pis ones which you love to use.
Key word ultimate.
You have not proven any thing. Actaully I have shown over and over again how much PIS was presented in that issue.
By the way Logan was not even KO.
……….It can still do stuff to the skinn, muscles, organs and so forth………not to mention the stomack acid……….or the fact that the monster consumed mutant energy………
Wait a sec you think were debating civil war wolverine?
If you do this is sad. Logan from around the civil war time would stomp the ever living shit out of frank and there be nothing frank could due.
we all know that. the fact remains that not only does punisher know all [/B][/QUOTE]
……are you serous? Punisher knows all? Logan is punishers superior in military combat, and training. Before punisher was born he was running special forces missions……
Here the thing he can’t. Give his current armory and only having an hour of prep he not going to get any heavy duty weaponry that would put Logan down.
When did he do this again? You mean during that PIS filled comic? Ya here the thing Logan was not even put down he was still awake.
Here the thing you have no proved any thing.
Funny thing is punisher has not pwned wolverine.
You have that pis filled comic which have proven completely ignores Spiderman’s and wolverines powers and abilities. It also gave them the intellect of a 5 year old and still Logan was never put down.
Then you have the ennis comic were punisher shoots Logan in the nuts. Funny little thing is that was a low showing for Logan and prior to upgrades to healing factor. Logan ahs suffer far worse pain then being shoot in the nuts and kept fighting…….hell he been shot in the nuts and could still fight. Also punisher won via plot device of a steam roller which he won’t have here. Also as I recall Logan was never even KO.
So all you have is a PIS filled comic in which Logan was never taken down.
And you have one were punisher needed the use of a plot device.
Now you said frank has pwn Logan every time?
Are you forgetting that during war journals if not mistaken Logan KO punisher with a simple glancing blow…..in the very arc that punisher shot logan in the leg.
Oh and then there most recent fight in Wolverine 186 were Logan states and the author states that Wolverines last fight with the punisher was the time involving the steam roller which means that the PIS filled comic were punisher takes Wolverine, Spiderman and Dare Devil was recon not to have happen.
Oh in that issue punisher goes all out verse wolverine who toying with him. In the end Punisher winds up on the ground unable to move and wolverine throws a magazine at his face and pretty much calls him gay.
Last edited by Dum Dum Dugan on Feb 21st, 2008 at 05:16 PM
Lol thats neither here nor there. I never said Wolverine was hunting Bucky the point is that Wolverine did not detect him, oh and for your information Bucky amsked his scent with ink, but you know what I dont think that makes a difference because ink gives off a scent anyway.
Note how DD hears it but only just in time. Yeah he would have heard the missle going off but not neccarily Frank before he fired the missle. DDs senses have limitations. Here he has to concentrate to detect Frank 6 blocks away. (6 blocks up and two over, 6 up two across)
……are you serous? Punisher knows all? Logan is punishers superior in military combat, and training. Before punisher was born he was running special forces missions……[/quote]
did you hear me say civil war you idiot. i'm just mentioning the one time he got incinerated. we're obviously debating current wolverine which is why i said half healing factor.
but he didn't. the same way he didn't hear the several other gunshots coming his way in other comicbooks.
perfect. now you're really making an ass out of yourself. make up your damn mind man.
this guy posted the pics there. unless you're going to tell me that that was also pis. address the issue i mentioned with spidey and the guns or just shut up.
just like the claymores that wouldn't go off cuz they werent. are you contradicting yourself agian?
this isn't powerrangers man. they don't name everything that they do. also use your head. they were shown jumping before Frank even fired the damn rocket.
all good. but you're not answering MY question.
which have never been stated to be of a particular level. and considering that logan NEVER heard a gunshot coming before............it probably means that he cant.
phantom posted pics saying otherwise. there is also one where he gets shot in the eye by somebody.
what kind of an excuse is that anyway? he was tracking someone so his ears automatically shut down.
......funny how THIS isn't pis!
sure, considering htat logan's being put down with gunshots recently.
oh and here's a thought:
exactly what have YOU proven thus far aside from your shameful fanboysim. at least i've brought proof for everything i've said. what's your excuse? you love short hairy guys with an inferiority complex?
Please just stop butchering the issue you’re reverencing. You do it far to much. You should really stop commenting on issues you have never even read.
Wolverine Origins & Endings issue 39: is what you have been referring to, but complete butchering what had occurred. This really does not aid in your argument. Logan tracks down winter solider however winter solder knows he coming and prepares. Logan tracks him to a ware house were Logan gets sniped in the head, by an associate of winter solider, not winter soldier and Logan was not expecting him to have company. Logan enter the were houses which ends up being an ink factory……..and winter soldier have cover him self in ink……. So please do not attempt to inform me on an issue you have never read, but I own and have read many times.
How does this in any way shape or form help your argument? Logan new the guy was there, but there are far more pressing concerns when your leading a team and there are many opponents far more powerful then old sculpthunter. There no way for Logan who was battle powerful mutants and barking orders to know that sculphuner would aim for him.
So please don’t use irrelevant events as if they apply here. Punishers not going to have the aid of powerful mutants and have Logan barking order to his team.
Making excuses for what? Logan got dropped by a bullet that bounced around his brain whoopy. The odds of punisher achieving such a feat are slim to known. Even worse due to the fact Logan knows he facing punisher in the warehouse and there no were punisher can hide from Logan’s senses.
Logan’s never been ambush at all really and when he has there was a reason given. I love how you say billions of times when you hate wolverine and don’t read him.
How does this aid your argument? The issue that you are supporting Frank was only 30 feet away at best.
Meaning even going by this scan DD would have sensed him. Also they were searching for Frank witch further proves this issue to be PIS since DD knows Franks heart beat and could have simply tracked in the same manner he did here. Also the arc in which this comic comes from is the same arc in which DD had trouble with is senses and honing onto targets due to being darker or some such. So this is rather a bad example.
Here what spider senses does. At it basic’s and this is prior to the advances it has gotten. So yes he would have sensed the attack before it happen and it was PIS that he did not. http://img263.imageshack.us/my.php?...42ss1rs0an6.jpg
That’s speculation. There’s no evidence to suggest his healing factor was down graded that much. It was only down Graded a few years making it still extremely powerful.
Wolverine 62: gets caught in a huge explosion and gets up and walks out of it.
You are referring to that other punisher comic.
The one were Logan is tracking some one else and punisher shots him for no reason? Great argument you have there. It complete irrelevant since Logan was not going after punisher, so there be no reason to aspect an assault on him by punisher.
Not to mention it simply a low showing and from a punisher comic no doubt, what a surprise.
Are you slow or something? I made my point clearly, but I guess I have to rephrase it for one such as your self to understand.
Logan has been shot, stab and even blown up. This is all true. Logan however during those times did not attempt to dodge the fire. When he does attempt to dodge the fire he does. Also in these scenarios Logan is never taken by surprise by the individual he is tracking and on the off chance he does get taken by surprise, there are stated reasons behind it. In the punisher case the writer simply wrote Logan as a dumb ass and completely ignored his superhuman senses through out the story arc. They also ignore Spiderman’s intellect and spider sense time and again.
This was your responses to me saying this
And some how I am the idiot. No matter how low my expectations for your post are, you always show that you can go even lower.
But hell I am a good sport so I will answer your response even though it had no relevance’s to what I had said.
It should have warned him prior to the firing of the bullets.
Actaully it almost always is stated when there powers are used to senses something. Also in such a scenario with other hero’s there it would have been stated.
They were looking around they did not senses danger which is PIS. Also you are contradicting your self. You stated that Spiderman’s spider sense does not go off until the guns are fired. Now you are trying to tell me that Spiderman moved from the rough top prior to Frank firing the rocket due to his spider sense.
It was a PIS event that ignored the three characters abilities to sense punisher with out giving a valid reason or a reason at all.
They have been stated as superhuman.
They have also along with his reflexes allow him to view bullets in slow motion stated in the Weapon X novel.
No he did not. Please show me were he posted a scan of Logan tracking some one and they ambush him.
Ya he gets shot in the eye while fighting a bunch of super beings. Some thing that Frank won’t have on his side.
Why would that be PIS again? Logan has a healing factor which would sustain him and enhanced durability.
By a very high power sniper rifle that shot a very high caliber bullet that designed to kill the person were ever they get shot pretty much. Night crawler got hit by one in the shoulder and almost died.
And it was a shot that went through the eye into the brain and bounced around the skill.
Sorry, but the odds of punisher aiming a hit like that is ridiculously low almost if nto non existent.
Really and would prove have you bought forth again? Oh the single issue of absolute PIS which ive proven complete ignored characters powers and intellectual abilities.
Nice nice evidence champ. That also was one source ive post multiable sources.
Oh and by the way your whole argument is based of that one PIS issue which I already proved to be reconnt and completely ignored.
In Wolverine 186 it states that punisher and wolverines “last encounter ended with the mutant crushed under a steam roller” Funny little thing is that the issue you presented was written after and was to take place after the encounter were Punisher left a steam roller on Wolverine. Which means the issue you presented was recount and ignore as if it never happen.
So actually the only “prove” you have presented is not even cannon and was reconnt.
Also in Wolverine 186 Logan beats Punisher and leaves him helpless on the ground.
All your inane arguments result in one thing: "You have a very biased view of who Wolverine is and what Wolverine can do."
Because bottom-line, the way you hold up Wolverine on a pedestal, no way should he get clobbered by Spiderwoman, or by Cap, or by Spiderman, or by Punisher, or by Daredevil, or by Gorgon, or by Sabretooth, or by Wildchild, or by X-23, or by Daken, or by the Wrecker, or by Namor, or by USAgent, or by Deadpool, or by Cyber, or by Bucky, or by Scalphunter...
... and yet, he does... ALL the time. And the examples I just gave? All in the last couple of years. I don't even have to dig through his past. Give it up. You're convincing only yourself because it suits your predilections towards short hairy comic book characters. If you don't like Ennis, that's fine. At the same time, you don't like Bendis, Millar, Claremont, Austen, Morrison, Loeb, Way and pretty much every other Marvel writer there at the House of Ideas. Have fun reading Marvel comics with your eyes closed and your mind shut out to the fact that Wolverine has been punked before. He's been punched, he's been kicked, he's been batted, he's been slapped, he's been clonked, he's been shot, he's been sniped, he's been sliced, he's been diced, he's been rocketed, he's been shield tossed, he's been webbed, he's been ambushed, he's been blown up, he's been tranq'ed, he's been duck-bombed, he's been steam rolled, he's been stabbed with his own claws. Nuff said.
this gets my choice for "dumbest post ever".
whose with me?
you forgot wolverine couldn't identify the brand for the aftershave
you of course. look at this:
so wait...you bring this up as proof agaisnst another spiderman issue that I was talking about. so basically what you say is canon and everything else is PIS or inaccurate.
the pic posted showed spidey surrounded by guns and his senses didn't go off. they went off WHEN THEY OPENED FIRE. notice also that his senses go off if he isn't looking at the danger.
flashforward Punisher volume4. spideramn is standing looking at the claymores which would only blow up once he moves. techincally speaking as the issue i was talking about before shows, his senses would only work once he moves and the claymores are detonated.
as for spiderman's intelligence.......what does that have to do with anything considering he knows that frank is a killer and that frank is defending himself.
it was cutscene kind of thing. wolverine says "suckers". the next panel spiderman and daredevil are in the air, escaping.
and stop acting like you're a writer for marvel. dumbass.
as for the pics you posted....goodjob. did you notice what was written there. he said "wind from our back (sniff sniff)"
he smelt the person ONLY cuz the wind carried the scent TO him. just like animals do. now i could tell you exactly how predators like wolves hunt but i'll summarize it by telling you that they use the wind. the same way the wind got carried to wolverine with the person's scent.
now you want to know why it didn't work with frank? simple:
-they were in rundown area
-there was no wind
-frank was too damn far
-and the since there were a lot of buildings
and lastly, using your own twisted logic against you, wolverine was reading the letter and not foucsing
i'm sorry if he can't dodge ordinary bullets shot by superhuman beings
even considering his special sniper training program? your out of your mind.
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Feb 21st, 2008 01:26 PM
